GBB Shootout: Cold Weather

[kruck]

I'll add the following:

 

KWA MP7 (NS2/Sys7) (with broken NPAS installed)

KSC USP Tactical Sys7, stock with metal slide

KSC USP Sys7 w/ Shooters Design Slide and OB

KSC USP Compact Sys7, stock with metal slide

 

Testing done with propane and assorted .2g ammo. I have no chrono so this is chiefly a test of gas efficiency of system 7 in cold weather. Guns and magazines were left outside in the snow for a couple of hours, away from direct sunlight. Magazines were filled indoors before being left outside. Temperature outside hovering around freezing, car thermometer indicates 1°C. Shots fired at 1 second intervals.

 

I left the guns & mags on a plastic sheet on the snow just outside my back door. When I went back out, it was buried in snow - some snow on the roof had fallen off and buried the guns & mags. At least we know it was nice and cold.

 

After clearing off all the snow, the USP Tactical went first. Blowback was fairly weak, although it cycled well and never misfired. Failed to lock back upon emptying magazines, fired 150 shots before farting out the last of the gas. For reference, this is the same efficiency as tested indoors.

 

Standard USP went next. This fired the first few shots well, before making funny noises and venting a lot of gas per shot. After about 12 shots, it vented all the gas down the barrel. I suspect the magazine's release valve was responsible for this. I'll retest it next chance I get with the same magazine that the USP Tactical used. The magazine I used for the standard USP is now leaking from the fill valve. For reference, the standard USP fires exactly the same when tested indoors as the USP tactical, firing up to 150 shots per fill.

 

USP Compact fired half a dozen rounds perfectly, before the blowback became so weak as to not load the next round properly. I took out the magazine and warmed it in my hand for ~10s, then repeated. It finished off the magazine fine and locked back on the last shot. This was repeated in the next magazine, until I accidentally released all the gas when warming it in my hand. Fired about 30 shots total.

 

Finally the MP7. Prepare yourself, this is where it gets a bit funky. For reference, this fires around 200 shots per fill indoors, give or take dependant on rate of fire. This was fired at 1rps as all the other guns tested. The first magazine fired fine, failed to lock back. Next magazine fired fine, locked back. Next mag locked back. Then it failed to lock back for the remaining magazines. In total, it fired 400 rounds (10 magazine loads), before farting out the last of the gas at the start of the 11th mag. Kick was not reduced a great deal from indoors, until after the 5th magazine or so. The first few shots out of each mag were about equal in terms of kick with indoors.

 

The MP7 result is frankly astonishing, I'm not entirely sure that it obeys the laws of physics, but I suppose that's system 7 for you.

 

I'd love the repeat the tests with a chrono, to get a better picture of what is happening. Plenty more winter yet to come, anyway, and I think I've found my go-to weapons

 

Now I just need to get all the snow out of my guns!

[Lone_Bullet]

I just received some CO2 capsules for my RA-Tech G17 mags.

Shooting trough the window upstrairs ( around 14°C, cold for indoor ) it gave 270-285 FPS with a few maxed at 300.

 

I'll skirm with it tomorrow ( it will be around 0°C, so freezing ) and will report back with results also: one mag, 0°C, 1BB/sec.

I presume it'll remain the same as I think the weather has little influence on CO2, not very sure though.

 

GBB: KSC Jap. G17 with Pro-Win Aluminum slide and nightsights, KM TN 6.04 95mm inner barrel, guarder steel magrelease installed, RA-Tech CO2 mags

GBB: KWA 1911 MK II ( full metal ) without modifications, Greengas

 

Measuring: Guarder Speeder 2000 II, .20 First Target Bio BB ( ###### BB's, have no other )

[Lone_Bullet]

Allright, Skirm report with CO2 capsules...

 

Complete disaster. Would give me 1-2 shots at 0°C. I don't know how the RA-Tech folks did it on the video, but this s*cks.

With the low power, I have disassembled the 2 mags to look whats would be wrong. Don't ! When screwing out the valves, you'll shred an O-rings, rendering the mag useless.

I *think* the O-rings froze in some way.

[hwagan]

-2c, TM Glock 17;

 

Green Gas, charged indoors.

Pistol left outside for 35 minutes on cold wooden shelf - No snow/rain.

24 rounds loaded.

Pistol fired approximately 5-6 useful shots before the slide begun to cycle far too slowly. Large clouds of gas for each shot. 10th shot, slide didn't cycle far enough to cock the hammer.

[aznriptide859]

Allright, Skirm report with CO2 capsules...

 

Complete disaster. Would give me 1-2 shots at 0°C. I don't know how the RA-Tech folks did it on the video, but this s*cks.

With the low power, I have disassembled the 2 mags to look whats would be wrong. Don't ! When screwing out the valves, you'll shred an O-rings, rendering the mag useless.

I *think* the O-rings froze in some way.

 

That's a ridiculously bummer - and here I was thinking I could go back to Glocks since they'd be viable cold weather sidearm platforms. Guess not :/

[heroshark]

Ran my tm 226 all sunday at around 0c tops getting colder through the day .The gun is fitted with pdi winter piston head ,6.01 tb barrel ,9ball hop ,and 9ball router. I don't have exact figures but 90% of the time it was finishing the mag and locking back using propane. Less reliable as it got colder in the afternoon ,but still very useable. You can fit these upgrades in various tm gbb's ,and I would very much recomend them for creating a gbb winter shooter. If I get the chance I'll get some better figures.

[Lasairiona]

I went to a skirm sunday (-2°C) and i only shot with gbb, a hi-capa 4.3 and a g&p woc m4a1 with ratech kit, they shot like they suppose to do :-).

When we took a break i put the magazines in my trouser pockets, that's the trick :-D.

I had a lot of fun, but that is my opinoin, i like realism and i'm willing to sacrifice a little heat(?) by putting the mags in my pants.

The hi-capa was shooting 275 fps and the m4 was doing 330 fps :-).

 

 

Grtz Michaël

[fyurian]

aah so i did hear u fire the gbb correctly

was indeed freezing sunday

[Lone_Bullet]

Reminder: It might just be me not tuning my glock right... however, it shoots 300 FPS with UltraAir ( greengas equivalent ), so it should be okay.

Also, Michaël, you were on an ACE event? With the shortstroked 4.3? I think I talked to you...

[Lasairiona]

Yes it was on the ace event :-).

I was shooting a 4.3 but not shortstroked, that was Jona, he was shooting a shortstroked 5.1 ^^.

[Lone_Bullet]

Oh right, yeah I spoke to you or him then, I was the one with the RG jacket and rooivalk pants. You guys sounded and looked as if you knew what you were doing! ( No sarcasm there )

Nice to have a few guys like that on such an event... let me guess, you were on Red?

[fyurian]

nope our team

[Rick O'Shay]

Thanks for this I've been looking for a good winter GBB and was thinking of getting a marui p226!!

 

Maybe others can add their experiences if you don't mind?

 

I took my P226 outside with me for a bit of a blast while i was having a smoke the other day and it fired brilliantly... then i put it down on my bench to take a call and forgot about it, for 5 or so hours, during this time it had begun snowing and i came outside after said 5 hours to find a very soggy and sorry looking p226 on the bench waiting to greet me when my habit needed feeding once more. After panicking and wiping the snow off i ran upstairs and grabbed my speedloader, came back outside, said 3 hail mary's and prayed 3 times to the east whilst wearing a very small hat, and to my surprise the gun fired al the rounds in the mag, cant comment on the blowback but i didnt see "much" loss of performance as they were going where they usually do and to be honest i was just thankful it was working