New western arms m4 cqb

[Magsz]

Just to add a little to this. Seiga on the PTW forums isnt a skirmisher so id actually take his word above most of the people on these forums. Sometimes skirmishers tend to inject just a bit too much testosterone into their opinions if you know what i mean.

 

Having said all of that, when a guy thats not a skirmisher comments about a guns lack of decent accuracy i tend to take note so i believe his comments at least have some validity.

 

Im still with wupjak on this. If the base of the rifle, ie the basic design premise is sound, there is no telling what we can do with aftermarket upgrades and modifications. The most interesting thing will be the next six months while these aftermarket upgrades and modifications are being produced. IF we can get skirmishable rifles out of the base WA gun for less than a grand USD im going to be one stupidly happy camper. I probably wont use this gun every weekend but its CERTAINLY going to be fun every now and then.

 

Lets wait and see, there's so much neat stuff on the horizon.

[Inq Eisenhorn]

Oh, you just know I need to comment on that statement:

 

Just to add a little to this. Seiga on the PTW forums isnt a skirmisher so id actually take his word above most of the people on these forums. Sometimes skirmishers tend to inject just a bit too much testosterone into their opinions if you know what i mean.

 

Who better to comment on somethings use...erm, then someone who actually uses it!?!? Thats like me asking someone who can't drive how car X handles in the wet?!?

 

In the way you say skirmishers will inject "testosterone" into there opinions, someone who collects AEGs for reasons other than skirmishing may be judging the rifle by an unrealistic standard, standards for which the rifle was never designed in the first place....

 

Take the statement about accuracy, IMHO I wouldn't expect this rifle to be as accurate as an AEG, simply because its got a degree of "recoil"...every time you fire the rifle your bb (which is inherantly inaccurate to begin with!) is going to go off target as the rifle bucks....a skirmisher would understand this surely, and would compensate for this affect in the same way we compensate for advers wind conditions etc......now this guy calls the gun bad because of something so obvious, you have to question his "logic".

[uscmCorps]

IMHO the only people you can truly trust to give an impartial review on the product is someone who hasn't paid good money for it (Fareast...I'm looking at you, where-ever you are!) they don't have to justify there loss of funds.....

I disagree with you there. People who are sent free samples should be considered no more trustworthy than those who paid for their products. It can be easily argued that someone who's given a free sample is more likely to give a thumbs up to a product by a certain manufacturer as they would want to be continually supplied with free samples. Furthermore, a reviewer receiving free samples who writes a very negative review of a product that ends up costing the manufacturer a great deal in loss of sales would probably not be appreciated by the manufacturer and may not be given freebies in the future. While this may not apply to all reviewers of free samples, it certainly is a possibility that should be considered.

 

Blanket statements of "he/she gets free samples therefore his opinion is most likely uncorrupted" are unwise. I have read many reviews or comments by people who have paid for items and regretted doing so as they felt it was a complete waste of money. Surely by your reasoning, these types of comments would not exist as these people would have nothing but glowing reviews of those products regardless of if they sucked or not.

 

Nope. When reading someone's reviews/comments of how good or bad a product is, instead of purely going by "was that reviewed product a free sample" it would be more wise to weigh the value of that person's opinion. You've got to weigh multiple factors like:

* Person's prior experience with similar products

* Does the person have anything to gain/loose by a positive/negative review

* How valid that person's opinion has been in the past when commenting/reviewing products

* etc

 

[Captain Hat]

Personally I'm buying one of these for several reasons.

 

The first is- I mean, come on, GBB rifle. What's not to like there? The concept is awesome.

 

The second is- I'm a sucker for a WA gun. I have five already (and come to it two of those are full-auto), and none of the problems I've experienced with them have been due to anything other than user incompetence. I know they're overpriced, I know a lot of people have trouble with reliability, I know- all right? i know. But I still like them.

 

The third (and possibly the most important) is- if WA produce a GBB M4 and it sells terribly because everybody is waiting for everyone else to buy one, regardless of whether people genuinely like the idea or not and regardless of whether a better GBB rifle could have found a larger market, other companies are that much less likely to produce GBB rifles in the future.

 

Personally, I want to see more GBB rifles- I eagerly await the day when I can show up to a skirmish site with my full British kit including a GBB L85, with a GBB G36 in my kit bag for CQB games and a (good!) GBB Browning HP in my holster and spend a day skirmishing without using a single battery. But that isn't likely to happen anytime soon if people don't spend money on GBB rifles when they are made. I'm not saying you should buy one of these just because of the concept, because obviously if it's a piece of ###### it's not going to make you a proud owner and it's not going to be worth spending that amount of money to prove a point- but it does add another reason for me to buy one, so I'm voting in the most powerful way I know- with my hard-earned money. I seem to be saying this a lot lately, but perhaps I've been reading up on economics a little too much recently.

