Western Arms M4 CQB-R

[Inq Eisenhorn]

I'm all over that like a bad case of acne! I like it a lot!

[uscmCorps]

I've decided that until I can get my WA to perform reliably, I'm not going to put anymore money into the externals. That receiver looks good though.

[IBICO]

I've decided that until I can get my WA to perform reliably, I'm not going to put anymore money into the externals. That receiver looks good though.

 

Same as me then.. I might need some lighter bolt and the hammer with bearing to get everything running smooth. The body is actually pretty nice and strong.

I tightened the barrel nut all what I had in me and still nothing broke on it..

 

Only thing that is making me want a metal 1:1 body is to fit ambi mag release and maybe try the ambi selector from a real M4.

 

[shinhk]

http://www.wgcshop.com/pcart/shopper.php?i...15_srch_WA%20m4

 

Is that just the stock barrel and hop?

 

Also have quite a bit of questions.

 

1. If I upgrade the bolt stop and hop up, I should be pretty much ready for green gas correct?

 

2. What do you guys lube/clean after using your weapon and what do you use to do this.

 

3. If I hold the trigger and cycle the bolt back without a mag in, do you think this can be harmful? Thanks in advance for asking my newb questions.

 

No...supposedly it's a different design that's "more accurate" according to WA, but it's still a plastic hop-up unit.

 

1. yes but your bolt will still wear down due to the valve lock on the magazine

 

2. a towel...i don't lube anything since i run with lubricated gasses. the only thing i do/did is put the WA speed grease in the hole under the buffer tube. Look at the manual to see where to wipe/clean your gun and what parts to lubricate.

 

3. i don't see why it would be harmful.

 

-----

 

Most of my money is going into internals. Metal bodies and what not don't appeal to me if the internals don't work. It just becomes an expensive wall hugging piece of art. My motto that I stick to in airsoft is: "It's what's inside that counts".

[shinhk]

Okay...so i did a comparison with the two 368 barrels. It was pouring out here in hawaii so i didn't get to do paper tests. I didn't really care too much about accuracy but i just wanted to see how the gun shot. This was really crappy muggy and very humid weather so it would have been the worst weather possible for me to play in. Perfect to test out a gas gun actually. no sun = no chrono and i'm too lazy to set up the light set (using chrony). So the 2 set ups i've tried are the prime with pdi 6.01 and the pgc with 6.05. Both are m4 length barrels. Both used the same mag filled with abbey ultra and using maruzen sgm bb's.

 

First i tried the pgc with 6.05 (just because the upper for that one was on my modified lower). Accuracy was soso...bb's would drop. Fixed the hop-up and wow...this thing is pretty good. Shoots similar to an aeg as far as how the bb floats. I was aiming at a tree stump maybe about 25 meters out. Using the iron sights it was shooting pretty straight. Would hit the top of the tree stump almost every shot. Remember...the inner barrel is sort of just floating around in the inner barrel since i can't get it super tight with an o-ring like the stock one. Okay so i was pretty happy with this set up. Only problem is...hop-up setting was on full and using .29's the bb's seemed to be going in the ideal path...little bit of a rise but in a very straight path.

 

Okay...so i was impressed with that one so i expected the 6.01 to do just as well. It SORT of did meaning the bb's I shot were going straight, but like the stock barrel...it seemed to be just rising a little bit more than i'd like it too. It was rising to the point where my acog on it was almost useless. I couldn't lower the setting anymore than i already had it and the hop up was at it's lowest pressure. I'm thinking about sanding down the hop-up pushing lever thingy to lower the amount of pressure being applied to the bb. I think by doing that it might help.

 

A secondary after effect was...my bolt got all messed up. Even with those prowin valve lever thingies it's still wearing down. That metal reinforced rod thingy though has been gone for a while now so that may be the reason why it's all funky. Hopefully that other speedbolt WA one i ordered comes in soon so i can test that one out. So for now...bolt stop is officially out of order until a "better" bolt can be used. I'm also going to see if the speedbolt from western arms is any better. I have a feeling it will still be able to lock back. And if not...then at least i'll have a replacement bolt that'll have a faster cycle which i wouldn't mind either.

[richie 1]

Nice bit of info there Shinhk.Now does anyone know where to get a vavle lock spring,or a rough replacement.

