Jump to content

WE vs WA


Stealthbomber

Recommended Posts

:rolleyes:

 

Seeing as how a few WE supporters decided to invade the AGM M4 thread with the specific intention of waving their epenises around and refused to stop, I've created this thread to paste all the applicable bullsh*t into.

 

I would have simply deleted it all but then it'd be an evil moderator conspiracy and we can't have that.

I wasn't about to leave it all there because it's cluttering up a thread full of useful information and, frankly, it has no place there.

 

The only other thing I'd like to say is that it really really saddens me when I ask for people to stop the trolling and they just ignore me and continue.

I could get all whup-*albatross* and issue warning points but that won't fix the mentality of people who seem compelled to continue an argument even after being asked to stop. :(

 

Anyway, this is how it started:-

 

Can someone roll up all the guides on how to make the AGM skirmishable into one topic?

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 167
  • Created
  • Last Reply
By hanging it on the wall and buying a decent AEG instead.

Best tip you'll ever get for a gas-in-the-mag GBB rifle. ;)

 

Works well if your life's mission is to be boring and troll away in the GBB M4 threads.

 

If you actually want to contribute to the thread, do so. Otherwise... Don't.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I skirmished with my WE M16A3 yesterday. What a great gun.

 

While I was there, a friend had just got the AGM, and it was in the boot of his car while he skirmished with something else :rofl:

 

Anyway, he let me have a play with it. It actually felt alright. You can tell where they cut the corners - cheap handguards, cheap looking-body. Stock was fairly nice, similar in feel to a CA composite.

 

Mags weigh a tonne compared to my WE mags. Not sure why. It's a silly weight for Airsoft, though.

 

Ben.

Link to post
Share on other sites
By hanging it on the wall and buying a decent AEG instead.

Best tip you'll ever get for a gas-in-the-mag GBB rifle. ;)

 

Could i ask how you came to that conclusion.

I have used my agm m4 this weekend and it did not do to badly,the bolt stop worked perfectly until the steel insert fell off but this is no bigger as this is one of the thing i was going to upgrade eventualy.

I have had decent aeg's give me more grief first time out of the box than the agm m4 plus the gbb's are a lot easier to work on than any aeg that i now of which makes it a lot easier to repair and upgrade.

Link to post
Share on other sites
I skirmished with my WE M16A3 yesterday. What a great gun.

 

While I was there, a friend had just got the AGM, and it was in the boot of his car while he skirmished with something else :rofl:

 

Anyway, he let me have a play with it. It actually felt alright. You can tell where they cut the corners - cheap handguards, cheap looking-body. Stock was fairly nice, similar in feel to a CA composite.

 

Mags weigh a tonne compared to my WE mags. Not sure why. It's a silly weight for Airsoft, though.

 

Ben.

So, you just come here to say how much you love your WE and how cheapo the AGM is.

Well, you're right the AGM is dirt cheap and I could buy 3 of them for the price of one WE, so isn't it fair to expect the WE to be 3 times better? :rofl:

Link to post
Share on other sites

More of a comparative impression, but of course, my WE is miles better, as it stands. S'like comparing an original VFC to the DBoys clone :rofl:

 

I've yet to see how it shoots, that'll have to wait 'til the next skirmish.

 

I will say that it's fairly impressive for the price, but the plastic internals are a little off-putting. The receiver is the main thing that initially put me off.

 

Until I see it working, I personally wouldn't buy one over the WE or WA if I had the chance, but that might change when I actually see it in action.

 

Ben.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to agree with Ben I am afraid about some of the negative points, the handguard is very dissapointing, cheap plastic feeling aeg handguard. Having said that, it is only as disappointing as any aeg I guess, so it depends what you compare it to. The stock feels great, nice realistic looking and feeling material, such as the furniture on the WE. Shame they didnt use the same for the foregrip, but hey ho. I didnt really mind the weight of the magazine too much myself, at least I will notice if I drop one! It is a shame that it lacks trademarks, but remember that the WE also lacked trades too when it was first released. Also as was mentioned bear in mind the price tag, not that I would expect it to be ######, I would still expect it to work if it only cost £10, but you wouldnt race a Ferrarri with a Metro.

 

At first impression I am delighted with this gun. It looks and feels pretty good. My one has no wobble etc that I wouldnt expect to be there. Bolt could maybe be a little heavier, and of course the handguard thing, trades would be nice, but rather have no trades than wrong trades, so not too bothered with that (if it was a WE then I would only want the trades version, at that price I can be picky!). When I first saw pictures of it I thought it looked awful, so I was pleasantly surprised when I actually saw one in the flesh so to speak. I would still like a WE, but I like my new gun.

