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Lupus78

WE Gas Blow Back M4A1 Carbine

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Hey WETTI,

this might be a bit of an unusual question, but has your company thought about coming out with a "Skeleton" version of the M4? A stripped down version that would not come with a stock, pistol grip, RIS, rail covers or any of the parts that ppl most often customise. Perhaps it would even lack flip up sights, a flash hider, trigger guard or sling mount. It would mainly consist of the upper and lower receivers, inner and outer barrels and other functional parts (bolt catch, selector switch, etc). This would lower the cost of the gun even further, encourage customization, and put all of those extra spare parts I have lying around my house to good use.

 

If u look in the Arnies Armalite thread, almost every gun is tricked out and customised by the user. A "Skeleton rig" would appeal to those airsofters who are going to replace the furniture that comes with the gun, because it spares them from wasting money on parts they are not going to use. I'm surprised manufacturers haven't considered this before... or have they?

 

I have been reading up on alot of GBB and EBB rifles and I am not convinced to drop my $600.00+ on ANY rifle just yet. From reading this thread I have learned that while being generally awesome, the WE M4 is not without its flaws and I am holding out on buying any GBB until the science is perfected (or close to it) , but if WETTI came out with a Skeleton rig for say, $150- $200 at that price I would not be able to resist. And if its a dud, would not feel cheated.

 

Other Pros of this would be:

would break skeptical AEG airsofters into the GBB field at the cheapest price.

Could serve as a cost effective backup/ replacement.

Would appeal to airsofters who are heavy into customisation (almost everyone)

you already have the parts and this wouldn't take much to implement. (would it?)

You could possibly create a "build it yourself" web page, where the consumer can pick just how "bare" the skeleton rig is. (Add or remover parts) and the price of the rig would adjust as items are added to the gun.

 

I'm asking WETTI since they follow this thread and I may actually get a response... (and I'm generally hoping that their gun gains momentum and respect as well) but this idea can be applied to any gun manufacturer.

Just a thought... What do you guys think? If WETTI, or any other M4 manufacturers came out with a skeleton rig, would it be of interest to you?

 

Thnx.

 

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To me this sounds like a darn good idea.

 

Even though I think you won't get it for $200, but since as you said most people rip off the stock and handguard along with the carrying handle as soon as they get it this would be a really neat option.

When I think of my WE M4 box right now I have the stock, grip, triggerguard, carryinhandle, handguard, frontsight, flashhider, barrelnutassembly in there.

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Thats an interesting concept, one which would appeal to a proportion of people (not me personally, I like my M4 pretty stock).

 

Not sure how cheap it would be to do though. Basically the bits you're really going to change/personalise are going to be stock/carry handle/foregrips/grip/foresight and flash hider.

 

And those bits probably don't amount to much cost wise (considering all the other bits in the gun!). But hell, any saving's a saving!

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I hear you guys... and you are prolly right, $200 might be low (but i'm optimistic :D) but the idea is that its saves money AND is a varient. (WE can still make the full version, this woudl just be a spin off).

 

Let me also add to my previous comment by stating that; YES, I acknowledge that the WE M4 IS the most cost efficient GBB I can get. NO i am not cheap/ stingy. NO i am not greedy and trying to short change WE or AB, or whoever. I am simply asking that manufacturers acknowledge that if the trend is to customise ones gear and weapons as the USER sees fit, why then is the user still buying guns as the manufacturer sees fit? I own several M4's and have collected enough parts to make a whole new gun, I just need the internals... and I am sure that i am not the only one. My suggestion seems like a plausible evolution of airsoft IMO and I think whichever company figures this out first, will get a leg up on the airsoft industry.

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No I'm totally with you on that. And even if you just save about $50 that's 50 bucks you don't have to pay for parts you won't use anyway.

 

FYI after my struggle with the madbull ras I bought a used King Arms KAC style RAS and it fits like a glove. The barrel nut literally just slides on there.

Even though the RAS itself is leaning a tiny tiny bit to the right but it's really barely noticable and from most angles an optical trick. Most important thing is that the barrel is sold as a rock.

 

I will post pics when I got all my remaining stuff coming in.