[IBICO]

Nice bit of info there Shinhk.Now does anyone know where to get a vavle lock spring,or a rough replacement.

 

systema spring kit for aeg.. one of the spring fit as a valve lock spring.

 

Or just buy the Pro-Win Valve Lock For WA M4A1

 

[richie 1]

Thank you Ibico.

[Kalmar]

 

[Magsz]

Your eotech looks tilted.

 

YAY out of spec weaver/picatinny rails!

[Sinner101GR]

still though, with PTWs and WA CQBRs, people are dropping a lot of money for the real clothing options. More for the sight then the gun, I would imagine.

[Kalmar]

Your eotech looks tilted.

 

YAY out of spec weaver/picatinny rails!

 

The charging handle is slightly off canter giving the sight a slanted appearance from the angle the shot was taken.

[Magsz]

Never even looked at the charging handle.

 

I looked at the distance on the left and right hand side underneath the mounted portion of the eotech.

[Kalmar]

Never even looked at the charging handle.

 

I looked at the distance on the left and right hand side underneath the mounted portion of the eotech.

 

Well it obviously hasn't bothered me yet as only such a keen eye as yourself would notice such a thing

[Magsz]

Well it obviously hasn't bothered me yet as only such a keen eye as yourself would notice such a thing

 

Keen eyes...nah, just good taste. Hence the reason why i dont use eotechs anymore.

 

Having said that, to stay on topic, anyone else having any mount compatibility issues? Larue, ADM, etc?

Edited September 15, 2008 by Magsz

[Kalmar]

EOTech's and holo sights are the only optics I can use effectively being cross-eye dominant, so I'll take what I can get. Having said that I really don't think there is a problem with the sight or the rails themselves. Quite honestly I hastely mounted the sight right out of the box for picture taking purposes so I may have thrown the ARMS levers before I had the sight setteled properly. I haven't seen any other complaints so I doubt it is a widespread problem, and even so, it would be the least critical to deal with on a new WAM4.

[neubine]

Keen eyes...nah, just good taste. Hence the reason why i dont use eotechs anymore.

 

Having said that, to stay on topic, anyone else having any mount compatibility issues? Larue, ADM, etc?

 

My 552 had trouble mounting between the gap on the RIS. My Samsom mount was a very tight fit, which I guess is good. Haven't tried my ARMS mount or Larue, but the Rails seem to be fatter then normal.

 

 

[BaBaBooey]

Having said that, to stay on topic, anyone else having any mount compatibility issues? Larue, ADM, etc?

 

Yes, I have issues with the rail as well. The spacing of the rails seem to be a bit too wide for me. Things like throw lever mounts or mounts that are screwed down, like a standard carry handle, are ok I think the friction helps keeps them secure?). However, things that rely more on the correct spacing of the rails do not work well. For example, I tried using an M6X and it would not fit correctly (it is loose). The TD grip also did not fit as good as it should.

[IBICO]

The site is more or less up (signature)

[ruthlesscqb]

western arms,rs sir,arms rear site,rs tactical latch,hurricane 553,dytech short silencer,vltor flip front site,rs magpul grip,vltor eod stock,gp seal body,gp steel outter barrel,ra tech hop,bolt catch,bearing hammer,pdi 210 tight bore,gp hammer spring,gp sear,airsoft surgeon recoil set,acm 3x magnifier,condor 165 lumen battle light,and gp pipe ring.

 

 

 

 

[Inq Eisenhorn]

ruthlesscqb.......thats sex!

[IBICO]

Anyone want to sell the stock body for the WA M4?.. Would like another one for testing purposes.

 

I guess some of you guys have upgraded to metal body. So you might have a WA body just laying around?

[BaBaBooey]

I'm a bit ignorant on why the hammer spring needs to be replaced for GBB's (not specifically for the WA M4, but all modern gas airsoft in general).

 

Is it required to increase resistance for the bolt or slide when using high pressure gas (if so, wouldn't a stronger recoil spring accomplish this?)? I assume the stronger hammer spring would also increase the amount of force to the valve and possibly damage it (maybe even the entire firing block in the WA-M4). So would the valve knocker also need to be upgraded?

