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jackx

ICS SA80 A2 (L85 A2)

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i have just got my ics sa80 a2 about a month ago, first impression was great got it out of the box with two 450 hi-cap mags with a 1000 rounds cleaning rod and so on, first shot was great chrono was way to high at 420 fps and was easily changable to 360 fps by the quick release spring mechinism, the weapon its self has a nice weight back heavy leans in to the shoulder, the sight is good although i use the susat and is incredibly accurate to the needle, the range is absoloutly perfect as i used it a urban assault. the battery is very easily changable feels very nice to hold and shoot. the gearbox seams very tidy and strong the sa80 comes apart like the real thing using the TMH pins.

 

i did encounter a few problems with it though im not to sure how it is but now after a month of little usage the motor has gone im a little confused why, the pistol grip came loose at the game so i had to strip the trigger mechinism to tighten, it has problems with double feeding :blink: , this is a brand new weapon very nice but im starting to loose confidence in it my self, it seems to me that the ics sa80 is not that good, has any one else who has got one had any similar problems?

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My ICS SA80 has the same double feeding problem but I found it only did it with certain magazines and the problem was on a mag to mag basis regardless of manufacture so I can't say what brand will alleviate this issue so its trial and error. The main problem I found was that the inner barrel is unique to the gun so if you are unhappy with the stock accuracy (mine was like a giant shot gun) you are in trouble because no other inner barrels will fit the gun due to its unique hop up design. If anyone has a solution to the inner barrel issue please spread the knowledge.

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Regarding the barrel. ICS now supply the L85 with a standard barrel rather than the proprietary barrel it originally came with. I know this as I had to replace mine a month ago and the replacement I was supplied with was a standard barrel. After many conversations with Zero One it transpired that they have indeed gone back to using standard barrels (don't know why) and that they have remodeled the clip that fits around the barrel and holds it in the hop unit to accept standard AEG barrels. I've got one in mine now and it works fine, Zero One do have these in stock if anyone wants one. Not too sure about anyone not in the UK though.

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Regarding the barrel. ICS now supply the L85 with a standard barrel rather than the proprietary barrel it originally came with. I know this as I had to replace mine a month ago and the replacement I was supplied with was a standard barrel. After many conversations with Zero One it transpired that they have indeed gone back to using standard barrels (don't know why) and that they have remodeled the clip that fits around the barrel and holds it in the hop unit to accept standard AEG barrels. I've got one in mine now and it works fine, Zero One do have these in stock if anyone wants one. Not too sure about anyone not in the UK though.

 

Thanks for the info!!

 

I wish ICS would have released it with a standard barrel configuration in the first place, but thats airsoft for you.

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Regarding the barrel. ICS now supply the L85 with a standard barrel rather than the proprietary barrel it originally came with. I know this as I had to replace mine a month ago and the replacement I was supplied with was a standard barrel. After many conversations with Zero One it transpired that they have indeed gone back to using standard barrels (don't know why) and that they have remodeled the clip that fits around the barrel and holds it in the hop unit to accept standard AEG barrels. I've got one in mine now and it works fine, Zero One do have these in stock if anyone wants one. Not too sure about anyone not in the UK though.

 

Ah FFS!

 

While I am quite happy with my L85 performance as is being a perpetual tinkerer this annoys me as I had to put in a fair bit of trial and error get the hop to take a white H nub and then apply enough hop to loft .25s to a 50m effective range

 

What inner barrel length are you using now btw?

 

EDIT: That said I did get mine for free in the GZ08 Weekender raffle, think they might have been some of the first in the UK, either way, its gotten me many a good...tag so I shouldn't really complain, at least it will help ICS sell what is indeed a very good rifle.

 

As the OP is banned I will try and offer some constructive info while this topic is here, please note I am writing this on the fly, if people are really interested though I may do a more detailed write up on Monday. Anyway:

 

Construction (External):

 

ICS have used good quality metal and plastics that feel very similar to the real thing and have chosen to replicate the newer A2 handguard, while a bit funky looking this does allow you to fit a standard large capacity pack, I have managed to fit 8.4v 3700mah SubC, 10.8v 2200mah 4/5Sub C and currently use a 9.6v 4300mah SubC pack (which I can't get out but was bought specifically for the gun). The ICS uses a push button locking mechanism to disengage the foregrip from the receiver, making battery changes a doddle.

