WE Gas Blow Back M4A1 Carbine

[Marky [UE]]

Where did you purshase your Magpul MIAD grip from guys? Seems that Magpul don't ship it at the international...

 

I am not sure if they ship outside of the UK but this is the site I bought my MIAD from: Southern Gun Company (UK) as previously mentioned this is the BASIC kit and not the FULL kit, the title on the product description is incorrect.

 

They havent got all the stuff i wanted....

me want: Miad/MOE grip and the most wanted ASAP sling mount and sling...

 

Shame Hong Kong doesn't have much Gucci gear.... Or it really would be a airsoft shopping paradise... no matter GBB or AEG

 

Magpul are unable to export any weapon parts including sling mounts, grips, stocks etc. due to US ITAR restrictions (google it). They can ship the slings (I have a couple on the way) but you will have to find a friend in the US to help with the other bits. My sling mounts and RS hand guard have been helped to the UK by a good friend

[chris u'5]

I am just wondering if the afc versions sold at tacticalquartermaster are supposed to have trades on them as a friend got one without markings and I was lead to believe that afc versions are trademarked

TQM was selling both versions.

Perhaps your friend ordered the wrong one? If not, I'm sure the owner of TQM will sort it out if he contacts him. He's a very decent person.

[WETTI]

Guys, what's the purpose of #37? The O-ring at the other end of the nozzle? The one near the end you screw onto the bolt carrier...what does it do?

 

 

..and has anyone succesfuly figured out how to lower FPS? I ordered the 300 fps steel nozzle, and the damn thing was shooting over 400 FPS with .30!!!

 

Someone mentioned sticking something in the nozzle area...like a bearing bushing or something to puch the inner floating nozzle closer up into the spring...did it work? What did you use?

 

Try this... (a method suggested by one of your fellow members )

 

 

 

[WETTI]

What about lower receivers?

Was there not some discussion about those a while back?

 

Patience...Chris... patience Good things come to those who waits..... (that's the exact quote I got from....'whoever')

[Bangla_Black]

Found this WE vs G&P gbb m4 with lots of pics. LINK

[chris u'5]

That's a nice comparison review.

Thanks for the link Bangla.

Edited April 19, 2009 by chris u'5

[redline]

they probably sent you the wrong nozzle (pics?)

 

 

Nah...it was def. supposed to be the 300 fps one..I compared to both my brass 300 fps and 500 fps brass versions, and the floating valve was pushed up into the nozzle further.

[redline]

With this floating valve you're under 300fps(my M4 shoots at 280): http://www.airsoftbuddy.com/index_eproduct...products_id=195

 

Thanks Eliminator! The holes in that valve look way smaller. I'll have to try and give that one a shot!

[redline]

WETTI, thanks for the pics. That's the one I remember reading. I'll try that out. Airsoft mechbox bearings, huh?

[DiscoBiscuit]

Has anyone not had a problem with their WE M4? Seriously, please raise your hand. Dying to buy one of these as they seem relatively more reliable than their WA counterparts. The thread started out as a relatively strong advertisement for the WE but it's taken a turn and become more of a warning against it. WE should be sending checks to a lot of you guys for R&D fees, and they should have the funds to do this since it's apparent they didn't do much R&D themselves. It's understood that the industry is not the most highly developed around, and the fact the WE is highly involved in this thread is encouraging, but releasing an item in this state of under-development has to be causing a lot of cash to sit on the sidelines (not to mention it puts into serious question the reputation of the manufacturer). It's hard to imagine this product being adopted as a training platform as the cost and time to maintain one of these is no doubt comparable to the real steel.

[wolfsbane]

HI all!

 

sorry for late reply..

 

as to if you could use a bigger ball bearing for the hop up... yes and no... don't know about yours but my hop up BB is quite the perfect fit in the barrel. A bigger BB would work technically but it means drilling out the hole on the hop up unit for a bigger BB... don't know how the tapered ring will then work with it as tolerances are different... don't know if the hop up rubber will be the right size for it..... basically I am sure if done correctly it will work but it sure is alot of hassle compared to bunging in a piece of rubber.