 

As far as firing it is concerned, I havent had much of a chance to do that, in fact I have had zero chance so far as initially I had planned to skirmish it in the afternoon, but due to an epic failure on my aeg, I didnt play at all in the morning, so needed to abuse some ammo in the afternoon, which relegated the new gun to the boot of my car for the afternoon. Still, it gives me the chance to fiddle about with it before my next skirmish. I am going to test later to see if I get the dribble problem when I point the gun downwards.

 

I am not too bothered about the plastic nozzle etc. I would probably go as far as to say that the plastic will probably have a higher breaking point than some of that cheap pot metal rubbish that often finds its way into replica guns (a legal issue I belive to do with the soppy firearm laws in Japan and China), and that usually ends up in the most important parts making you have to spend more money on replacement parts (hang on a mo, maybe they are doing it on purpose).

 

So, compared to a WE, it is not as nice. Compared to an aeg, it is far nicer even if it doesnt fire! (remember that I havent tried that yet, I am not saying that my gun doesnt work!!) I really like this gun so far. It is often easier to say that I dont like this because, or I dont like that because, than it is to say what you do like about a gun if you like one. I am sure that the list of what I didnt like would be much longer than just a couple of points if I didnt like the gun. Fingers crossed now that the gun works!

 

I would also like to point out that there is, in my opinion due to the way the guns actually work, less to go wrong on gas guns than aegs. Anyone who doesnt know much about them (I am in that bracket to a degree) will think they sound rubbish at first, you have to change the hop unit, you have to change the barrel, you need to change the bolt, the seals, the mags, the list goes on and on. But...it doesnt really. If you take an aeg, not something like a systema, but any regular middle of the road you can rely on aeg. You can replace the hop to make it better. You can swap the barrel to make it more accurate. You can put a high speed motor in. You can swap the gears. That list also goes on and on and on, but people tend to look at that slightly differently for some reason. It is true that you cannot reliably use a gas blowback gun such as this in freezing temperatures, you cannot use most gas blowback pistols in freezing temperatures, but I wouldnt dream of swapping to an aep (I have one for the winter period, but replace my gas it will not). There are disadvantages to using different types of gun no matter what. AEGs battery consumption etc.

 

Anyway, I am waffling now. To sumise, I like this gun so far.

Link to post
Share on other sites

When I saw Spence's gun, I have to admit to being impressed.

 

From the reviews on the forum, I thought I knew what to expect. And that wasn't much. I'd agree with Spence when he says the pictures look a lot worse than the gun in the flesh.

 

Actually, there was nothing WRONG with it, per se, but for less than the cost of most ACM AEG's, it felt fairly nice. Nothing felt like it was going to fall off, but it was just cheap feeling. Which it is. So no surprises there, then.

 

I think, as someone wise once said, I'll reserve my final judgment 'til I see it shoot. It might be an awesome gun out of the box, it might need some of the parts changing, who knows?

 

Once Spence gets his finger out and shoots the damn thing, I'll be able to tell you! ;)

 

Ben.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the main reason to get the AGM is the cost savings in the end. One particular forum user (not sure if this forum) built two of the same GBBRs one a WA and one an AGM. Much of the upgrades on both weapons are Inokatsu, RATech, G&P, and a little WA. Overall both guns performed exactly the same and the only difference in the end was the cost. His AGM build was way cheaper in the end.

 

I'll try and find the link or copy here.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I would also like to add, that it is in no way about being cheap, or cheaper for that matter. I dont want to offend anybody by implying that they have cheap stuff etc. I guess it would be more appropriate to say that it suited my budget better. :) If I had enough of the stuff spare I would save it and buy the gas powered minigun! :P

Link to post
Share on other sites
I skirmished with my WE M16A3 yesterday. What a great gun.

 

While I was there, a friend had just got the AGM, and it was in the boot of his car while he skirmished with something else :rofl:

 

Anyway, he let me have a play with it. It actually felt alright. You can tell where they cut the corners - cheap handguards, cheap looking-body. Stock was fairly nice, similar in feel to a CA composite.

 

Mags weigh a tonne compared to my WE mags. Not sure why. It's a silly weight for Airsoft, though.

 

Ben.

 

 

 

Stop trolling the WA system forums, the we system blows..trust me ive had my fair share of playing with them...the recoil isnt even close to the wa syetem..and ive been around the we's and the wa's

 

 

Ive seen the people with we's get shocked of the recoil and the performance of a wa. Ive messed around with w stock wa a mild upgrade wa and a highly upgraded wa' 1700.00

 

Even the stock wa system on 134a kills the we in performance.