 

This is where the externals of the ICS fall down a little, if you are a skirmisher who wants an L85 then what follows is irrelevant, if you want absolute realism then beware the following:

 

= The push button release on the foregrip isn't actually how the foregrip is removed on the real thing, the 'button' on the real thing is a locator lug if I recall right. In short the push button mech doesn't look out of place by any stretch but isn't 100% accurate, it is however a practical compromise between user functionality and accurate representation.

 

= The foresight blade protectors are off spec slightly

= The fire mode change lever is off spec and the body lacks the R and A markings, though these are in the manual and it takes a split second to remember which position does what.

= The flashider and gas parts are off spec.

= The hold open catch works the wrong way, on the real one you press it down, on this you push it up.

 

None of the above are significant enough to me to feel that the ICS is inferior to other guns as trades and exact dimensions on a toy aren't that important to me, to someone who hasn't handled an L85 you won't pick up on these things.

 

The receiver has the tiniest amount of flex in it but far, far....far less than the outright wobble that has been in some of the real L85s I've handled.

 

ICS have also done a rather nice paint job, not as shiny as the STAR but then again I would rather have a replica that didn't look like it was dipped in Dulux Gloss.

 

Construction (Internal)

 

Take down with the ICS is very simple and quite close to the real thing, all done receiver pins (yes, I know they are TMH pins really but not everyone uses that terminology). A lovely thing about the ICS is that the electronics and mechanics are kept entirely seperate and the inner barrel is supported by a very solidly affixed to the receiver inner barrel. As I posted the inner barrel take down guide in the news thread I won't drag it over here unless asked but it is a bit more involved than necessary, well, 8 screws I think, 6 of them big chunky ones though.

 

The hop unit is something of a hybrid, its a bit like the TM V7 hop unit meets V2 M4 type, either way, it won't lose its settings and you can use a cross head screwdriver for precise adjustment even though the wheel does click very clearly, either way I have found it quite consistent BUT you need to mod the hop if you want to use H units. I have a Systema rubber and white H hop fitted, I had to reprofile the shape of the hop arm to seat the H bucking into it, you then need to modify the gradient on the hop adjuster and remove some material on the housing to allow a greater range of motion as the reprofiling means you can't apply as much hop with modding the housing and wheel.

 

The gearbox looks like a V7 and V6 hybrid with a touch of STAR style V3. Only thing not standard in there is the nozzle from what I can tell but it could be the same as ICS's AK nozzle having seen a pic of it, tappet I _think_ is unique but this isn't likely to break. The spring guide is a metal bearing type of variable pitch with HI, MED and LO positions, on HI you can get 380fps off of an M100 spring. One thing I've found is that stock this gearbox seems to run very consistently ie FPS variance of 2.

 

The only mechanical issue I have encountered so far I think was wearing in the trigger parts, as there is a long mechanical link between the semi auto cut off and the trigger reset sometimes it stalls meaning your trigger just clicks over, pop into auto will clear it, its very much like the V3 lock up but I have found giving the working parts in the trigger mech a quick spray with WD40 has helped eradicate this issue. As to the trigger mech itself, it should be far less susceptible to erosion like V2/V3 switches are and it looks to be ludicrously easy to mosfet up.

 

Something of note is that due to a good amount of clearance between the gearbox and the receiver, I have been able to install a layer of dynomat extreme inside the gun, this has massively reduced the already quiet audio signature at range. I should mention that when using precomp to acheive higher FPS off a lower rated spring using the variable spring guide you reduce piston head slap, as such the muzzle report stock I have found to be a tad softer than say an M4 having had both shot over my head some metres behind me.

 

Biggest downside? That fracking large connector in the foregrip, 5 minute Deans conversion isn't necessary but makes a much tidier solution.

 

OOTB performance:

 

Once I had set my L85 up to chrono at 350fps I took it to a game to find that it certainly could quite happily pick anything off at 30-40m, rate of fire is ICS standard of 800-900RPM. Feeds fine from ICS and what I think are Dboys mags. Also feeds fine from MAG midcaps and STAR realcaps with some persuasion.