 

 

as for measurements, I am not a very technical man so exact measurements is what I do not have.

This is what I did. I go some 'plumbers tape' (they are about 1mm when not stretched). The kind used to wrap up pipes as a quick fix to leaks which is btw also very good for reinforcing or padding out worn out base plate Orings to prevent or stop leaks on GBB mags (but that is another story). most harware stores should have this.

I cut out a small piece and pressed it against the hop up hole on the hop up unit where the ball bearing goes into. This left an impression on the rubber tape which I then cut out (this is very difficult and delicate work and I am clumsy and possess some sausage fingers) making sure to cut very slightly smaller than the impression. During this process try not to stretch the tape as this kind of tape will stretch and get thinner.

 

After all that .. put it in the hole for the hop up Ball bearing, put in the ball bearing on top of that to push it down and re assemble your hop up unit. Voila! you have just added about 1mm of extra rubber to your hop up rubber which should now push the hop up further down when you adjust it.

 

It would probably be even better if you could do this with a 0.5mm - 1 mm thickness non stretchy sheet of rubber i guess, but this was what I had and it is easy to get a hold of.

 

Hope this helps.

It sure sorted out my hop up problems.

[Eliminator56]

Has anyone not had a problem with their WE M4? Seriously, please raise your hand. Dying to buy one of these as they seem relatively more reliable than their WA counterparts. The thread started out as a relatively strong advertisement for the WE but it's taken a turn and become more of a warning against it. WE should be sending checks to a lot of you guys for R&D fees, and they should have the funds to do this since it's apparent they didn't do much R&D themselves. It's understood that the industry is not the most highly developed around, and the fact the WE is highly involved in this thread is encouraging, but releasing an item in this state of under-development has to be causing a lot of cash to sit on the sidelines (not to mention it puts into serious question the reputation of the manufacturer). It's hard to imagine this product being adopted as a training platform as the cost and time to maintain one of these is no doubt comparable to the real steel.

 

Anyone going to answer this, because I feel the same way.

[alston251]

HI all!

 

sorry for late reply..

 

as to if you could use a bigger ball bearing for the hop up... yes and no... don't know about yours but my hop up BB is quite the perfect fit in the barrel. A bigger BB would work technically but it means drilling out the hole on the hop up unit for a bigger BB... don't know how the tapered ring will then work with it as tolerances are different... don't know if the hop up rubber will be the right size for it..... basically I am sure if done correctly it will work but it sure is alot of hassle compared to bunging in a piece of rubber.

 

 

as for measurements, I am not a very technical man so exact measurements is what I do not have.

This is what I did. I go some 'plumbers tape' (they are about 1mm when not stretched). The kind used to wrap up pipes as a quick fix to leaks which is btw also very good for reinforcing or padding out worn out base plate Orings to prevent or stop leaks on GBB mags (but that is another story). most harware stores should have this.

I cut out a small piece and pressed it against the hop up hole on the hop up unit where the ball bearing goes into. This left an impression on the rubber tape which I then cut out (this is very difficult and delicate work and I am clumsy and possess some sausage fingers) making sure to cut very slightly smaller than the impression. During this process try not to stretch the tape as this kind of tape will stretch and get thinner.

 

After all that .. put it in the hole for the hop up Ball bearing, put in the ball bearing on top of that to push it down and re assemble your hop up unit. Voila! you have just added about 1mm of extra rubber to your hop up rubber which should now push the hop up further down when you adjust it.

 

It would probably be even better if you could do this with a 0.5mm - 1 mm thickness non stretchy sheet of rubber i guess, but this was what I had and it is easy to get a hold of.

 

Hope this helps.

It sure sorted out my hop up problems.

 

Are you applying this fix on the new hop or the old hop?