 

so stop trolling, to make your self feel better about the performance of a we..

 

Realistic bolt FTW!

Link to post
Share on other sites
So, you just come here to say how much you love your WE and how cheapo the AGM is.

Well, you're right the AGM is dirt cheap and I could buy 3 of them for the price of one WE, so isn't it fair to expect the WE to be 3 times better? :rofl:

Actually I own both and I can honestly say it is. Besides all the pins falling out. The selector switch also pushes out with no force. The bolt stop does not work, EXTREME receiver wobble, we wont go into the mag because that is a issue in its own...........but for the price it is what I expected. Firing when the mag holds gas it actually shoots decent. The one problem with the hop up is no matter how you adjust it it still has no hop. Its like the fps is what gets the bbs down range. Either or the only reason I posted is because you sure are confident with the AGM and when someone mentions WE you get all offensive and feel like you have to try and knock the WE M4. Don't get me wrong my ver 1 WE had its issues but with all the upgrades that cost next to nothing the gun is flawless. The CO2 kit along with the 6.02tb barrel this thing out performs any G&P that I have encountered. They would say the same thing out of honesty. If you want to compare the AGM with the AWSS CO2 M4 it is at least 3 times better. I'm giving a honest opinion since I own both and a few friends have WOC's.
Link to post
Share on other sites
If you want to compare the AGM with the AWSS CO2 M4 it is at least 3 times better. I'm giving a honest opinion since I own both and a few friends have WOC's.

Erm, yeah but how about comparing the WE M4 to a decent AEG while you're at it?

 

There are AEGs that can totally blow the WE M4 out of the water for range, accuracy, reliability and running costs.

 

It's all very well saying that one gas gun is better than the other when, in fact, they're ALL still inferior to a decent AEG when it comes to practical comparison.

 

The only reason to choose a gas rifle instead of an AEG is for the experience of shooting it.

From that POV the WA design has higher recoil and is more realistic in construction which scores it big points with a lot of people.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

But you have to compromise, and I think the WE presents the best balance of realism and performance out of the two.

 

I'm hoping to see the AGM shoot next week at another skirmish. I'll be interested in out of the box performance.

 

Ben.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Stealthbomber: I would ask you to qualify your statement here.

 

If I pull an AEG of the same size, and price range out of a box and compared it with the current AWSS WE out of the box and load it with the same ammo, at room temperature, the WE would outshoot the AEG, and would finish a mag, and be quite happy. Most AEGs don't come with tightbores or shoot at the power of the WE.

 

Effectiveness at a skirmish however would depend on a) the type of game B) the type of user. Obviously you can use an AEG by pure spammage/recce by fire, while WE users would be more picky with fire control.

 

Maintenance wise, There are 2 screws to get to the firing pin, 2 screws and 1 pin to get to the hammer, and one screw to disassemble the bolt assembly.

 

Who here has tuned/reshimmed a mechbox? How long does it take to ensure it goes well particularly when upgrading past M130 (which is where the tuning really makes a difference)? Hours, and depends on how good of a job the manufacturer has made their parts for them to fit. I have had gears not fit bushings, trigger blocks not fit mechboxes, motor grips mounting motors at odd angles causing grinding noises. I recently worked on a RS SVD and while its nice, I would never get one, I would stick to my WE.

 

The AGM is everything cheaper but in the end shoots better than any AEGs that are 3 times its price range with less work required.

 

 

Here is my AGM:

 

254a51d043330d0.jpg

 

Yeah there is a reason why replica aimpoints don't hold zero. Their front reflective lenses loosen up over the recoil and doesn't hold zero. I had to switch to my cheap reflex sight there, but since fixed my aimpoint replica again :D

 

And yeah the Daniel Defense rail I have on is a replica, and the barrel nut/collar doesn't actually fit the AGM as it was designed for the AEGs. I took a drastic mod to the stock delta ring/nut and got it to fit the rail. And here is the product.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Erm, yeah but how about comparing the WE M4 to a decent AEG while you're at it?

 

There are AEGs that can totally blow the WE M4 out of the water for range, accuracy, reliability and running costs.

 

It's all very well saying that one gas gun is better than the other when, in fact, they're ALL still inferior to a decent AEG when it comes to practical comparison.

 

The only reason to choose a gas rifle instead of an AEG is for the experience of shooting it.

From that POV the WA design has higher recoil and is more realistic in construction which scores it big points with a lot of people.