 

Tried installing a Firefly hop, didn't do too much for it, went to my personal favourite combo of Systema and the white H hop with mods outlined earlier and now I have had confirmed eliminations at 50m using .25s firing at 305-307fps when the hop is set, also running the new battery and Modify M100 I get about 1100RPM and thanks to the T3000 motor the trigger response is as crisp as is needed.

 

 

 

 

 

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Ah FFS!

 

While I am quite happy with my L85 performance as is being a perpetual tinkerer this annoys me as I had to put in a fair bit of trial and error get the hop to take a white H nub and then apply enough hop to loft .25s to a 50m effective range

 

What inner barrel length are you using now btw?

 

EDIT: That said I did get mine for free in the GZ08 Weekender raffle, think they might have been some of the first in the UK, either way, its gotten me many a good...tag so I shouldn't really complain, at least it will help ICS sell what is indeed a very good rifle.

 

As the OP is banned I will try and offer some constructive info while this topic is here, please note I am writing this on the fly, if people are really interested though I may do a more detailed write up on Monday. Anyway:

 

Construction (External):

 

ICS have used good quality metal and plastics that feel very similar to the real thing and have chosen to replicate the newer A2 handguard, while a bit funky looking this does allow you to fit a standard large capacity pack, I have managed to fit 8.4v 3700mah SubC, 10.8v 2200mah 4/5Sub C and currently use a 9.6v 4300mah SubC pack (which I can't get out but was bought specifically for the gun). The ICS uses a push button locking mechanism to disengage the foregrip from the receiver, making battery changes a doddle.

 

This is where the externals of the ICS fall down a little, if you are a skirmisher who wants an L85 then what follows is irrelevant, if you want absolute realism then beware the following:

 

= The push button release on the foregrip isn't actually how the foregrip is removed on the real thing, the 'button' on the real thing is a locator lug if I recall right. In short the push button mech doesn't look out of place by any stretch but isn't 100% accurate, it is however a practical compromise between user functionality and accurate representation.

 

= The foresight blade protectors are off spec slightly

= The fire mode change lever is off spec and the body lacks the R and A markings, though these are in the manual and it takes a split second to remember which position does what.

= The flashider and gas parts are off spec.

= The hold open catch works the wrong way, on the real one you press it down, on this you push it up.

 

None of the above are significant enough to me to feel that the ICS is inferior to other guns as trades and exact dimensions on a toy aren't that important to me, to someone who hasn't handled an L85 you won't pick up on these things.

 

The receiver has the tiniest amount of flex in it but far, far....far less than the outright wobble that has been in some of the real L85s I've handled.

 

ICS have also done a rather nice paint job, not as shiny as the STAR but then again I would rather have a replica that didn't look like it was dipped in Dulux Gloss.

 

Construction (Internal)

 

Take down with the ICS is very simple and quite close to the real thing, all done receiver pins (yes, I know they are TMH pins really but not everyone uses that terminology). A lovely thing about the ICS is that the electronics and mechanics are kept entirely seperate and the inner barrel is supported by a very solidly affixed to the receiver inner barrel. As I posted the inner barrel take down guide in the news thread I won't drag it over here unless asked but it is a bit more involved than necessary, well, 8 screws I think, 6 of them big chunky ones though.

 

The hop unit is something of a hybrid, its a bit like the TM V7 hop unit meets V2 M4 type, either way, it won't lose its settings and you can use a cross head screwdriver for precise adjustment even though the wheel does click very clearly, either way I have found it quite consistent BUT you need to mod the hop if you want to use H units. I have a Systema rubber and white H hop fitted, I had to reprofile the shape of the hop arm to seat the H bucking into it, you then need to modify the gradient on the hop adjuster and remove some material on the housing to allow a greater range of motion as the reprofiling means you can't apply as much hop with modding the housing and wheel.

 

The gearbox looks like a V7 and V6 hybrid with a touch of STAR style V3. Only thing not standard in there is the nozzle from what I can tell but it could be the same as ICS's AK nozzle having seen a pic of it, tappet I _think_ is unique but this isn't likely to break. The spring guide is a metal bearing type of variable pitch with HI, MED and LO positions, on HI you can get 380fps off of an M100 spring. One thing I've found is that stock this gearbox seems to run very consistently ie FPS variance of 2.

