skyler8158 Posted August 20, 2005 Report Share Posted August 20, 2005 The XM177e1/2 weren't the only M16 carbines used in Vietnam, many different versions were used. Plus the XM177 did have round grips and that's not an M4 in the picture. Minnog: A M14 would be suitable. The Marines who went to Vietnam with M14s used them for over two years before getting M16s. Even then the stayed in circulation as sniper rifles. Link to post Share on other sites
minnoq Posted August 20, 2005 Report Share Posted August 20, 2005 Life doesn't get much better then. Link to post Share on other sites
Vicks Posted August 21, 2005 Report Share Posted August 21, 2005 heh another excuse to get a m14 eh? Link to post Share on other sites
trip Posted August 21, 2005 Report Share Posted August 21, 2005 i got one for the same reason as red best alt to m21 and i love mine OD might be a little to large for electroworkz thoe Link to post Share on other sites
Blue4 Posted August 22, 2005 Report Share Posted August 22, 2005 Darn got some good pics but my work server is blocking me form posting them Link to post Share on other sites
Fanatic Posted August 22, 2005 Report Share Posted August 22, 2005 Isn't his gun a little too futuristic? They didn't have M4's back in 'Nam. They had XM177's I believe, but not M4's. The M16 came out like in the middle of 'Nam, so how did they already know to make the round foregrip AND a smaller version? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> It's not a M4 that's for sure Looks like a XM177E1, a carbine based on the M16a1, to me. But is has a longer barrel. It's dated around '67 or '68, but I'm not really versed with AR-15 history. Link to post Share on other sites
Bondisthespy Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 It's not a M4 that's for sure Looks like a XM177E1, a carbine based on the M16a1, to me. But is has a longer barrel. It's dated around '67 or '68, but I'm not really versed with AR-15 history. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The weapon you speak about from that picture that is mistake for an M4 i believe is a M655, they were one of the m4 style weapons of time besides the xm177e1/e2. from the history i know about them is that they were issued to Southern Vietnam, but worked they're way into the hands off infantry and special forces on a small basis, if you watch Platoon directed by Oliver Stone, The platoon sergeant Barnes, played by Tom Berrenger. is using a M655, besides him Sergeant Elias played by William Defoe is using one as well. Link to post Share on other sites
Heckler & Koch Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 The weapon you speak about from that picture that is mistake for an M4 i believe is a M655, they were one of the m4 style weapons of time besides the xm177e1/e2. from the history i know about them is that they were issued to Southern Vietnam, but worked they're way into the hands off infantry and special forces on a small basis, if you watch Platoon directed by Oliver Stone, The platoon sergeant Barnes, played by Tom Berrenger. is using a M655, besides him Sergeant Elias played by William Defoe is using one as well. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The gun in the picture can't be a Colt M655 because the Colt M655 has a fixed stock and the one in the picture has a retractable stock. Colt M655 Colt XM-177E2 Corrrect me if I'm wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
expvideo Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 I believe model number (with Colt anyway, KA excluded) does not determine stock type. And of course if that solid stock M655 was available, a retractable stock version would have been too. Aaron Link to post Share on other sites
Heckler & Koch Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 I believe model number (with Colt anyway, KA excluded) does not determine stock type. And of course if that solid stock M655 was available, a retractable stock version would have been too. Aaron <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Do you have a link to support that? Or an image of a Colt M655 with a retractable stock? Link to post Share on other sites
expvideo Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Do you have a link to support that? Or an image of a Colt M655 with a retractable stock? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> How about this, if you have an M655, and an XM, try switching the stocks. They are interchangable. The colapsable would have been available. And don't challenge me for a *fruitcage* link if you don't have one. Save "prove it" for conversations where you can do the same. Link to post Share on other sites
Heckler & Koch Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Geez man, no need to get testy..... Colt XM-177 List of AR-15 Variants Link to post Share on other sites
expvideo Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 model number or not, are you saying I couldn't put a colapsable stock on an M655? Link to post Share on other sites
Heckler & Koch Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 model number or not, are you saying I couldn't put a colapsable stock on an M655? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I don't know about ready interchangeability between retracting and fixed stocks. I don't know if the buffer tube found on fixed stock models has the holes nessecary to lock the stock in either the retracted or open position (or anywhere along the way depending on how many positions the stock has). I would think you could go from retractable to fixed (and then back again) without issue, but not to retractable from a weapon with a fixed stock that never had one. I'd think that would require the buffer tube (not the buffer or anything, just the tube that houses it) to be replaced. Link to post Share on other sites