[Autotechnica]

Has anyone not had a problem with their WE M4? Seriously, please raise your hand. Dying to buy one of these as they seem relatively more reliable than their WA counterparts. The thread started out as a relatively strong advertisement for the WE but it's taken a turn and become more of a warning against it. WE should be sending checks to a lot of you guys for R&D fees, and they should have the funds to do this since it's apparent they didn't do much R&D themselves. It's understood that the industry is not the most highly developed around, and the fact the WE is highly involved in this thread is encouraging, but releasing an item in this state of under-development has to be causing a lot of cash to sit on the sidelines (not to mention it puts into serious question the reputation of the manufacturer). It's hard to imagine this product being adopted as a training platform as the cost and time to maintain one of these is no doubt comparable to the real steel.

 

I totally agree, I've put around 500 rounds through my gun, and thank god I have a lot of experience with M4 AEG's, otherwise I'd be completely lost. I seem to be constantly replacing/upgrading parts, and I feel like each time I do so, the part that's the next weakest link will fail. 500 rounds isn't even long-term testing, they could easily test that before launch.

 

After putting 500 rounds through my gun, here are the parts that have failed. I have the V2 AFC version with full markings.

 

- charging handle blew apart (smacked me in the face)

- #122 O-ring failed twice

- nozzle unscrews itself from the bolt carrier (had to locktite the threads)

- O-ring for the bolt securing the nozzle to the bolt carrier broke

- carrying handle adjustment knobs completely seized (replaced with G&P carry handle/sights

- mags output valve leaks so bad, could not fire more than 4-5 rounds

- mags bolt catch sheered and would not activate bolt catch on the gun

- #59 part cracked and completely broke apart (rifle would not function at all)

- delta ring constantly loosens casuing barrel wobble (fixed with plumbers tape

- flash hider and threaded center section of the barrel comes loose when firing (also fixed with plumbers tape

- lack of grease in many places, had to regrease

- charging handle latch blew off and was not repairable

- hopup was jammed, needed vice grips to un jam it

 

well I think that's all...

 

Anyways, I still love my WEM4 and would never go back to AEG's

Edited April 19, 2009 by Autotechnica

[wolfsbane]

 

I bought this product knowing full well the pros and cons but simply wanted to have a GBB m4.

 

Nobody pushed me to get one but myself... and it has been great fun!

when something goes, it is more of a dissapointment that the fun has to stop for a while but like you said.. at least WE is involved and hopefully soon all the problems will be ironed out and I will have a fully functional problem free GBB m4 that I can skirmish with and hope fully do some tactical carbine with. (have to use airsoft for this as you know how it is in the UK)

 

I knew full well what I was buying into and don't feel conned about it... I would have bought a TM AEG otherwise.

....but if I had spent the kind of money you need to buy a WA m4 or inok M4 now then I would be really ######. No support, problems galore, cost me an arm and a leg...GGRRRRR

 

I guess you gotta treat this abit like a labour of love project or something like that.

But really... there are problems but not too many to hinder the enjoyment of it.. I bet most owners will atest to that.

 

as for a training platform... I personally don't really think that in the current state of airsoft technology that airsoft will ever be a good enough performer as a training weapon. If you need a 1:1 weapon to run loading /unloading drills with..yep airsoft will do, infact the WE m4 is great for this. CQB drills, movement drills , etc.. again airsoft will do but to shoot 100-150m effectively, replay stoppages for drills, etc... airsoft just isn't the platform for it.. its a good goal to aspire towards and maybe someday technology will allow it but for now, the answer is still probably some form of cheaper simunitions, or a more effective MILES kinda kit.

 

but thats just me.

[wolfsbane]

I am apply this fix to the new hop ups.

But the basic idea of padding out the existing hop up rubber should work for any i guess.

[alston251]

I am apply this fix to the new hop ups.

But the basic idea of padding out the existing hop up rubber should work for any i guess.

 

Have you tested the accuracy and range with it? If you have please tell us the results.

 

Edit: What brand and weight bbs are you using?