 

The only mechanical issue I have encountered so far I think was wearing in the trigger parts, as there is a long mechanical link between the semi auto cut off and the trigger reset sometimes it stalls meaning your trigger just clicks over, pop into auto will clear it, its very much like the V3 lock up but I have found giving the working parts in the trigger mech a quick spray with WD40 has helped eradicate this issue. As to the trigger mech itself, it should be far less susceptible to erosion like V2/V3 switches are and it looks to be ludicrously easy to mosfet up.

 

Something of note is that due to a good amount of clearance between the gearbox and the receiver, I have been able to install a layer of dynomat extreme inside the gun, this has massively reduced the already quiet audio signature at range. I should mention that when using precomp to acheive higher FPS off a lower rated spring using the variable spring guide you reduce piston head slap, as such the muzzle report stock I have found to be a tad softer than say an M4 having had both shot over my head some metres behind me.

 

Biggest downside? That fracking large connector in the foregrip, 5 minute Deans conversion isn't necessary but makes a much tidier solution.

 

OOTB performance:

 

Once I had set my L85 up to chrono at 350fps I took it to a game to find that it certainly could quite happily pick anything off at 30-40m, rate of fire is ICS standard of 800-900RPM. Feeds fine from ICS and what I think are Dboys mags. Also feeds fine from MAG midcaps and STAR realcaps with some persuasion.

 

Tried installing a Firefly hop, didn't do too much for it, went to my personal favourite combo of Systema and the white H hop with mods outlined earlier and now I have had confirmed eliminations at 50m using .25s firing at 305-307fps when the hop is set, also running the new battery and Modify M100 I get about 1100RPM and thanks to the T3000 motor the trigger response is as crisp as is needed.

 

I appreciate your review of this rifle. I just got mine yesterday, and though my G&G L85A2 is more accurate on the external specs to the real steel assault rifle, I nevertheless prefer my ICS version. I feel it has less quirks and failings than the G&G version. I'm a bit worried though about the proprietary inner barrel. I don't know what my rifle has. Im still a bit apprehensive about openning the gearbox for upgrading, since I'm pretty happy with my L85/SA80's performance.

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Regarding the barrel. ICS now supply the L85 with a standard barrel rather than the proprietary barrel it originally came with. I know this as I had to replace mine a month ago and the replacement I was supplied with was a standard barrel. After many conversations with Zero One it transpired that they have indeed gone back to using standard barrels (don't know why) and that they have remodeled the clip that fits around the barrel and holds it in the hop unit to accept standard AEG barrels. I've got one in mine now and it works fine, Zero One do have these in stock if anyone wants one. Not too sure about anyone not in the UK though.

 

As I am contemplating on upgrading my unit, I would appreciate it if you can tell me if the piston body is a standard sized one or if it uses the same long-type piston body of my earlier G&G L85A2. Thanks.

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I guess it was about establishing my priorities.

 

I never really considered the Star/Ares, TBH. I already have one Ares AEG and that’s quite enough to be going on with in terms of fettling ;) . I guess if I was more concerned about having the most realistic L85A2 AEG or eventually bunging a RIS onto it, I’d have looked at the Star, but my priorities are different.

 

For me it had to be ICS because of OOTB reliability, ease of disassembly, innovative features and the price – Gunman Midlands was offering them at an introductory price of £256.

 

 

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I guess it was about establishing my priorities.

 

I never really considered the Star/Ares, TBH. I already have one Ares AEG and that's quite enough to be going on with in terms of fettling ;) . I guess if I was more concerned about having the most realistic L85A2 AEG or eventually bunging a RIS onto it, I'd have looked at the Star, but my priorities are different.

 

For me it had to be ICS because of OOTB reliability, ease of disassembly, innovative features and the price – Gunman Midlands was offering them at an introductory price of £256.

 

So you didn't really look at the other versions and compare the differences?

 

I handled the real versions when I was a Army Cadet many years ago, so am also leaning towards the ICS version, since it is more realistic.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I was already aware of the discourse surrounding the Star, the G&G and the ICS. This meant I could rule out the Star early on, because of the priorities I'd set and Star not really meeting those too well (from what I'd perceived).