expvideo Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 I don't know about ready interchangeability between retracting and fixed stocks. I don't know if the buffer tube found on fixed stock models has the holes nessecary to lock the stock in either the retracted or open position (or anywhere along the way depending on how many positions the stock has). I would think you could go from retractable to fixed (and then back again) without issue, but not to retractable from a weapon with a fixed stock that never had one. I'd think that would require the buffer tube (not the buffer or anything, just the tube that houses it) to be replaced. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I believe you are right. So with a new buffer tube and a retractable stock, like I would find on the XM, it would be possible to put a collapsable stock on the 655? And is it that unlikely that the US would ask colt to do that to some of them? Or possibly some soldiers doing it themselves? Aaron Link to post Share on other sites
Heckler & Koch Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Well, yes, it would probably be possible to put a retractable stock from an XM-177 onto a M655. It is probably unlikely that the US military would ask Colt to modify a fixed stock rifle to a retractable stock because it would just be easier to use a rifle that has a fixed stock as standard. Link to post Share on other sites
expvideo Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Why is that so unlikely? They asked them for everything else. And replacing a stock is not a difficult matter. takes a few minutes. And if you go to the manufacturer, they just install it in the first place. FYI the M16 varients are called vaients because the only difference (in general looks) are the front set, and stock. Not hard to turn one varient into another. Besides. I DON'T CARE!!! So what?! Sorry, but I'm going to bed. You win. Not because you're right. Because I'm tired. So why don't we just drop it and let the topic go back to what it's supposed to be. ok? Good job, I usually don't admit defeat. And this wouldn't be an exception if I didn't have to work in 6 hours. But cheers anyways. Good research. Good debate. We shall meet again... Aaron Link to post Share on other sites
Blazer Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Bringing this back on topic ie: pics of VN era gear, here are some friends of mine who specialize is SF. Link to post Share on other sites
Vicks Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 wooo i spy tiger stripes god how i love them so. whats the cammo the guy wearing bottom right? Link to post Share on other sites
Boba_Fett Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Everybody calm down! The M655 with retractable stock is called M653 and Part of the M16A1 Carbine family. This weapon was not used in Vietnam but as "Platoon" was produced on the Phillipines and supported by the Phillipines Army, they used this weapon as carbine version. In tribute to the all beloved Staff-Seargent Barnes I use this weapon By the way 1995 the M653 was produced in a very small series by TM right after the movie. The original Number of the Barnes Rifle is the M653P (as P stands for Philippines version produced under licence by Colt). M655, they were one of the m4 style weapons of time besides the xm177e1/e2. from the history i know about them is that they were issued to Southern Vietnam, but worked they're way into the hands off infantry and special forces on a small basis, if you watch Platoon directed by Oliver Stone, The platoon sergeant Barnes, played by Tom Berrenger. is using a M655, besides him Sergeant Elias played by William Defoe is using one as well. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Nope. First the south vietnamese were armed with M1 Carbine, Garands, 30 cal´s and stuff...... and no grunt would have swapped with one of these ancient rifles With the start of the "vietnamisation" the south vietnam soldiers got M16 rifles. About the M14: Greatest problem as mentioned is, only the Marines used the M14 at the beginning of the war. Marine webbing and outfit is hard to get and more expensive than the 1956er webbing used by the Army. When the M16 became the standard rifle the M14 was used as sniper rifle and replaced for example the still used M1 Garands. Link to post Share on other sites
Crazy_Harry Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 thank you Boba Fett- i thought that was all getting a bit heated over what is, essentially, a very small issue. Link to post Share on other sites
Blue4 Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Thanks Harry and Boba for chilling everyone out!!! Here's some pics from sunday...enjoy...but don't get too wound up by any minor errors!! Link to post Share on other sites
Blue4 Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 and another... Link to post Share on other sites
Blue4 Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Yet another!! Link to post Share on other sites
Blue4 Posted August 23, 2005 Report Share Posted August 23, 2005 Here's on of my TM M14/21 Sniper rifle...yeah I do know that it isn't quite correct....YET Link to post Share on other sites
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