Stealth, I wouldn't dare compare it to a PTW. It does though keep up with 90% of the AEG's on the field. My hurricane HK416 has a Systema drop-in gearbox and it is flawless. The WE is for fun factor and it still does perform.

 

3vi1-D4n that is a sexy gun. That is how a Armilite is supposed to look like!

Link to post
Share on other sites
Stealthbomber: I would ask you to qualify your statement here.

 

If I pull an AEG of the same size, and price range out of a box and compared it with the current AWSS WE out of the box and load it with the same ammo, at room temperature, the WE would outshoot the AEG, and would finish a mag, and be quite happy. Most AEGs don't come with tightbores or shoot at the power of the WE.

TBH, most $150 chinaguns DO seem to come with those features these days.

 

By the time you're looking at spending $400+ on an AEG you can end up with a pretty sweet gun.

 

Effectiveness at a skirmish however would depend on a) the type of game B) the type of user. Obviously you can use an AEG by pure spammage/recce by fire, while WE users would be more picky with fire control.

It wasn't a trick question.

An AEG is more accurate, more consistant and more reliable than ANY gas gun.

This is all regardless of how the guns are used.

 

Maintenance wise, There are 2 screws to get to the firing pin, 2 screws and 1 pin to get to the hammer, and one screw to disassemble the bolt assembly.

 

Who here has tuned/reshimmed a mechbox? How long does it take to ensure it goes well particularly when upgrading past M130 (which is where the tuning really makes a difference)? Hours, and depends on how good of a job the manufacturer has made their parts for them to fit. I have had gears not fit bushings, trigger blocks not fit mechboxes, motor grips mounting motors at odd angles causing grinding noises. I recently worked on a RS SVD and while its nice, I would never get one, I would stick to my WE.

I guess it's just as well the WE M4 comes apart so easily.

Take a look at the 130-odd page thread dedicated to discussion of all the problems with the gun.

Nothing else really needs to be said.

 

The AGM is everything cheaper but in the end shoots better than any AEGs that are 3 times its price range with less work required.

 

Not sure what that means but I'll finish with a little bit of philosopy of my own...

 

Thing is, in airsoft, you can mess around with things, tune em up, improve em and get em running just how you want.

At the end of the day, the only thing you can't really change about your gun are the fundamentals.

 

Like with an ICS M4, you can't change the extra-long receiver. You can build a gun that outshoots anything else on the field but it'll ALWAYS have that extra-long receiver.

 

That's kinda how it is with the WE M4.

The WA M4 might have problems but they're all solvable ones and, once your gun is running right, you're left with an almost exact replica of the real-steel gun.

By contrast, the WE M4 will always have that ugly brass pipework inside it regardless of how well it shoots.

 

So, for me at least, if I want an unrealistic gun I'll carry on using an AEG.

If I want a realistic gun I might as well go the whole way and get a WA design gun rather than settling for something less authentic.

 

Please don't misunderstand me.

I am not keen to add fuel to any "versus" fire but I think it's a bit silly to suggest that either design is particularly better than another.

It's obvious that both WE and WA designs have LOTS of detail issues and a couple of fundamental flaws but, for all that, they're immense fun to shoot compared to an AEG.

Criticising one gun or the other is a classic case of the pot calling the kettle black IMO.

 

*EDIT*

 

In fact, I'm not gonna let this thread get spammed up with debate and argument.

 

If you (and by that, I mean whoever) want to start a "J00r gun suxx0rz" thread go do it elsewhere and stop cluttering up this thread with bullsh*t.

Link to post
Share on other sites
The WE is for fun factor and it still does perform.

 

3vi1-D4n that is a sexy gun. That is how a Armilite is supposed to look like!

 

I can't believe you spelled 'Armalite' wrong. :lol:

 

Is it because your AGM and first version WE have no trades on the receiver? :lol:

 

Anyhow, seriously, I disagree with the fun factor thing. I've been using my WE M16A3 for 2 skirmishes on the trot while my snipers get upgraded.

 

I've got one mag, and a 4x32 ACOG scope. It performs the DMR role better than any AEG I've ever had. Really nice shooting.

 

The AGM would be more fun factor for me, especially with the price. But if it performs, you can't argue with that.

 

Ben.

Link to post
Share on other sites
TBH, most $150 chinaguns DO seem to come with those features these days.

 

By the time you're looking at spending $400+ on an AEG you can end up with a pretty sweet gun.

 

 

It wasn't a trick question.

An AEG is more accurate, more consistant and more reliable than ANY gas gun.

This is all regardless of how the guns are used.

 

 

I guess it's just as well the WE M4 comes apart so easily.

Take a look at the 130-odd page thread dedicated to discussion of all the problems with the gun.

