poison123 Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 Guys This is a more general question, or speculation if you will. What do you think the up coming sales of the Inokatsu and WE rifles will do to the price of the WA? Does anyone think that the price will drop, especially as the Inokatsu rifle is pretty much the same thing but with "better" materials? Could the WA version become like the TM AEG, not necessaily cheap, but certainly the "Sportsline" of the GBB rifle world? If its true, and the Inokatsu group has set up some kind of trade agreement with WA, whereby they (WA) get a cut of the unit sales, then it seems strange that people would even consider purchasing the WA in the near future. If such an agreement now is in place, hence the approaching sales, then I can't imagine WA is taking that much of a cut to offset the loss in sales of their M4 unit. Could we be seeing a slow demise of the WA M4 unit, as sales drop WA decides to stop producing? or can we expect the prices of the WA to go south very very rapidly? Very doubtful. Right now the Inok is "better" materials at 2x the price. And most people have resolved it down to only a few parts that need upgraded now on the WA. Buy the Inok and your still in the same boat of needing to swap bodies because you don't like the trades etc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BaBaBooey Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 Based on what I've seen, WA doesn't drop prices (I've seen local hobby stores that might have a sale, but otherwise, WA is firm on their prices). WA has been around for decades and if their M4 fails, its probably not going to be an issue. They've got tons of experience with being first on the market. I think they were one of the firsts to release a production AEG (Jatimatic, ran on combination of gas and AA batteries) and the semi-auto rifle (I believe the WA/AR-7 pre-dates the MGC liquid charge semi-auto rifle or the Ashai DVSCON...before that everything was pretty much full-auto) which ultimately failed...that was almost 20 years ago and they're still around. I agree that prices won't change. They'll just stop making them when sales dwindle, which it probably will (get all your spare parts while you can!). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shinhk Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 I agree with those who say they'll just stop making it. WA has SO MANY different guns, and they try so many different molds and models that if sales for the WAM4 go south, they will probably just stop making it. People in japan will still choose marui over something like VFC so i'm sure the same will happen with WA and inokatsu. For marui to have released the PMC even after there's SOO many other armalites out there that in some people's eyes are "better" must say something about their market. I'm sure marui isn't stupid and neither is western arms. A lot of western arms pistols run 134a perfectly but once people start using green things break. People need to understand that these models are built around 134a pressure so they can't expect it to be fine on green. Would you put jet fuel in your car? No right? You'd have to upgrade and reinforce things in order for it to work. Inokatsu is trying to take it one step further and tweaking it in order to run green reliably. So why would people in japan buy an inokatsu that's twice the amount and that probably wouldn't run 134a reliably? To me, marui and WA are only targeting the japanese market. Exporting their products is more of an extra sale to them but i'm sure they could care less. Inokatsu is targeting "everyone else" who want a full metal WAM4 that's green gas capable out of the box. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sadigh Posted October 2, 2008 Report Share Posted October 2, 2008 (edited) I agree with those who say they'll just stop making it. WA has SO MANY different guns, and they try so many different molds and models that if sales for the WAM4 go south, they will probably just stop making it. People in japan will still choose marui over something like VFC so i'm sure the same will happen with WA and inokatsu. For marui to have released the PMC even after there's SOO many other armalites out there that in some people's eyes are "better" must say something about their market. I'm sure marui isn't stupid and neither is western arms. A lot of western arms pistols run 134a perfectly but once people start using green things break. People need to understand that these models are built around 134a pressure so they can't expect it to be fine on green. Would you put jet fuel in your car? No right? You'd have to upgrade and reinforce things in order for it to work. Inokatsu is trying to take it one step further and tweaking it in order to run green reliably. So why would people in japan buy an inokatsu that's twice the amount and that probably wouldn't run 134a reliably? To me, marui and WA are only targeting the japanese market. Exporting their products is more of an extra sale to them but i'm sure they could care less. Inokatsu is targeting "everyone else" who want a full metal WAM4 that's green gas capable out of the box. Agreed. There exists already so many discontinued lines from WA, and they havn't seemed to have stopped them from making new products. Edited October 2, 2008 by sadigh Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GBB Nut Posted October 3, 2008 Report Share Posted October 3, 2008 Western Arms is definitely not going to drop their prices. People seem to forget that Western Arms really doesn't care about sales to any foreign markets. Now retailers might drop their prices just to unload excess stock but with the way things are going they've got a couple more months before they even have to worry about that problem. Oh and I'd still like to see this elusive Inokatsu GBB M4. From what my friends in Taiwan are saying there's 100+ preordered and only one (maybe) who's received anything from Inokatsu. Personally, I'd be real ###### off if overseas customers (Europe, USA, etc) received Inokatsu M4's before me. Especially after having payed and preordered months in advance. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Inq Eisenhorn Posted October 3, 2008 Report Share Posted October 3, 2008 Yeah, I can fully imagine that WA focuses mainly (if not, totally) on the Japanese market, so I guess that really answers the question....albeit, from a personal point of view basis. In reality I guess we'll never know the "truth". So I guess the real "battle" outside of Japan, will be fought between WE and Inokatsu, and if the rumours are anything to go by, my money is on WE making more sales in the short to long term. Inokatsu has really handled the PR of their product quite badly and I think that will show in the units sold. Personally, I would be sad to see the WA unit just cease to be produced, sure its flawed, but then what isn't? Ideally, it would be nice to see WA continue to develope the unit and indeed create a range of GBB rifles, and I would have no issue if the rifles only functioned on 134a gas, kinda like TM only firing around 280fps..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rusTORK Posted October 3, 2008 Report Share Posted October 3, 2008 Probably, but you also got the Ra-tech hammer [http://www.ratech.com.tw/pic/product/rag/dream_hammer_def.jpg Ordered one... Soon i can test it... Maybe 2 weeks... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IBICO Posted October 3, 2008 Report Share Posted October 3, 2008 Ordered one... Soon i can test it... Maybe 2 weeks... Hope I get it first.. Last time I got mine AFTER everyone else even when I ordered before or same time as others.. Norway suck in postal service Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rusTORK Posted October 3, 2008 Report Share Posted October 3, 2008 Inokatsu still upload Damn-pics-with-price, but don't answer on any-my-e-mail (2 or 3)... What's wrong!? And by the way... their metall have M.T.W. markings, not acceptable at all. So, we (not WE) have not superb-metall-body-with-low-price-at-any-internet-store. And Inokatsu don't sell anything. I have only one question: "WHY?". I hope, it's really coming soon. Very-very soon. \I can accept "tomorrow".\ Oh, c'mon... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SDU_Phil Posted October 4, 2008 Report Share Posted October 4, 2008 (edited) **edit** i am one lucky shooter. i found the lil rod under my printer, just barely peaking out. word of advice to all newcomers - BE CAREFUL!! alright so i was changing in my ra bolt stop and when i pulled the bolt stop up boom something flew out. i recovered a small spring on the floor and after examining ibicos picture and video tutorial of the spring change, i think i am missing a small piece of metal rod? any idea know where to get an replacement or what i can use as an replacement? Edited October 4, 2008 by SDU_Phil Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shinhk Posted October 4, 2008 Report Share Posted October 4, 2008 haha another option would be to remove those 2 parts all together and use a diff spring. i have the explanation on GGI. I'm not running the spring or rod on my set up. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IBICO Posted October 4, 2008 Report Share Posted October 4, 2008 (edited) **edit** i am one lucky shooter. i found the lil rod under my printer, just barely peaking out. word of advice to all newcomers - BE CAREFUL!! alright so i was changing in my ra bolt stop and when i pulled the bolt stop up boom something flew out. i recovered a small spring on the floor and after examining ibicos picture and video tutorial of the spring change, i think i am missing a small piece of metal rod? any idea know where to get an replacement or what i can use as an replacement? The pin look very similar to the take down lock pins. But I never checked. (or was it the pins on the systema ptw..) n Or just do only the spring like shinhk did Checked.. It is not similar.. The one in the bolt stop got another tip that is more narrow. Edited October 4, 2008 by IBICO Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SDU_Phil Posted October 5, 2008 Report Share Posted October 5, 2008 i had a problem with my wa m4 while skirmishing today. suddenly it had locked up and i couldn't pull the trigger and racking the bolt did not cock the trigger. when i got home i tried to figure out what was wrong and i had thought that maybe the sear/tirgger assembly was broken, but upon further inspection i had noticed that there was actually a small piece of metal that got tucked under the trigger assembly so the trigger couldn't be pulled. i have no idea what this piece is from, and since i've removed it i've shot 3 mags through the gun with ... relatively no problems, my bolt had come loose from the charging handle while full autoing, not where why but it was an easy fix. anyways, so i want to know if anyone knows what this piece is. it looks far from a piece of metal broken off of something, it must of fell off of something somewhere but i can't identify where or what. any help is appreciated. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IBICO Posted October 5, 2008 Report Share Posted October 5, 2008 (edited) Check your bolt stop.. I am pretty sure you have the stock one right? Edited October 5, 2008 by IBICO Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shinhk Posted October 5, 2008 Report Share Posted October 5, 2008 hmm...i'd better work on that bolt stop fix thread thingy soon... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IBICO Posted October 5, 2008 Report Share Posted October 5, 2008 GGI reviews and blog Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SDU_Phil Posted October 5, 2008 Report Share Posted October 5, 2008 ah thanks ibico, i installed the RA one but when i took my stock one off that piece was already gone, not one the stock one. eeek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sadigh Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 (edited) More stuff for the WA m4, kits made by Inokatsu. Prices are on the posters, frankly I think at those prices, Inokatsu can go f**k themselves, especially looking at those trademarks on the lower receiver- ridiculously overpriced Edited October 7, 2008 by sadigh Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kullwarrior Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 not surprised, why sell less when everyone is selling high? And btw 2Roy sells theirs way more expensive Quote Link to post Share on other sites
junior Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 Stupid stupid Inokatsu. Those G&P receivers are looking better and better every day... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lupus78 Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 I dunno... If the overall quality is typical "Inokatsu quality" and their receiver is indeed forged aluminum and not crappy molded pot-metal like G&P, then the total price for whole WA-upgrade package (front set + receiver + stock) doesn't really sound too bad. It's quite a lot of course, but not too much when comparing the alternatives and knowing the typical Inokatsu prices and standards. The amount of CNC'd, full steel or otherwise good quality parts that seems to be included is really impressive. Now only if they could actually DELIVER something to retailers, I'd really be excited! (And not just some f***ing pretty pictures...) The WA upgrades doesn't interest me either since I don't own one and I'm really not gonna buy one just to replace 99% of it's parts with Inokatsu's set. About the MTW trades: I really don't care about trades as long as they're either nonexistent or clean and simple like Inokatsu's. What I don't like are the white painted "funny" zombie or navy seals trades that the G&P seems to have fallen in love with. Not a single "official" body released yet, as I know of (pictures of upcoming yes but not for sale - yet). I suppose Inokatsu really want to sell this baby all around the world and doing that while breaking copyrights couldn't just last long... I guess WA has made sure that Inokatsu first releases WA parts before they are allowed to officially release their own full gun. I guess even before that people are allowed to buy the full rifle "under the table" so to speak, since people like MCXL were able to order the complete rifle. Hopefully they will get theirs pretty soon. Also in the WE M4 thread people have noticed that the WE's version has become available to order for a price of $500. It's gonna be really interesting times in the coming few weeks. But even this sum is too much for me to buy a gun blindfolded, so I'm just gonna wait for some reviews from people more eager to buy them than myself. Especially when I'm drooling for the Inokatsu beauty... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shinhk Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 What i'm waiting for is an awesome detailed review like how wupjak did for his. None of this "oh lookie pics!" but i have no mag so i can't tell you how it performs. I frankly could care less how it "looked" rather I'm more about how it performs. My thoughts on inokatsu is that they made it TOO realistic and maybe TOO close to RS specs. If you see some of their pictures there's a gas tube entrance and the bolt has a hole for the gas to push it back. Who's to stop some dumb@$$ to try to modify it to shoot live rounds? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
poison123 Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 What i'm waiting for is an awesome detailed review like how wupjak did for his. None of this "oh lookie pics!" but i have no mag so i can't tell you how it performs. I frankly could care less how it "looked" rather I'm more about how it performs. My thoughts on inokatsu is that they made it TOO realistic and maybe TOO close to RS specs. If you see some of their pictures there's a gas tube entrance and the bolt has a hole for the gas to push it back. Who's to stop some dumb@$$ to try to modify it to shoot live rounds? I don't know...the fact they MIGHT get one round off then the entire thing explodes taking the idiots face along for the ride? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wupjak Posted October 7, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 What i'm waiting for is an awesome detailed review like how wupjak did for his. Thank you for the compliment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
freq88 Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 Somehow I doubt that authorities are concerned about the "realism" of the upper. Otherwise why would lowers be the only part requiring registration? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.