Freight Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Hey all I just wanted to get some opinions on CQB aeg's from you guys particularly M4's. Basically i want to buy a CQB style M4 for use in places like the Mall and epsom tunnels etc so it needs to match their FPS limits etc, But i would like to be able to use use it in wood lands as a back up or if a friend would like to try airsoft. So i was wondering if anyone had bought a cqb M4 and as standard was very suprised by its ability to hold its own in a woodland environment. I was looking at the G&P M4's but i was wondering if these may be a little to "hot " for the sites cheers Ian Link to post Share on other sites
L4byr1nth Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 An M4's an M4, GB wise. Nearly all the AEG's I see at our (Woodland) site are M4's, from Stubby's, to CQB's, etc. As long as it has a good HOP, it doesn't really matter too much what the FPS is. Go Tokyo Marui (About 280 FPS), or if the sites allow, Classic Army (About 310 FPS). Ben. Link to post Share on other sites
shmook Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 i swear by my CA cqb. most on here dislike the brand, but meh. i play woodland, and the only thing that would outrange it were M14's. well, before hot clones came along and werent chronoed there... anyway, 330 fps out of the box, bombproof (except for the trigger contacts though), compact, good ROF, even on an 8.4, and range. sounds like its what you need in your life! Link to post Share on other sites
kelo 1 1 Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Standard limits for CQB is 328, i own two G&P M4's. Both are CQB based, one being a standard CQB and the other being the EOD. I would reccomend both to anyone. Both run around 315, completely stock with 8.4v batteries. Personally, the externals on the G&P's are one of the best. Ive also had no problems with them internally If you have the money, its worth the investment. On the range front i use these at Milsim events at large FIBUA sites and have never had a problem compared to other longer barreled AEG's Kris Link to post Share on other sites
The General Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 ACM P90 with a spring down grade to get it to just under 330 fps sounds ideal to me. Perhaps replace the rubber with a TM hop rubber and fit a H nub from Element. Clean and regrease the box (easy to do) and you have a CQB monster that can range with just about any other gun at the 328 fps limit set. Its easy to get great range when you are running 400 fps on a tightbore with good BB's that annoys the hell out of me! I see so many people playing this stupid "fps arms race" and I get even more annoyed that many sites seem to turn a blind eye to hot guns. Nice to see someone actually trying to strike a sensible and reasonable compromise. Respect due. Or get a nice G36 with the same downgrade. Link to post Share on other sites
spetsnazdave87 Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 I was really surprised by my stock ICS CQC... really short gun but the RoF and accuracy out the box were awesome! Highly recommend Link to post Share on other sites
shmook Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Its easy to get great range when you are running 400 fps on a tightbore with good BB's that annoys the hell out of me! I see so many people playing this stupid "fps arms race" and I get even more annoyed that many sites seem to turn a blind eye to hot guns. this really gets me too, the whole 'blind eye' thing. folk get a cheap gun, way less than a 'mainstream' brand (i know, i know), but wont spend a couple of quid more for a lower spring. and then a site doesnt chrono them. grrr. on another note, as said, P90's have mad range. MAD, I TELLS YA! Link to post Share on other sites
Warning Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 my p90's range is out standing, and its completely stock The other thing that surprised me when i was at my local site (Unreal Airsoft) was my G3 which again is stock, but i found out, (when we all had to do a compusory chrono), that the spring has softened so its shooting at about 260 instead and the range was amazing, which goes to show that its definitely not all about FPS, but a damn good hop unit which the G3 and the P90 both have Link to post Share on other sites
Stealthbomber Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 An M4's an M4, GB wise. ORLY? As long as it has a good HOP, it doesn't really matter too much what the FPS is. Go Tokyo Marui (About 280 FPS), or if the sites allow, Classic Army (About 310 FPS). ICS M4 does NOT have the same gearbox as any other M4. It DOES have a rotary hop-up, similar to a G3 or P90 so it's much better than almost all other M4s in that respect. The split gearbox means you could fit a TM spring in the gun and use it for CQB and then buy a 2nd upper gearbox, bung a 1J spring in it, and use it in woodland. If you really wanted to go the whole hog you could buy a 2nd upper receiver and front end so you have a CQB upper with a 9" barrel and a Woodland upper with a 15" barrel. The 2-part gearbox allows you to change everything about the gun really easily. Link to post Share on other sites
kruck Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 I'm gonna second ICS here, fires bang on 300, excellent range for woodland, brilliant in urban too with the stock retracted Mines a "commando" version, so M733 length-ish, rather than the CQB version (which I've heard and seen are just as good). Link to post Share on other sites
L4byr1nth Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 I'm not sure why I put GB... I just meant they're basically like any other AEG. In fact, I probably meant AEG. But yes, ICS are nice guns, and a lot of people swear by them. Ben. Link to post Share on other sites
