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The Anti-Religionator: read with an open mind...



In response to this post of mine: edit: Hah!! Its been deleted! So I guess there are plenty of people who can't handle any anti-religious commentary here tongue.gif Well tough s*** because it's not going anywhere, if people can link to Christian sites in their signatures and proclaim their messages of faith (i.e. atempting to enforce their beliefs on others, the classic religious bully-boy tactic) then I can damn well do the same.


Anyway - in response to a post I made about religions being handy tax-gathering devices for fearful `customers`, a member here PM'ed me with this link: http://www.wayofthemaster.com/


He invited me to take the test in the bottom right of the page, which I did.

The test blew me away: I had no idea that people could be so damned stupid to be cowed by this insanely glib, unreasoned, irrational rhetoric.


So I replied with some of my own - and here it is:


This is gonna rile some people up, so bear in mind it is my opinion even if it does simply fly in the face of all that you hold dear. I would dearly like to upset as many Christians as possible to be honest, because only then is there a chance, a chance that they might start thinking about things instead of merely obeying their imaginary lords & masters.


My background is that I was a Catholic church attendee until I was 12, I even served at church the whole time. I talk a lot with my Father, who is a Deacon in the Catholic church and is finishing his Master's degree in Theology this year.


I disagree with him completely in terms of belief, but in deference to the old guy I have at least used Capitals for all the words that Christians seem to think deserve them tongue.gif


Now, the way religions actually work is this: because we do not know where the universe came from, we don't know what was around before it, we don't know what happens when we die we feel uncertainty and fear in a most profound and immediate way.

This a bit scary, so we invent stories to comfort at least our children, if not ourselves, because we can instill in them answers to questions that haven't been thought of yet, so having the information to reference as soon as these questions are first pondered by children; as they reach adolescence; makes the kids in question pre-wired to believe that they have the truth of knowledge within them.

This is how and why most religious people are trapped by their beliefs, not having ever been given the opportunity to think for themselves.


I know a lot of people discover religion later in life, most of these people were already brought up, however loosely, with at least a particular religion, and often the same one that they `discover` later on. Most of the rest do it out of fear of death, to put it bluntly.



Christianity shares a lot of the basis of its beliefs, rituals and practices with an ancient religion called Zoroastrianism, which was largely the same deal about God being so damned awesome that no-one and nothing was allowed to be worshipped but him. See the first 4 commandments for similarities (incidentally I find it highly suspicious that God, being so damned awesome, required FOUR out of only TEN bloody commandments i.e. almost half of 'em laugh.gif to make his point about no-one being allowed to do anything but kiss his *albatross* wink.gif ). Also Zoroaster, the prophet upon which the Zoroastrianism religion is based, dished out a lot of spiel about saviours being born of virgins etc.

Judaism is largely derived from Zoroastrianism, Christianity largely derived from Judaism. Now which one is correct?


Did the the Zoroastrians hit the nail on the head 3000+ years ago?

Are Jews all correct then, or indeed now?

What happens to them when they die - they are worshipping a different (albeit only vaguely different in the case of the Jews) God?

They're breaking 3 bloody commandments - and what's worse is that they're sticking by their decision!! Uh-oh - its the fiery lake for the lot of 'em!!!



For that matter, what about the Muslims? Here's where you really hit a problem because they worship a single god but they'll be damned if they'll accept that its the same as your Christian all-powerful being, so who is right?

Christians say the same thing but, its funny y'know, but both Christians AND Muslims both believe that THEY ARE CORRECT. Crazy huh? I guess one massive group of billions of people is going to go into the fiery pits of hell for getting it wrong. Oopsy daisy!!


Here a well-meaning and well-indoctrinated Christian would say that the pits of hell are not really a problem for anyone who believes and repents against their sin. Well, actually, thats exactly what Muslims are not doing because they will call the first 3 Christian commandments at the very least a load of complete BS thereby sinning rather a great deal, and therefore they are not repenting, and therefore they are not going to get a taste of Christian paradise.

Maybe they'll get their Muslim paradise for being good Muslims, however, but that leaves all you Christians rapidly in `le creek de la merde` without so much as a paddle to your name. This is one of them there dichotomies, and its one that no religion has an answer for.


Two religions both exclude each other's validiy on the basis of this belief, which menas that one at least is completely and utterly wrong. If one of them is right, then, that means that EVERY OTHER RELIGION CANNOT ALSO BE CORRECT Ergo: they are all not correct, ergo: they are based on lies, or at least on bad guesses, except the `one` that has it right. But what about the majority - because the sum of all religions pitted against any one other religion is gonna make up the majority of humans on the planet - will have it wrong, will not repent because they believe themselves to be right, so god - the all-loving God - will see the MAJORITY of his much-loved children burn in eternal fires.