Nothing else really needs to be said.

 

 

 

Not sure what that means but I'll finish with a little bit of philosopy of my own...

 

Thing is, in airsoft, you can mess around with things, tune em up, improve em and get em running just how you want.

At the end of the day, the only thing you can't really change about your gun are the fundamentals.

 

Like with an ICS M4, you can't change the extra-long receiver. You can build a gun that outshoots anything else on the field but it'll ALWAYS have that extra-long receiver.

 

That's kinda how it is with the WE M4.

The WA M4 might have problems but they're all solvable ones and, once your gun is running right, you're left with an almost exact replica of the real-steel gun.

By contrast, the WE M4 will always have that ugly brass pipework inside it regardless of how well it shoots.

 

So, for me at least, if I want an unrealistic gun I'll carry on using an AEG.

If I want a realistic gun I might as well go the whole way and get a WA design gun rather than settling for something less authentic.

 

Please don't misunderstand me.

I am not keen to add fuel to any "versus" fire but I think it's a bit silly to suggest that either design is particularly better than another.

It's obvious that both WE and WA designs have LOTS of detail issues and a couple of fundamental flaws but, for all that, they're immense fun to shoot compared to an AEG.

Criticising one gun or the other is a classic case of the pot calling the kettle black IMO.

 

*EDIT*

 

In fact, I'm not gonna let this thread get spammed up with debate and argument.

 

If you (and by that, I mean whoever) want to start a "J00r gun suxx0rz" thread go do it elsewhere and stop cluttering up this thread with bullsh*t.

Point Taken......... ;)

 

 

 

I cant believe I spelled Armalite wrong :o That's why there is spell check right......now you have me all self conscience. Now some eye candy

 

 

gun004.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

Stealthbomber: It seems you are the one doing the "J00r Gunnzz Sux0rs" around here. We are not here to ###### on people's parades, and as a Global Moderator you should know this.

 

Looking at it from another view, if the field limits are 1J to 1.4J then you are very well correct that a $150 ACM will perform just as well over the more expensive WE, even the WA and the WOC. Hell I don't even need to tune anything knowing most ACM guns will run indefinately at that power level, and given the short range of the 1J you aren't really "sniping".

 

As soon as you try to get over 1.5J with any accuracy or decent trigger response, it becomes a bigger issue. Stock motors require large nimh batteries/higher voltage 11.1v lipos to drive >1.5J springs or better motors with smaller batteries are required, then the wiring and the trigger blocks become issues as well. This is where the current WEs have an advantage out of the box.

 

WEs have a 100% hit probability at 50m (150ft) for a target standing and kneeling out of the box, while not many AEGs can boast that performance stock. Sure WEs have issues, but so do AEGs at the same power output as the WE, and definately more effort and knowhow to maintain the AEGs as they are compared with the WE.

 

How do I know? When you have been fixing guns for 14 years you know.

 

But hey, Global Mod, this is about the AGM not the WE, so how about we stay on track eh? Both the AGM and the WE are good rifles, and regardless whether they are better or worse than an AEG, howabout let the other guys find out about it for themselves?

Link to post
Share on other sites
I can't believe you spelled 'Armalite' wrong. :lol:

 

Is it because your AGM and first version WE have no trades on the receiver? :lol:

 

Anyhow, seriously, I disagree with the fun factor thing. I've been using my WE M16A3 for 2 skirmishes on the trot while my snipers get upgraded.

 

I've got one mag, and a 4x32 ACOG scope. It performs the DMR role better than any AEG I've ever had. Really nice shooting.

 

The AGM would be more fun factor for me, especially with the price. But if it performs, you can't argue with that.

 

Ben.

 

 

Ahh the one thing i hate...

 

"Snipers are people who shoot the rifle'

"the sniper rifle is the rifle it self'

It makes you sound like a total gun noob when you say that! or like a 10 year old is that my sniper pwnzors! just a thought...

Link to post
Share on other sites

Stealth bomber is the guy who complains about realism but has never actually fired or had to carry an M16 before, I can tell.

 

I dare say the WA design is LESS realistic than the WE because when you're firing a RS M16, you actually SEE BRASS being loaded into the chamber.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok enough with the WE vs WA, were happy with what we use and thats that. Period.

 

NOW WHAT THE FRAK! WHAT MBKS ARE THOSE STEW_B_10 AND HSOJGNILRAD!?

Sorry for "yelling" but for the longest time I've patiently waited for someone to transpose AGM guts into another metal body? Please give details about fits, tolerances, cost, and brand.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use and the use of session cookies.