vowlesy Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 I just got my ICS M16, and as said above they're fantastic, obviousily i would'nt recommend a M16 for CQB just thought i'd reccomend ICS M4s as its exactly the same as a M4 just a longer barrel, in airsoft i mean. Link to post Share on other sites
Punkypink Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 My Galaxy MP5K's a lot more potent than most people realise. And it isnt big and bulky and sticks out for miles like most AR variants do. It screams CQB. Link to post Share on other sites
Stealthbomber Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Hey all I just wanted to get some opinions on CQB aeg's from you guys particularly M4's. Basically i want to buy a CQB style M4 for use in places like the Mall and epsom tunnels etc so.... ACM P90 with.... Or get a nice G36 with... my p90's range is... My MP5K's a... Always read the question. I'll grant you that the OP didn't only ask for information about M4s but, let's face it, if he likes M4s it might help if you actually post something that compares your CQB weapon of choice with a similar M4. Link to post Share on other sites
Punkypink Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Yes and some of us are providing an alternative point of view. He might like M4s but it's hasty to assume he doesn't want anything else or be interested to hear about other AEGs. It's airsoft, if it can shoot as far as a M4-bodied AEG, then who's to say it doesn't bear comparism? You hear about lots of people with TM MP7 AEPs who've got it set up to be fantastic CQB weapons but very usable for woodland games as a primary too. One of the key things about Arnies is its ability to provide alternate PoVs or suggestions that might not have been looked at yet. Moreover, since you say always read the question, then I have to point out he said he want opinions on CQB AEGs (such as, oh, I dunno, P90s, MP5Ks?) and with regards to M4s he said "particularly" not "exclusively". Link to post Share on other sites
Stealthbomber Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Yes and I'm providing an alternative point of view. He might like M4s but it's hasty to assume he doesn't want anything else or be interested to hear about other AEGs. It's airsoft, if it can shoot as far as a M4-bodied AEG, then who's to say it doesn't bear comparism? You hear about lots of people with TM MP7 AEPs who've got it set up to be fantastic CQB weapons but very usable for woodland games as a primary too. Frankly, I've never heard of anybody who's done anything particularly special with an MP7 but, hey-ho. Anyway, I was just reminding people that the guy is interested in M4s. Perhaps, if you've skirmished with an M4, you could add some comments as to the relative merits of each gun in order to compare them in a logical way. Moreover, since you say always read the question, then I have to point out he said he want opinions on CQB AEGs (such as, oh, I dunno, P90s, MP5Ks?) and with regards to M4s he said "particularly" not "exclusively". I'll grant you that the OP didn't only ask for information about M4s but, let's face it, if he likes M4s it might help if you actually post something that compares your CQB weapon of choice with a similar M4. And your point is? Link to post Share on other sites
Punkypink Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Well, the general opinion on lots of MP7 threads is that the TM hop is so good that it gives the MP7 the range to be pratical as a woodland primary, and the extendable stock is sturdy enough to allow for stability when firing long range. There is a lot of talk about LiPo-ing them and stuff for great CQB RoFs, and the compact size is great with the stock collasped for CQB. I haven't personally owned one, but then again, learning isn't always dependent on personal experience alone. Personally I would compare the actual issues of size, bulkiness, ease of manoeuvrability between various CQB weapons. As someone who's actually played at Epsom tunnels, I have to say that Epsom tunnels, is actually almost long range combat underground so size isn't as big an issue, but if we talk about conventional CQB sites then size is a lot more important, which is where the M4 is at a disadvantage. Only M4 I would personally use is the stubby CQB killer one. And your point is? That we did. There is enough info kicking around on the M4 that we do not actually need to keep going "this is the AEG I use for CQB, it compares up to the M4 in this way" in our posts. We'll talk about the alternate non-M4 stuff, and I'm sure the OP can do the comparisions himself. He's not stupid you know But if we must actually mention the M4, then I could say things like "With the barrel length of an M4 it makes it harder to roll on the ground during CQB than a MP5K". Of course, that already comes under "ease of manoeuvrability" so it's a bit redundant. Or if you don't think thats helpful enough, I can go break out the tape measure and start posting physical measurements. Maybe even break out the kitchen scale too. Link to post Share on other sites