What a total c**t!!!!???




And this is just point one of my multi-point plan. Keep reading....


Hinduism has a whole host of gods, who Christians will say are just the different faces of the same god, and Hindus may still get into heaven because although they worship different facets of the true God, they still worship him in their own way.


Wanna know what Hindus think? They think they can shove your one god up your behind and go to the fiery pit yourself for belittling their mighty religion. Ya know what, thats what all religious people say when someone comes and claims that another religion is correct, although these days Christians at least use fewer torture chambers and mass executions to make our points known wink.gif


And I know the argument defending the; for want of a more politically-correct term; MASS MURDERS COMMITTED BY THE CHRISTIAN CHURCH here too: "we furthered our own understanding of our religion, and as we did we removed the elements of it that were wrong" (waging war on Islam- a la the Crusades, mass torturings- a la the Spanish inquisition, mass ridicule of all quests for actual knowledge instead of guessing (wrongly) all the laws behind the physical world- a la almost all opposition to science before Darwin got it right about human history) and you know what?

It sickens me.

It sickens me how Christianity has the sheer brazen *fruitcage* ing cahonas to tell people that "ooh, we were wrong about something, but its okay because we're right about everything again now, honest. No, its not like last time, we've got it right now. Honest. TRUST us" dry.gif


Biggest load of bo****ks? When Christianity realised that they couldn't make people believe in the Old Testament, they just DENIED IT. The whole *fruitcage*-ing thing.

Christianity now basically denies the Old Testament, instead saying that it is a useful teaching aid to get people to understand the message of God.

But of course the New Testament is true, because, well, without it there is no Christian religion. Of course the New testament is true, after all, its nothing like the Old one now, is it? Its New.



I think Christianity is on VERY thin ground, myself.



Now the real way that religions wotk, as I first mentioned, is this: They scare you by playing on your fear of death, your fear of life, your fear of the unknown, and your fear of suffering by inventing rules that will apparently grant you the answers to the questions, and the means with which to avoid all unpleasantness. Coincidentally these rules combat most of your biological drives.

Actually its no coincidence: - this is the way and the reason that religions actually work. Listen very carefully:


You are told that one way to avoid eternal hellfire and suffering (hellfire and suffering that you didn't even KNOW about until you were told by Christianity that they were a problem, hmm, funny that, another "coincidence" perhaps.... wink.gif ) is to obey a law against adultery, for example.

Fair enough, treat others as you would wish to be treated (I didn't say ALL the bible's teachings are useless, this on is a good guideline for living life. Because it is a good guideline it is something that lends plausibility to Christianity, but also actually betrays its true identity as a masquerade; a false God in itself that is designed to appear plausible in enough ways to make you accept the implausible without question).

But most religions go so far as to make even THINKING about the other sex (apart from your wife/husband: relationships permitting but only those sanctified by god, of course rolleyes.gif ) as bad as going around having sex with everyone in sight!!

Wow, talk about a catch-all clause. In this case Human Beings would not even exist if were not for `adultery` in the eyes of the Commandments, not having the wish to go and have sex would make us totally redundant as a species. Men are designed to be adulterous!!! We are genetically disposed to inseminate many women so that we have a good chance of fathering enough progeny to survive ourselves through familial support and achieve the only kind of `everlasting life` that is actually feasible by continuing our bloodline - religion goes against the one single thing that we CAN worship as the true creator of our world: our sex drives.

Sex is better than God, for without it you really would not exist.


Now this commandment makes Christians very tense, very conflicted, very bound up in an internal struggle and THEN your bible tells you that to follow its teachings and restrain yourself from committing `adultery` will give you salvation. With so much of your willpower and thoughts devoted to fighting this internal drive that made you what you are today (literally) you will be far more easy to convince of many other spurious beliefs and ideas that also only serve to further indoctrinate you into believing what is, at the end of the day, a story.


A good story.


But simply a story, nonetheless.




In specific reply to the guy who asked me to look at that website:


Religions lead their followers, followers follow their leaders. Seems to me the place to be is as one of the leaders, I guess thats what the website you mentioned wants you to think too: spread the word, entice others into Christianity - TAKE SOME OF THE POWER FOR YOURSELF. No wonder it is appealing.


I fully understand what the bible can teach and that the morals are helpful, and that if everyone obeyed them then the world would be a far, far better place.

That doesn't make it any less wrong, however. What I find most offensive about all religions is that they have the sheer bloody arrogance to tell people that they KnOW HOW THE WORLD GOT HERE. That they KNOW THERE IS A GOD. That they have the cheek, the goddamned *fruitcage* ing AUDACITY to tell me that what THEY have `worked out` (read: heard from some guy with a bigger beard and trendier sandals) what is correct when answering the most important questions human beings have ever contemplated! Without giving anyone time to think of their own answers! The bloody nerve!!


