elchinator Posted January 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 For someone like me who has over 1/3 of my collection as Hk's this could be a real pita, and what of the new ICS split gearbox MP5s? You know the "highlander priciple"? Only one can survive... Umarex said -officialy- that they will only sell cheap airsoft guns for the beginning. Sometime, probably second quarter of 2008, there should be another line of higher quality guns. It could be from ICS, maybe CA or even G&G. It will most certainly not be from Marui, VFC, Tanaka or Tanio Koba... someone included CA in the list.. I think that CA should be removed... Ala the B&T range of gear that they make. True... But that only counts for the MP5 range from CA. For the moment. It is somewhat unclear, how those licensing rights interfere. Link to post Share on other sites
Nox Invictus Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Rob15, what would it be a PITA for those who already own H&K airsoft guns? What're they gonna do, try to take 'em from me? Literally, they can do that over my dead body. Link to post Share on other sites
Sarge133 Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 So is this just going to effect Europe? Or will it be seen over here in America? This may put a dent in my plan to buy a KSC USP.45 and potentially an MP5. Anyways, BOYCOTT UMAREX! Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Rob15, what would it be a PITA for those who already own H&K airsoft guns? What're they gonna do, try to take 'em from me? Literally, they can do that over my dead body. Won't be a problem for anyone who already has them, but for people like me who lust after a new G3 or MP5 every day then i can say bye bye to that for a while. Link to post Share on other sites
Nox Invictus Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Won't be a problem for anyone who already has them, but for people like me who lust after a new G3 or MP5 every day then i can say bye bye to that for a while. Very true. I myself was looking into a KSC USP .45. I'd rather not have my plans FUBAR'd by some Cybergun-alike company. Capitalism: the rape and pillage of our sport and the natural world. Link to post Share on other sites
Fin Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Capitalism: the rape and pillage of our sport and the natural world. SIGGED! Link to post Share on other sites
Stealthbomber Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Umarex are just a middle-man. Exactly the same as Cybergun or even UTG. Never understood why everybody bleats about Cybergun while, at the same time, singing the praises of Umarex and UTG. Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Another point though, are they going to take on the sale of spares (slides, metal bodies etc), accessories (torch foregrips for MP5s, stocks) and other bits like mags for any Hk guns? Link to post Share on other sites
snorkelman Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 lemme see umarex get a kicking as being the evil one threatening poor airsoft manufacturers Same poor airsoft manufacs who were complacent enough to let it happen. How many years now have marui ICS and CA made HK variants? Would it not have been urm smart business practice (competitors or not) to have clubbed together formed an IP company and bought these rights, splitting the costs involved proportionally between them based on units of each HK designs produced to that date each, and agreeing a fixed fee per unit amongst themselves for future production rather than wait for someone to hoover them up? They've made good money producing those guns Id have thought it in their own interest to safeguard their business.. If someone pitched a funfair on your families land for free without so much as a by your leave, then saw the land bought up from under them and an eviction notice issued would your family be to blame for disapointing their 5 and 6 year old visitors or would it be their responsiblity for having been so tight arsed over not paying a rent/making an offer for the land in the first place? boycotts arent exactly all that effective if you arent currently buying any of the companies products, seeing as they flog a lot of tat Id reckon most folks on here will have been 'boycotting' umarex (by default) for years. Link to post Share on other sites
liquidflorian Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 lemme see umarex get a kicking as being the evil one threatening poor airsoft manufacturers Same poor airsoft manufacs who were complacent enough to let it happen. How many years now have marui ICS and CA made HK variants? Would it not have been urm smart business practice (competitors or not) to have clubbed together formed an IP company and bought these rights, splitting the costs involved proportionally between them based on units of each HK designs produced to that date each, and agreeing a fixed fee per unit amongst themselves for future production rather than wait for someone to hoover them up? They've made good money producing those guns Id have thought it in their own interest to safeguard their business.. If someone pitched a funfair on your families land for free without so much as a by your leave, then saw the land bought up from under them and an eviction notice issued would your family be to blame for disapointing their 5 and 6 year old visitors or would it be their responsiblity for having been so tight arsed over not paying a rent/making an offer for the land in the first place? From what I've been told over the years there have been attempts to obtain licensing from H&K, asgk being the body to try. I think H&K picked Umarex because they're a German company. Link to post Share on other sites
greebo_Brat Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 The problem is most of their guns are *beep*, and the people who will buy *beep* guns won't know about the buttraping these 'fags' as ubar would put it are up to. For someone like me who has over 1/3 of my collection as Hk's this could be a real pita, and what of the new ICS split gearbox MP5s? Umarex's website lists the ICS MP5 range, given UMAREX just import and 'rebadge' some of their products that might imply they have a deal with ICS already. Don't know about STAR, CA (G36), JG, CYMA, TM, G&G etc with their MP5 and G36 range. Link to post Share on other sites
