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Vietnam Kit Discussion


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The XM177e1/2 weren't the only M16 carbines used in Vietnam, many different versions were used. Plus the XM177 did have round grips and that's not an M4 in the picture.

 

Minnog: A M14 would be suitable. The Marines who went to Vietnam with M14s used them for over two years before getting M16s. Even then the stayed in circulation as sniper rifles.

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Isn't his gun a little too futuristic?  :blink:

 

They didn't have M4's back in 'Nam. They had XM177's I believe, but not M4's. The M16 came out like in the middle of 'Nam, so how did they already know to make the round foregrip AND a smaller version?

It's not a M4 that's for sure :waggle: Looks like a XM177E1, a carbine based on the M16a1, to me. But is has a longer barrel. It's dated around '67 or '68, but I'm not really versed with AR-15 history.
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It's not a M4 that's for sure  :waggle: Looks like a XM177E1, a carbine based on the M16a1, to me. But is has a longer barrel. It's dated around '67 or '68, but I'm not really versed with AR-15 history.

 

 

The weapon you speak about from that picture that is mistake for an M4 i believe is a M655, they were one of the m4 style weapons of time besides the xm177e1/e2. from the history i know about them is that they were issued to Southern Vietnam, but worked they're way into the hands off infantry and special forces on a small basis, if you watch Platoon directed by Oliver Stone, The platoon sergeant Barnes, played by Tom Berrenger. is using a M655, besides him Sergeant Elias played by William Defoe is using one as well.

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The weapon you speak about from that picture that is mistake for an M4 i believe is a M655, they were one of the m4 style weapons of time besides the xm177e1/e2. from the history i know about them is that they were issued to Southern Vietnam, but worked they're way into the hands off infantry and special forces on a small basis, if you watch Platoon directed by Oliver Stone, The platoon sergeant Barnes, played by Tom Berrenger. is using a M655, besides him Sergeant Elias played by William Defoe is using one as well.

 

The gun in the picture can't be a Colt M655 because the Colt M655 has a fixed stock and the one in the picture has a retractable stock.

 

M655bxx.jpg

Colt M655

 

xm177e2-02.jpg

 

Colt XM-177E2

 

Corrrect me if I'm wrong. ;)

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I believe model number (with Colt anyway, KA excluded) does not determine stock type.  And of course if that solid stock M655 was available, a retractable stock version would have been too.

 

Aaron

 

<_<

 

Do you have a link to support that? Or an image of a Colt M655 with a retractable stock? ;)

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Do you have a link to support that? Or an image of a Colt M655 with a retractable stock?  ;)

 

 

How about this, if you have an M655, and an XM, try switching the stocks. They are interchangable. The colapsable would have been available. And don't challenge me for a *fruitcage* link if you don't have one. Save "prove it" for conversations where you can do the same.

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model number or not, are you saying I couldn't put a colapsable stock on an M655?

 

 

I don't know about ready interchangeability between retracting and fixed stocks. I don't know if the buffer tube found on fixed stock models has the holes nessecary to lock the stock in either the retracted or open position (or anywhere along the way depending on how many positions the stock has). I would think you could go from retractable to fixed (and then back again) without issue, but not to retractable from a weapon with a fixed stock that never had one. I'd think that would require the buffer tube (not the buffer or anything, just the tube that houses it) to be replaced.

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I don't know about ready interchangeability between retracting and fixed stocks. I don't know if the buffer tube found on fixed stock models has the holes nessecary to lock the stock in either the retracted or open position (or anywhere along the way depending on how many positions the stock has). I would think you could go from retractable to fixed (and then back again) without issue, but not to retractable from a weapon with a fixed stock that never had one. I'd think that would require the buffer tube (not the buffer or anything, just the tube that houses it) to be replaced.

 

I believe you are right. So with a new buffer tube and a retractable stock, like I would find on the XM, it would be possible to put a collapsable stock on the 655? And is it that unlikely that the US would ask colt to do that to some of them? Or possibly some soldiers doing it themselves?

 

Aaron

 

<_<

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Well, yes, it would probably be possible to put a retractable stock from an XM-177 onto a M655. It is probably unlikely that the US military would ask Colt to modify a fixed stock rifle to a retractable stock because it would just be easier to use a rifle that has a fixed stock as standard.

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Why is that so unlikely? They asked them for everything else. And replacing a stock is not a difficult matter. takes a few minutes. And if you go to the manufacturer, they just install it in the first place.

 

FYI the M16 varients are called vaients because the only difference (in general looks) are the front set, and stock. Not hard to turn one varient into another. Besides. I DON'T CARE!!! So what?! Sorry, but I'm going to bed. You win. Not because you're right. Because I'm tired. So why don't we just drop it and let the topic go back to what it's supposed to be. ok?

 

Good job, I usually don't admit defeat. And this wouldn't be an exception if I didn't have to work in 6 hours. But cheers anyways. Good research. Good debate. We shall meet again... :assassin:

 

Aaron

 

<_<

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Everybody calm down! The M655 with retractable stock is called M653 and Part of the M16A1 Carbine family. This weapon was not used in Vietnam but as "Platoon" was produced on the Phillipines and supported by the Phillipines Army, they used this weapon as carbine version. In tribute to the all beloved Staff-Seargent Barnes I use this weapon ;)

 

By the way 1995 the M653 was produced in a very small series by TM right after the movie. The original Number of the Barnes Rifle is the M653P (as P stands for Philippines version produced under licence by Colt).

 

M655, they were one of the m4 style weapons of time besides the xm177e1/e2. from the history i know about them is that they were issued to Southern Vietnam, but worked they're way into the hands off infantry and special forces on a small basis, if you watch Platoon directed by Oliver Stone, The platoon sergeant Barnes, played by Tom Berrenger. is using a M655, besides him Sergeant Elias played by William Defoe is using one as well.

 

Nope. First the south vietnamese were armed with M1 Carbine, Garands, 30 cal´s and stuff...... and no grunt would have swapped with one of these ancient rifles :D With the start of the "vietnamisation" the south vietnam soldiers got M16 rifles.

 

About the M14: Greatest problem as mentioned is, only the Marines used the M14 at the beginning of the war. Marine webbing and outfit is hard to get and more expensive than the 1956er webbing used by the Army. When the M16 became the standard rifle the M14 was used as sniper rifle and replaced for example the still used M1 Garands.

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