I will never listen to the opinion of someone who tells anyone what to think - especially about the Big Questions -; organised religion is like a organised crime or a dictatorship in this respect, no matter how benevolent the actual content of this opinion.



I haven't forgotten how lavish the Vatican is, and I haven't forgotten how much money all churches around the world take from their servants every week. I know that you (the guy who PM'ed me) don't believe in this practice, but any religion commanding hundreds of millions of people who do believe in that AND DON'T *fruitcage* ING TELL THEM THEY DON'T HAVE TO is basically as evil an institution as the IRS, or the stalking through the accounts of your dead relatives & claiming their pound of flesh at every turn; as evil as the Mafia enforcing their `protection` rackets; as heinous as Nestle and their powdered baby milk scam throughout Africa: parishioners across the planet are like the helpless children in Africa, the beaten-up shopkeepers and business people, and the bereaved and burgled next-of-kin standing beside whatever they hold dear as it is gradually replaced with fear, poverty, helplessness or all three.


What annoys me more than anything, of course, is that without organised religions there would be so few nightmares and terrors and hellish spectres in the minds of the average person.

The night was just an abscence of darkness, until religion peopled it with the guilt-driven demons of judgement.


**In specific reply to the guy that sponsored this question**


I know you will think that many of these points do not affect you because you believe only in what you want from the bible, but you are doing the exact same thing that you accuse others of doing in taking the parts that YOU feel are right and are simply IGNORING THE INCONVENIENT ONES.


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Yeah that did kinda wind me up too wink.gif but as I said I've been developing my own beliefs for a few years now and I was just looking for an excuse to condense most of them into one litany of abuse rofl.gif


Thing is that, now, the most insidious thing about Christianity is that they no longer argue any points on which their faith is based, seeing as they now know that it simply can't be done, so they have exalted the word `faith` itself to such a level that it insinuates that anyone without faith - Christian faith at that - is inferior and deserves to be pitied, but not listened to.


This is the worst kind of denial and is designed specifically to infuriate logic, its adopted almost universally by all thinking Christians because they know it is their last intellectual refuge where debate cannot even be entered into, because the inferior `faithless` people have no right to even debate it with them as they have no faith of their own (no `proper` faith, anyway), or that their thoughts and words are tainted and not valid in any discussion. If you talk about proof they adopt that wan smile as if to say "I know I have won now because I just have to use the `F` word!" dry.gif


Now thats the very height of lame.


But anyway, I digress, again tongue.gif Glad to have provided an entertaining read.


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one of the many reasons im now an ex'christian. too much ######s about everything. i had to sit through the funeral of one of my closest freinds, and possibly the nicest person i've ever known, and listen to some old tart prattle on about how "he'll be safe now...". ######s will he. you're just lying through your teeth... >_>


couldnt read all of it, as too much text hurts my eyes etm (need an eye test/glasses) but i agree with most points.

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Yup, the concept of `heaven` is basically nothing but a comfort blanket for the bereaved, and a way of subconsciously spanking the cowed masses into working their arses off for some alledged and intangible reward. I'm all for doing good deeds and being comfortable with yourself as a morally rounded person, but to do it for some beard in the sky who, not incidentally, requires complete and total loyalty (and tax benefits) from you? Pffff.


The nasty thing about the idea of heaven is that, well, wouldn't you want to believe in them going to a better place? Wouldn't that be, in fact, the perfect thing to console a bereaved person with?


Isn't that just soooo bloody convenient??


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Just a choice quote taken from literature I took off the Jehovah's witness guy that had the cheek to knock on my door today, so he would go away :


"If more people practiced versions of what the Jehovah's Witnesses preach and practice, the holocaust could have been prevented and genocide would scourge the world no more"


*beep*, to think it would have been that easy rolleyes.gif

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I wouldn't even waste my time trying to talk with Jehovah's witnesses any more, only because they don't know how to communicate properly - they do not listen to the views of others wink.gif


They seriously don't even have the social skills to hold normal conversations man; they only ever wait to talk 'cause they never actually listen to the other person; they do not address anything you actually mention or try to debate with 'em, instead prattling through their own little agenda regardless of the fact that you are invariably trying to talk about something they mentioned themselves anyway; and when it comes to genuine politeness and courtesy they have about the same social grace as the crusted s*** on the hooves of a musth elephant biggrin.gif


That, and of course the fact that they're acting like c***s smile.gif If I went knocking on doors trying to impose MY religious beliefs on people I would not only be the subject of 5 years hate-mail to the local press, but would probably have an ASBO slapped on me for upsetting `the community` wink.gif



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