 

When I get it I'll give an opinion on the boards, and I'll try to be honest about it, too- but for me the gun is worth it just because I've wanted someone to do exactly this sort of thing (though maybe I would have preferred a different weapon to start with, but I guess this was inevitable to a certain extent) for so long it's not even a question any more. Even if it turns out not to be all that hot, I'll still use it for warmup games and on special occasions just because the concept rocks so hard. Its actually being a skirmishable weapon is a secondary consideration at best (and I mean, come on, you're looking at a man who has been known to enter a woodland game armed with nothing but two pistols, one flashbang and a rubber chicken before).

[wolfstein5]

http://www.gunsnguys.com/ishop/Contents/Sh...&cboManuf=2

 

4,200.00 HKD = $539 USD / 272 GBP

[hhsohn]

Personally I'm buying one of these for several reasons.

 

The third (and possibly the most important) is- if WA produce a GBB M4 and it sells terribly because everybody is waiting for everyone else to buy one, regardless of whether people genuinely like the idea or not and regardless of whether a better GBB rifle could have found a larger market, other companies are that much less likely to produce GBB rifles in the future.

 

Well, it's arguable that it probably won't make that much difference to general market as Sun Project M16 series and Marushin M1's been around without much impact. But we can always hope that this might be the gun that breaks the camel's back!

 

BTW, historically WA's SMG's have been somewhat limited production affair, i.e. M11, Jatimatic, AR-7, and I guess we can count the Mini-Uzi.

 

 

[Lupus78]

Metal body for WA M4A1 by G&P in progress :

http://www.gp-web.com/en/productspop.php?pid=1763

 

Lots of reinforced parts for the M4 (check page 2 too)

http://www.gp-web.com/en/news.php

Well that just made my day!

 

I'm DEFINITELY gonna get this gun! I don't mind the extra price for metal parts. (I'll get them when I get the money...)

Just knowing that I can get a full metal GBB rifle with lots of aftermarket parts sounds just too good to be true. And I'm a guy who likes just to have fun at the games. And I think that even the crappiest gun can be skirmishable, if you know how to play. If the range is short, get close. The feeling what you get when you scare the *beep* out of someone with a loud gbb full auto burst is just priceless...

[Lupus78]

Well, it's arguable that it probably won't make that much difference to general market as Sun Project M16 series and Marushin M1's been around without much impact.

I think that generally people don't mind the external hoses even if they could be as skirmishable as an AEG. Additionally, these guns are typically limited production and quite hard to get, compared to WA M4 which you can now get from a lot of reliable stores like RWA and WGC. I could say that WA M4 is already more "mainstream" than some of these "collector's special toys" (just my impression).

 

BTW, historically WA's SMG's have been somewhat limited production affair, i.e. M11, Jatimatic, AR-7, and I guess we can count the Mini-Uzi.

I guess all these previous WA full auto guns are not that good examples of previous WA stuff. WA M4 seems to have very different approach, even from marketing POV. For example the Mini-Uzi is pretty direct copy/remake of the KWC uzi without CO2 mags (and not their own design). I think this new M4 "series" (as it's called even if it's just one example so far) has good potential for a 1911-like success in WA production, if the mechanics are durable enough, people like (and buy) the gun and if it's a good platform for a "skirmishable" GBB rifle. Remember that this is really just the first model that they have out. Surely there will be a lot of versions, upgrades etc. once this first try is enough of a success. Hope so... Initial response seems to indicate some kind of an success. Surely there are some flaws, but nothing severe yet from what I've heard.

 

[Magsz]

I wonder if TM is going to release another Marui Man video to combat the evil gas powered guns.

 

Its really interesting how Airsoft is coming around full circle. There's alot of interest in gas again and people dont seem to be too interested in the "benefits" of the AEG, ie the ability spray all three hundred rounds at once out of a gun.

[dismemberd]

I wonder if TM is going to release another Marui Man video to combat the evil gas powered guns.

 

Its really interesting how Airsoft is coming around full circle. There's alot of interest in gas again and people dont seem to be too interested in the "benefits" of the AEG, ie the ability spray all three hundred rounds at once out of a gun.

You've got a good point, but remember, this probably isn't gonna be replacing the AEG, or anything. A small group of people are just interested in it's unique...ness....

[SFOD-D]

Found a short review here: http://www.wargameyau.net/viewthread.php?tid=66147

Links to a nice little video of the bolt cycling: http://picasaweb.google.com.tw/monda.inter...074204175369554

 

enjoy.

[IronWolf]

Found a short review here: http://www.wargameyau.net/viewthread.php?tid=66147

Links to a nice little video of the bolt cycling: http://picasaweb.google.com.tw/monda.inter...074204175369554

 

enjoy.

 

Don't see much cooldown at all in that last clip, really looking forward to seeing some in-depth reviews now.

[Magsz]

Dont get me wrong, i dont think this will EVER replace the AEG.

 

I was merely pointing out that there is an increasingly large part of the player base thats more interested in "realism" than the hicap spray and pray attitude. At least there is on these forums and elsewhere.