 

In the end it came down to a choice between the ICS and the G&G and the ICS won, because it met my requirements (listed above) better. Having said that, a team mate has had excellent service from his G&G for a good few years; although on the whole, anecdotal evidence seems to suggest they are not as reliable as the ICS.

 

A big selling point for me was the G&G's pre-cocked feature, but that was outweighed for me by other innovations in the ICS'.

 

Edit:

 

I handled the real versions when I was a Army Cadet many years ago, so am also leaning towards the ICS version, since it is more realistic.

 

I get the impression the Star version is seen as more realistic. YMMV. It's probably worth PMing Panoptes, who is a big Star L85/authenticity fan.

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Could you two explain why you choosen the ICS version over the Stars version please?

 

Am still having problems deciding between the two.

 

 

For me the main drawback for the star version as i discovered, was the plastic gearbox.

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Have you had a chance to throw in any upgrades, warspite? I should hopefully get my ICS L85A2 soon, so I'd be interested to know what you found worked.

 

 

I have indeed. I had the gears replaced with Systema Energy Helical STU ratio gears. I also had a MOSFET installed and replaced the piston body and piston head with a Tactical Unlimited Titanium Teeth Piston Body (the version with a tooth less for a higher ROF) and Systema Duracon Piston Head. Decided to keep the ICS Turbo 300 motor. Finally, for a spring, I had a Systema M130 installed. My unit now clocks at 460 fps.

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well i got my ICS SA80 about a year ago, its just gone into fire support for a full upgrade and i want to now if you can fit the star/ ares UGL to it as ive been told you can but can you do it if you mod the luncher at all.

 

Thanks

 

Parky

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what battery is everyone using for this? minis just rattle around and my large batterys are too large.

 

I am using a component shop 9.6v Sub C 4300mah NimH pack, fits in no problems. I've actually wrapped mine in a few layers of electrical tape to try and make it a slightly snugger fit and to hide the luminous green/yellow colour. If you pop the front plate/cover off the foregrip (use a flat head screw driver) you can then add some foam to stop the battery sliding and forwards, I used some sponge spray painted black and you can't tell it's there unless you're looking for it once the cover is replaced.

 

Technically, you can fit up to 12v 4/5 SubC 2200mah pack in there or almost any decently sized lipol.

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I'm dead set on picking one of these up with my op bonus when I get back in November, but I have one concern - the flash suppressor.

 

I don't know why they didn't try and get closer to the real thing, it's almost like they just couldn't be bothered! I can see a much better one is available on the ICS website, under the L85 accessories, that seems to be a perfect copy of the real thing. Has anyone made the change, and if so, where did you get it from?

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I have owned one of these for a few months now and although its gone back under warranty due to the piston & Hop need replacing.....

 

this is one of the best aeg's ive owned (and ive had a good few), its very practical, accuracy is awsome and range is good for a "out the box" rifle.

 

i wont go too much into detail but i would reccomend the ics over the star/ares version any day. I looked into both in massive detail for months before i made my mind up. The ICS is by far more practical for airsofting, the so called visual differences between the real steel and the ics l85 are the main talking points on this rifle but they are very small differences and in my mind not even worth talking about to be fair.

 

if your reading this trying to decide what one to choose then my advice would be ics all day long. You wont regret it what so ever

 

 

 

as to the flash eliminator they just need the slits filing out as per real steel (as there quite small), or just leave as they are (not to noticeable to be honest)

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Mine just arrived in the post today and do agree with the flash supressor being a bit dissapointing as are the lack of markings and I had hassle getting the TMH back on at the front after stripping, but overall it looks uber sexy and I can't wait to try it tomorrow after the LiPo has finished charging biggrin.gif

 

Just need to save up to get the ACOG next month!

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ok Im having a strange and annoying problem with mine, what happens is when i pull the trigger nothing happens, no clicks, no sound of the motor trying to turn but if i give it a bang on the side or rear of the gun i can get a few shots off and then it happens again, Ive checked to make sure no wires are being nipped and done a visual inspection of the contacts which look ok, any ideas guys ?

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