liquidflorian Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Umarex's website lists the ICS MP5 range, given UMAREX just import and 'rebadge' some of their products that might imply they have a deal with ICS already. Don't know about STAR, CA (G36), JG, CYMA, TM, G&G etc with their MP5 and G36 range. Well, CA always has the "Xiuhcoatl" to license for their G36, and Umarex will probably buy their el cheapo aeg's from the same sweat shop JG and CMYA do, and TM I think will do what they normally do which is; "meh". Link to post Share on other sites
elchinator Posted January 31, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Umarex's website lists the ICS MP5 range, given UMAREX just import and 'rebadge' some of their products that might imply they have a deal with ICS already. Umarex (Germany) is just another wholesaler. They sell ICS as well as Marui, SRC, and a lot of other stuff. But they also have their own set of OEM suppliers. They mostly used that for airguns and blank firing guns (where they actually DO have a limited assortment), but they surely will use the same strategy towards airsoft. Which would mean that a company like SRC gets the sole contract for producing all the cheap trademarked airsoft G36 rifles. Fancy that? Link to post Share on other sites
evilliboba Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Umarex can kiss my full trademarked G36K's rear end for all I care. It won't stop me from buying more either. Link to post Share on other sites
Magsz Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 I hope they don't. It would only set a precedent that would encourage other companies to seek these kind of licences. It wouldn't be so bad if the product was actually good quality, but umarex and cybergun exclusively produced POS guns that weren't worth the plastic they were made of. It would essentially end the sport. Its not the end of the world if other airsoft manufacturers seek licensing. Madbull for one has sought licenses for their products and thus far we as the consumers havent seen ridiculous prices coming from them. Im fairly certain thats because simon isnt a complete money grubbing twit like the umarex executives appear to be. If more manufacturers follow in the footsteps of Simon and Madbull we will be ok. If more cyberguns appear on the scene then we're screwed. Link to post Share on other sites
Azulsky Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 They cant touch Classic Army, they have rights from Schwaben Arms and Brugger & Thomet. I dont really see any manufacturers giving a **** though. Link to post Share on other sites
(V)atrix Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 So is this just going to effect Europe? Or will it be seen over here in America? This may put a dent in my plan to buy a KSC USP.45 and potentially an MP5. It's unlikely to affect the US in regards to non-trademarked items (H&K trademarked items are already grey-market due to H&K's past dealings with US Customs). Under US law the likeness that Umarex has the rights to is called trade dress. To be an infringement on trade dress, the product must be significantly similar to the original product - so much so that it causes confusion in a consumer as to the origin of the product. As airguns are unlikely to ever be mistaken as real firearms (by consumers) trade dress laws would be unlikely to be successful in stopping the import of replicas airguns. I seem to recall both Colt and Cybergun trying (unsucessfully, if I recall corerectly) to use trade dress law to stop US imports of various AEGs in the past. Link to post Share on other sites
Bareknuckle Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Do you guys think they will really be able to stop importation of other companies' H&K guns to the European and US markets? Or will this just be a threatening company move that effectively does nothing? I guess my friends had better get the G36s they've been wanting fast. Link to post Share on other sites
liquidflorian Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Do you guys think they will really be able to stop importation of other companies' H&K guns to the European and US markets? Or will this just be a threatening company move that effectively does nothing? I guess my friends had better get the G36s they've been wanting fast. Only through litigation, and only if the importer capitulates I believe. Link to post Share on other sites
XaVierDK Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 I have a feeling they'll have about the same effect on the general market as Cybergun had... Ergo, zero Best Regards Link to post Share on other sites
Roanix Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 How can a company buy rights to a paticular "shape" aka the shape of an mp5 or g36 or ump? I can understand trademarks but i think they are going too far. Boycott UMAREX! Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 I have a feeling they'll have about the same effect on the general market as Cybergun had... Ergo, zero Best Regards No no no, they ended up hated and lost a hell of a lot of their UK market share when the VCRB kicked in and ended up having to tell KWC to make all their guns clear so they could sell them here Link to post Share on other sites
XaVierDK Posted January 31, 2008 Report Share Posted January 31, 2008 Well, they can kiss CA's butt at least, there are no trademarks on their guns, and the shaps isn't exactly right on their G36's at least.. Link to post Share on other sites
Gigueand Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 Hmm, well all I can say is that I'm glad my CA36K, my CA36 and my CA36C are all safe and sound seeing as how they aren't G36s, have no H&K trades and aren't true to exact spec. copies of H&K designs... I'm also glad my B&T MP5 is safe since it is licensed througn Brugger & Thomet. Oh, and I'm also glad that my guns are super safe since they have already been paid for and are in my home. Seems to be a bunch of huff about nothing. Link to post Share on other sites
sturgis Posted February 1, 2008 Report Share Posted February 1, 2008 wahey, it's the cybergun affair all over again.... cyberbun (or "les 3 pylons" as it was called in the early days), tried the same ###### here to retailers and such when the aqcuired the Colt license iirc. And their ###### was just as bad as the "Umarex" ###### i have seen. no good for nothing scum pushing crappy products on the market. I hope they hit a wall like cybergun did! maybe german retailers can do the same as in the US, and cover up trademarks? as i doubt they can license a shape Link to post Share on other sites
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