 

In actuality its still about the same when it comes to the usual weekly crowds.

[Inq Eisenhorn]

I certainly wouldn't replace my AEGs with GBB....I guess I would be more likely to use the GBB rifle during a "milsim" game, but for the average skirmish I'd settle for my AEG "Spray and pray"

 

Looking at Youtube it seems theres alot of reviews availible on the gun....it also seems the plastic content is a little off putting in most cases.....I'm dying to get three of these rifles, but I'm hesistant becuase I may have to completely rebuild with second tier parts from companies like G&P (which isn't a bad thing) its just when you consider the price, you begin to wonder if its truly worth it.

 

I keep hearing about the Escort M4s and Sun Project rifles...wher can you get these guns?

[4boost]

Don't think this has been added yet. Nice little comparo:

 

http://www.intrudershop.com.tw/showreport.asp?report_id=47

 

 

 

Edit:

 

Gotta love google:

 

http://www.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%...=en&ie=UTF8

[mrliu]

Man, I hope WE makes a clone. I'd buy one in a hearbeat. I bet cool down is a *badgeress* for this gun.

[uscmCorps]

Man, I hope WE makes a clone.

 

 

 

On another note, Wow... with every new picture in that comparison guide... I want one... Right NOW!!! Actually, a few of my teammates are talking about buying these as well. We're only holding back to see when the magazines will be released.

 

I love the fact that so many of its internal parts are very similar to those in a real steel gun. I'm wondering if the upper could be swapped out with a real steel upper... if so... VLTOR VIS here I come!

 

Another thing that I'm curious about is the inner barrel. Seems like this WA M4 GBB uses some different kind of inner barrel than a standard TM style inner barrel. But with G&P's recent announcement that they will be making different front sets for the WA M4, they make no mention of the inner barrel. So does that mean that we'll be stuck using the same inner barrel but with a longer outer barrel if we choose to use a G&P front set? I'm sure other aftermarket Airsoft companies will produce long tightbore inner barrels for this, but they have still yet to be announced.

[4boost]

Wow... with every new picture in that comparison guide... I want one... Right NOW!!! Actually, a few of my teammates are talking about buying these as well. We're only holding back to see when the magazines will be released.

 

I love the fact that so many of its internal parts are very similar to those in a real steel gun. I'm wondering if the upper could be swapped out with a real steel upper... if so... VLTOR VIS here I come!

 

That would be interesting...and expensive (may want to see if Kingarms makes a VIS for the WA since they are developing one for AEG's - Linky. My concern is the mags as well. Tokyo-model said they should have them in stock in about 3 weeks. I was also worried about how easily this thing would accept aftermarket rail systems but judging by those pics I think they will be fine.

[poison123]

Anyone who ordered from Redwolf.....has yours shipped out yet? Going to be a week on friday since I put in my order and paided and so far they aren't responding at all to my inquires on when its going to ship.

[Wupjak]

Paid Monday, no word. Sent an inquiry today about the status, have yet to hear back (granted it's only 9:30 a.m. there atm). This is unusual for Redwolf in that they usually ship same day or next day. I'm beginning to think that they took more orders than they had guns and are now waiting on a resupply. Not cool.

[davedawg123]

The more new pics I see of this, the more badass it appears it will be. Can't wait to see some reviews. I hope it won't be a letdown.

[Magsz]

Its going to be a letdown at least in stock form.

 

I mean seriously, in the world of AEG's, how the hell can anyone hope to compete against the spray and prayers with 600 round hicaps?

 

Still, having said that, all it takes is one bb to get a kill and as more parts are released as long as the BASE platform is halfway decent, the potential to upgrade this thing to attain the full potency of its design is definitely there.

 

I cannot wait for the next three months or so. We should see a plethora of new parts being released for this thing and its going to be an amazing couple of months for players that love semi automatic and controlled automatic fire with their guns.

 

I for one desperately want one of these but im waiting to see what the availability of magazines and aftermarket parts is like before i plunk down the change.

 

 

[arivee]

Its going to be a letdown at least in stock form.

 

I mean seriously, in the world of AEG's, how the hell can anyone hope to compete against the spray and prayers with 600 round hicaps?...

 

Errrr....maybe skillz? teamwork? patience?

 

Ever been pwned by a springer? I have and Im not ashamed to admit it.

 

Will spray and pray go away? Probably not, but this piece of kit is for a different kind of player, just like the PTW, sniper rifles and AEGs have their own fans.

 

Its sad this kind of gun will only get trigger time for certain parts of the year in the US Northeast.

 

Aaaaaanyway...is there any news of how compatible this will be? I mean does this lean more towards AEG compatible or real steel compatible (specifically accessories)? You have to rice this up - its Asian after all!

[Magsz]

Arivee, dont get me wrong bro, im not bashing the product.

 

Im really bashing the community that would be unwilling to try this gun BECAUSE of the fact that its not a 600 round hicap spraying machine.

[poison123]

Looks like mine finally shipped.