 

According to that I think this thread lacks of pics big time....

Edited by somegirls

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post-9399-1242206705_thumb.jpg

 

RS UTG/Leapers Alu quad rail - fits like a glove, very affordable for RS and once fitted is rock solid!

 

Prime quad rail gas block -- uses grub screws to install instead of pins. Fits but there is a slight shake

 

RS UTG/leapers rubber AR grip - fits perfect and very comfy

 

newest version WE charging handle - ordered from AB... definitely stronger than the 1st version and so far so good.

 

G&P ambi charging handle latch for WA - needs a bit of modification but will fit and function

 

G&G Visible carbine laser unit - dodgy. witht eh recoil, it can shake itself off .. sometimes

 

G& P aimpoint - recoiled shaked it off once but I took the batts out and put fresh ones in and so far nothing else has happened and has been working fine.

 

Std TM sliding stock - fits! what more can I say.

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Of course, one thing to remember in 'skeleton AR' would be the added savings on shipping, since most pay by weight for that. So, even half a pound 'shaved' can amount to some savings when the parcel flies from AB's store to Europe. It'd be less pronounced if you got the kit from a local store, but even locally weight can affect shipping costs.

 

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here we go.

 

 

 

My Knights Armament Magpul M4

 

Still missing:

A set of rail panels for the bottom.

Maybe a Miad

Gemtech Halo and hopefully my CBQ barrel extender/spacer (will be made next week)

 

 

img_0357fjly.jpg

 

 

img_0358hct9.jpg

 

 

img_03600gx0.jpg

 

Sweet VTLOR Gasblock

 

 

img_03627j3h.jpg

 

 

img_0363scto.jpg

 

 

img_0364nd4u.jpg

 

 

img_0365del5.jpg

 

Need some real Magpul KSC Glock speedplates?

 

 

img_0366ogzk.jpg

 

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Hey WETTI,

this might be a bit of an unusual question, but has your company thought about coming out with a "Skeleton" version of the M4? A stripped down version that would not come with a stock, pistol grip, RIS, rail covers or any of the parts that ppl most often customise. Perhaps it would even lack flip up sights, a flash hider, trigger guard or sling mount. It would mainly consist of the upper and lower receivers, inner and outer barrels and other functional parts (bolt catch, selector switch, etc). This would lower the cost of the gun even further, encourage customization, and put all of those extra spare parts I have lying around my house to good use.

 

If u look in the Arnies Armalite thread, almost every gun is tricked out and customised by the user. A "Skeleton rig" would appeal to those airsofters who are going to replace the furniture that comes with the gun, because it spares them from wasting money on parts they are not going to use. I'm surprised manufacturers haven't considered this before... or have they?

 

I have been reading up on alot of GBB and EBB rifles and I am not convinced to drop my $600.00+ on ANY rifle just yet. From reading this thread I have learned that while being generally awesome, the WE M4 is not without its flaws and I am holding out on buying any GBB until the science is perfected (or close to it) , but if WETTI came out with a Skeleton rig for say, $150- $200 at that price I would not be able to resist. And if its a dud, would not feel cheated.

 

Other Pros of this would be:

would break skeptical AEG airsofters into the GBB field at the cheapest price.

Could serve as a cost effective backup/ replacement.

Would appeal to airsofters who are heavy into customisation (almost everyone)

you already have the parts and this wouldn't take much to implement. (would it?)

You could possibly create a "build it yourself" web page, where the consumer can pick just how "bare" the skeleton rig is. (Add or remover parts) and the price of the rig would adjust as items are added to the gun.

 

I'm asking WETTI since they follow this thread and I may actually get a response... (and I'm generally hoping that their gun gains momentum and respect as well) but this idea can be applied to any gun manufacturer.

Just a thought... What do you guys think? If WETTI, or any other M4 manufacturers came out with a skeleton rig, would it be of interest to you?

 

Thnx.

 

Not a bad idea, bro... ;) I think we just might add that to the playbook sometime in the future... but then again, I'll definitely have to talk to my distributors/dealers first. I run a business here, make no mistake; one can wish for a lot of things sitting on the couch, but it HAS to make business sense on our end, from all angles. It's that simple.