 

Also,

 

I installed the PRIME bearing hammer + bolt carrier, and it seems like it's doing absolutely nothing (I am running 134a with PGC valve locks and PDI inner barrel...all other parts are stock). I was hoping the combination of the lighter bolt carrier and bearing on the hammer will improve efficiency, but there is no measurable performance increase.

 

I'm assuming the only purpose for these two parts are to increase durability when using Green Gas? I see one person here had posted a failures with the bolt carrier.

[shinhk]

I'm a bit ignorant on why the hammer spring needs to be replaced for GBB's (not specifically for the WA M4, but all modern gas airsoft in general).

 

Is it required to increase resistance for the bolt or slide when using high pressure gas (if so, wouldn't a stronger recoil spring accomplish this?)? I assume the stronger hammer spring would also increase the amount of force to the valve and possibly damage it (maybe even the entire firing block in the WA-M4). So would the valve knocker also need to be upgraded?

 

Also,

 

I installed the PRIME bearing hammer + bolt carrier, and it seems like it's doing absolutely nothing (I am running 134a with PGC valve locks and PDI inner barrel...all other parts are stock). I was hoping the combination of the lighter bolt carrier and bearing on the hammer will improve efficiency, but there is no measurable performance increase.

 

I'm assuming the only purpose for these two parts are to increase durability when using Green Gas? I see one person here had posted a failures with the bolt carrier.

Hammer springs allow valve to be hit at a faster rate. Thus allowing MORE gas to be released at one time. Slight increase in fps comes from this but a lot of times you use gas faster and cooldown becomes more noticeable.

 

What were you expecting as far as performance wise? you won't get an up in FPS due to the parts that you put in. Those parts were meant to be more reliable/durable than the stock counterparts. Instead of the hammer scraping and sliding on the bolt, it allows it to roll and thus...creates less friction when operating. My stock bolt was the one that's all worn down but that could be due to the fact that i'm trying out all sorts of experiments with it. You might notice it more using green but since you're using 134 you probably just made your parts less likely to wear down. My bolt was getting worn down after using green gas. The stock bolt seems to hold up better on 134 and once green is used i started to notice it wasn't locking back. Hopefully i get that light weight WA one this week. If that cycles fast with 134 AND it's still possible to use the bolt lock, then i might just stick with 134 using that bolt. The prime one will be meant for green (if i ever get one). Diff bolts...diff purposes...i love this gun!

[BaBaBooey]

Hammer springs allow valve to be hit at a faster rate. Thus allowing MORE gas to be released at one time. Slight increase in fps comes from this but a lot of times you use gas faster and cooldown becomes more noticeable.

 

What were you expecting as far as performance wise? you won't get an up in FPS due to the parts that you put in. Those parts were meant to be more reliable/durable than the stock counterparts. Instead of the hammer scraping and sliding on the bolt, it allows it to roll and thus...creates less friction when operating. My stock bolt was the one that's all worn down but that could be due to the fact that i'm trying out all sorts of experiments with it. You might notice it more using green but since you're using 134 you probably just made your parts less likely to wear down. My bolt was getting worn down after using green gas. The stock bolt seems to hold up better on 134 and once green is used i started to notice it wasn't locking back. Hopefully i get that light weight WA one this week. If that cycles fast with 134 AND it's still possible to use the bolt lock, then i might just stick with 134 using that bolt. The prime one will be meant for green (if i ever get one). Diff bolts...diff purposes...i love this gun!

 

Thanks so much for response! It does help a lot.

 

So hitting it harder releases more gas from the valves thus increasing the rate of fire...so hammer spring upgrade is completely useless for semi auto pistols or does it increase power? Also, would this cause failure in the valve if its being forced to have gas flow at higher rate than it was intended? So we will now need to upgrade both the knocker and get high-flow valves for the magazines?

 

Regarding the PRIME upgrades, I was told by the sales person that the rate of fire would increase (increase cycle), decrease recoil, and possibly a slight increase power. Nothing was guaranteed to me when I purchased these parts; they did warn me that it may possible destroy some of my stock parts. I'm not aware of a way to measure rate of fire or durability, but it just "feels" like it's not doing anything (hence I stressed the fact that there was no measurable improvements). I suppose time will tell here.

 

Bottom line is I feel as though I wasted a ton of money on parts that I don't think I need. For 134a users, I would think twice before making these upgrades.