Edited April 19, 2009 by alston251

[Marky [UE]]

Has anyone not had a problem with their WE M4? Seriously, please raise your hand. Dying to buy one of these as they seem relatively more reliable than their WA counterparts. The thread started out as a relatively strong advertisement for the WE but it's taken a turn and become more of a warning against it. WE should be sending checks to a lot of you guys for R&D fees, and they should have the funds to do this since it's apparent they didn't do much R&D themselves. It's understood that the industry is not the most highly developed around, and the fact the WE is highly involved in this thread is encouraging, but releasing an item in this state of under-development has to be causing a lot of cash to sit on the sidelines (not to mention it puts into serious question the reputation of the manufacturer). It's hard to imagine this product being adopted as a training platform as the cost and time to maintain one of these is no doubt comparable to the real steel.

 

Have I never had a problem with my WE M4? No my charging handle broke, it was one of the early ones so this was expected. Additionally I had to make very minor mods to both gas mags to get the bolt catch to work and they both leaked on the first use (then sealed). This does obviously lend some credence to your argument, the charging handle issue was quickly recognised and rectified by WE. These are the only issues that relate to the quality of my rifle. I took time when it arrived to give it a delivery inspection and tweak before pulling the trigger for the first time. And since then I have found a need for more thread lock. I now realise a gbb rifle like this does need a fair bit of care, patience and attention. That being said there is always room for improvement e.g. the hop-up but then again some users have managed to get the original hop working to their needs/environment.

 

it's apparent they didn't do much R&D themselves. It's understood that the industry is not the most highly developed around, and the fact the WE is highly involved in this thread is encouraging, but releasing an item in this state of under-development has to be causing a lot of cash to sit on the sidelines (not to mention it puts into serious question the reputation of the manufacturer).

 

I don't agree. We have no idea how much R&D was done or what the state/expectations of the design prior to launch was, any post launch issues could have been just as much a shock for WE as anyone else, product launches of any type are always scary. Reading through this discussion there are some users who have unfortunately received lemons but it's also worth remembering that any user who is 100% happy might never have cause to visit this thread.

 

Is the community helping to improve the product? yes

Is WE listening? yes

Do WE appreciate the feedback? yes

Has this affected the changes/upgrades made/available? yes

 

It's hard to imagine this product being adopted as a training platform as the cost and time to maintain one of these is no doubt comparable to the real steel.

 

A training platform that exhibits similar characteristics to the real thing is not always a bad thing. I can't comment on your statement relating to cost and time since you have no supporting evidence/research.

 

All the above being said:

Would I recommend buying right now? Only if you know what you are getting into, you might wish to wait for more feedback on recent upgrades or the launch of the CO2 model

Do I like my WE M4? Absolutely, given a choice I don't want to use my AEGs again. I am waiting for CO2

Am I happy with WE as a company? Yes, they are heavily involved with the community and appear to be working hard to make the WE product range as competitive as possible, in short they are not standing still

What is the biggest benefit of the WE M4? inspite of the possible issues you MAY encounter parts for the WE M4 are relatively inexpensive and as an added benefit magazines are substantially cheaper than the competition

 

I hope this doesn't sound off and apologise if it does, I have just tried to lay down my thoughts as they stand today. The one thing that does stand out for me is the inconsistency of each rifle, I seem to have a fairly good one, others are having a knightmare.

Edited April 19, 2009 by Marky [UE]

[wolfsbane]

Unfortunately.. not able to test properly but now that the hop up is working you can see it very obviously with trajectory and the distance is amazing! It chronoed about 400fps ( i am waiting delivery of a velocity reducer) and used to shoot and do a 400fps drop very quickly now its got that beautiful drift we airsofters have all come to love.

 

comparing it to my VSR (410 - 420fps) its doing about the same distance so I think all is in order.

accuracy is all over the place but I believe its down to the barrel as I have not padded it out yet and is shaking all over the place in the outer barrel.

 

all done on high grade blaster .20g

[Horsem4n]

you guys do know that you could contact EdGi about making you a new type hop up barrel in even 6.01? just an FYI.