greg Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Hey all I just wanted to get some opinions on CQB aeg's from you guys particularly M4's. Basically i want to buy a CQB style M4 for use in places like the Mall and epsom tunnels etc so it needs to match their FPS limits etc, But i would like to be able to use use it in wood lands as a back up or if a friend would like to try airsoft. So i was wondering if anyone had bought a cqb M4 and as standard was very surprised by its ability to hold its own in a woodland environment. I was looking at the G&P M4's but i was wondering if these may be a little to "hot " for the sites cheers Ian Firstly I have to tell ya, I don't get on with M16-a-likes. The mag catch is the main functional draw back: It's fine for dropping mags on the floor at the push of a button, but I prefer AK or G36 style releases. & then there is the fact (prepairs to be toasted by all the fans) that the ver2 gearbox ain't all that. The poo-hop & where oh where do you put a decent battery? Get yourself a beta-spetz, G36c or P90. These are all incredible cqbers with 247(ish)mm barrels & excellent hop units, which are fine for producing accuracy at longer ranges. I do a load of cqb (hi Tom, hi Lee ), own & prefer to use these 3 guns. I also own a CA 15 CQB which I love the look of, but just don't enjoy using. Having got that off my chest, there are 2 M16-a-likes which have, er, impressed me. Well, more like depressed me less than other '16's! The CA 15 CQB: you can slap a 9.6v 4300mah in the butt & rof is great, chronos between 330 & 345, feels solid, internals last, relatively accurate for a '16'. & the CA (I think M4) sportline. A really fit gun. At a really fit price. It kind of makes sense. If you must have an Armalite, don't waste money on an expensive one, when a cheapy will do. Greg. To the m16 support brigade: Please don't waste your breath defending your choice of weapon. You are as entitled to your preferences as I am. I respect your choice, but I choose something else. Link to post Share on other sites
GuzziHero Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 ICS-29 CQB Pistol. Thanks to its plastic hop, even with a 185mm barrel the range is outstanding. Link to post Share on other sites
Freight Posted June 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Good morning Guys and Girls Well first off, Thanks for every ones opinion on here as it has opened up some options for me with regards to the ICS M4's and the CA varients. I have heard about G&P externals being fantastic but heard about the hop etc being a bit rubbish hence why i mentioned them. I dont want people to argue over the direction my question was coming from and creating Ill feelings Essentially a lot of my kit is based around my VFC scar L, with regards to mags pouches etc. so the thought of an M4 would mean that i could use a lot of the same kit i already have and also share my kit out if a friend wants to try, also the team i play for really enjoy cqb and want to get better at at so we all carry rather light load outs and since all my team mates use the M4, we can all swap mags in case in game one of us ends up needing another after being a bit triger happy. so if i could find one that is a cqb based but holds its own in woodland then thats all good other Options are always cool though, i must admit a P90 is very tempting especially as im a closet stargate fan and i didnt really think of it, that maybe another one to add to the list cheers Ian Link to post Share on other sites
Punkypink Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 A dual-stack M-16 mag pouch can hold 3 MP5 mags side by side, so your loadout would probably not need to change much, if at all. Link to post Share on other sites
Jay7 Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Don't discount KA M4's as well,I've a Troy CQB and its a fine bit of kit. Link to post Share on other sites
vowlesy Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 I knwo Greg you said don't bother trying to defend your M16s as we're entitled to our own opinions and oviousily things like the mag catch are matters of opinion, i much prefer M4 style mag releases for reloading, but with the crappy hop up, ICS and lots more now aswell have a round drum G36 one and they've modified the V2 gearbox with the split system and my friends but 110k rounds through his ICS M4 and only changed the hop rubber and it outranges most guns except M14s at our sites, G36 or P90 really dont compare in range or accuracy wise, but this is just personal experiance and preference and as you said we're entitled to our own opinion. Link to post Share on other sites
Delfi Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 If your concern is about using mags and pouches and sharing with friends then it's worth bearing in mind that you can get a (relatively cheap and easy to fit) magwell converter for the G36 that allows it to use M4/M16/SCAR (STANAG style) mags. If you're a fan of M4's then I have to echo what folks have said about the ICS. I own 2 of these and they're excellent and have the added bonus of having the wonderfully designed split gearbox and a decent hop unit. The solid stock varieties can take a large high capacity battery too. My personal choice is the 74SU but that brings in the need for new batteries and mags. HTH D Link to post Share on other sites
galactica Posted June 27, 2009 Report Share Posted June 27, 2009 I knwo Greg you said don't bother trying to defend your M16s as we're entitled to our own opinions and oviousily things like the mag catch are matters of opinion, i much prefer M4 style mag releases for reloading, but with the crappy hop up, ICS and lots more now aswell have a round drum G36 one and they've modified the V2 gearbox with the split system and my friends but 110k rounds through his ICS M4 and only changed the hop rubber and it outranges most guns except M14s at our sites, G36 or P90 really dont compare in range or accuracy wise, but this is just personal experiance and preference and as you said we're entitled to our own opinion. You are setting up a big stall there for yourself with the "P90 doesn't compare" because pretty much everyone will argue with that - the TM P90 has insane range and that's as near to an established airsoft fact as it gets. What M4s have rotary hops apart from ICS though? You say "lots more" - ? Link to post Share on other sites
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