[Eliminator]

I just have one complain against WE: the part#59. Since very few broke in HK and Taiwan, no reinforced version is sheduled.Beside this, that's a great gun at a relativly low price

[Horsem4n]

but at least you can get the part cheaply or easily make it yourself out of sheet steel.

[DiscoBiscuit]

Thanks

 

I appreciate the replies, what concerns me is that WE seems to be very interested in releasing (or partnering with firms that are releasing) new models and superficial accessories (i.e.,metal receivers, barrel nuts, rails, etc.) when the fact remains that the underlying system, the foundation of the platform, cannot by any measure be considered a successful finished product. From what I've read (again, step forward if you disagree) it is barely a functional product. If WE spent money on R&D there doesn't appear to have been any left over for QC. The product capitalized on the market's desire for a unique product but hasn't truly gone much further than novelty status (granted, airsoft guns are novelties to begin with, but that only makes the WE M4 novelty squared!). The most frustrating part is that this could and should go further than novelty status. I'm willing to bet that most customers wouldn't mind shelling out an extra $75 for a highly re-enforced model, but at this point WE does not seem to be moving in that direction (unfortunately, IMO some serious trust would have to be (re)established for such a model to even be considered by consumers at this point). I think WE’s strategic vision is decidedly shallow and any competitive advantage is being squandered by wasting resources on short term goals. My prediction: KWA will take advantage of WE’s missteps and introduce a superior, market leading product. I hope to be proven wrong.

Edited April 19, 2009 by DiscoBiscuit

[3vi1-D4n]

While I agree that the underlying system has issues, thing is that most mass production companies do not aim to produce indestructable products nor fully top performance products for a stock generic model. They can try, but that means the production cost will increase.

 

I would say its not fully the QC that has issues. QC controls the variance in production, and the % or rate of lemons occuring. The fracturing of the receiver and cocking handles are QC issues.

 

I would say this is product has not been fully "tested" before it hit the market. Its a project management issue, maybe an issue with their project strategy.

 

Essentially the V1 is a Alpha Test, the V2 is a Beta Test. We have effectively been a part of their Product testing. On my V1, I have had a broken #42, #54, worn #36, popped out forward assist, broken bolt release, as well as the "BB falling out of barrel", "BB munching", "Not feeding after a burst on auto" and "over hopping"

 

Those issues should have been stress and "skirmish" tested before the product came out. I know my #42 and #54 will break again, and only because of my Engineering knowhow I managed to get my V1 barrel to perform.

 

But in the end it was the "best" choice out of what was available at the time, so we as users just have to adapt and overcome. Even real steel parts fail, and they all have their own design flaws.

 

I do have to congratulate WE for providing the best after sales support any airsoft manufacturer has offered so far. But I do hope WE does take some lessons away from this, sort out the internal issues and push forward for the future.

 

I am waiting for a match grade accuracy hop up unit, steel #42 and steel hammer/disconnector

Edited April 19, 2009 by 3vi1-D4n

[wolfsbane]

I am a fan of the WE m4 because its the best you can get... but true that WE could be doing a better ( or should have done a better job)

 

So that really makes me a fan of a GBB m4 thats so happens to be a WE. If KWA can make a better one at about the same price than I am swapping over.. its simple as that and I think it would be the sames for most owners.

 

Airsoft Brand loyalty is based on track records. WE's m4 is their saving grace (their pistols.... well.. nuff said) so if they allow KWA to beat them, then they have only themselves to blame. If they have any foresight at all they would spend some money appeasing the current m4 owners (retracting parts and supplying new ones ) and sorting out current issues quick rather than producing more models.

They made the mistake with their pistols by coming up with various models of the hi capa even though the base model wasn't all that hot.. and all that has happened is now we have a whole bunch of bad hicapas.

It seems that they are going down that same road with the m4s... but its still early days so only time will tell.

 

WE if you are reading this.. wouldn't it be better to sell a whole bunch of great GBB M4s (thus capturing the m4 GBB market) rather than many variants of a defect product?