 

WETTI

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Not a bad idea, bro... ;) I think we just might add that to the playbook sometime in the future... but then again, I'll definitely have to talk to my distributors/dealers first. I run a business here, make no mistake; one can wish for a lot of things sitting on the couch, but it HAS to make business sense on our end, from all angles. It's that simple.

 

WETTI

 

Fair enough. I am glad that WETTI has the forward thinking to think its a viable idea. Gives me hope as an airsoft collector.

 

One last thought on the Skeleton rig...

It can also ease the decision making proccess for consumers. If I am torn between 2 different GBB rifles, and WETTI releases the affordable skeleton version... then I can possibly get BOTH guns. Whereas I may have had to choose one, and WETTI may loose my busines all together. If u could get both an XBOX 360 AND a PS3... woudln't you....?

 

I am sure u can post a survey or something on the forums asking airsofters to vote on it or comment. I am pretty sure you would get a vocal response and with the outcome of the vote, u could proceed from there. (this thread is prolly not the best place. sorry for the hijack)

 

Don't mean to push so hard on this... im just really hoping for this in airsoft in general... all it will take is for one manuffacture to establish a president and the rest will follow. And since WETTI has done such an excellent job of keeping in touch with the public, it seems like they should be the one to answer the public's calls.

 

Ok, thats it. im done.

Edited by eldelphi

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WETTI in my eyes is already giving everyone their money's worth just by being here to listen. If WE decided on their own to sell parts separately then I see no problem with that and heck maybe then I may pick one up. However, I'm pretty sure WE mass produces furniture parts at a very very low cost so charging a full $360 for a full gun with low cost parts makes more sense than selling the main parts (even for $200) and having extra grips/stocks/forearms that no one would buy. I HIGHLY doubt those extra parts = $160 to make. Selling a full set-up will always be more cost effective for a business. If you're asking WE to EXCLUDE parts to make the gun cheaper that's just being cheap and stingy. WE is not so much a parts manufacturer but a full gun maker so keep that in mind. People would just go the cheap-ER route and then less people would buy the full $360 gun that they sell. On the other hand, if WE or a sister company were to sell INDIVIDUAL REPLACEMENT parts to buy so you can custom build your own from scratch then I can see it being a better business idea. *hint hint* Replacement parts are usually more expensive though because they need to make up the loss of it not being in a full gun. Which is why building a full version of something from scratch using only replacement parts tends to be more expensive. Everyone else with gbb guns have spent the money to buy it and spent more to customize it. To me...a full gbb rifle at $360 is a pretty darn good price already.

 

If u could get both an XBOX 360 AND a PS3... woudln't you....?

 

I DO have a 360 AND a PS3. I like them both so I bought them both. You gotta pay to play!

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So can one fire two whole clips using one cartridge of Co2? Or will you be required to change out the co2 mags everytime you reload with BBs?

 

Switch bulbs every time you empty the mag. Once the bb's are gone, switch bulbs. Lots of work me thinks. Sticking with propane. My gun is nearly perfect right now with the new hop and inner barrel. Im done.

 

 

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WETTI in my eyes is already giving everyone their money's worth just by being here to listen.

agreed. kudos to WETTI.

If WE decided on their own to sell parts separately then I see no problem with that and heck maybe then I may pick one up.

you just made my point.

However, I'm pretty sure WE mass produces furniture parts at a very very low cost so charging a full $360 for a full gun with low cost parts makes more sense than selling the main parts (even for $200) and having extra grips/stocks/forearms that no one would buy. I HIGHLY doubt those extra parts = $160 to make. Selling a full set-up will always be more cost effective for a business.

That's for WETTI to decide; and they have already stated that there are many factors that go into making these types of decisions.

If you're asking WE to EXCLUDE parts to make the gun cheaper that's just being cheap and stingy.

Let me also add to my previous comment by stating that; YES, I acknowledge that the WE M4 IS the most cost efficient GBB I can get. NO i am not cheap/ stingy. NO i am not greedy and trying to short change WE or AB, or whoever. I am simply asking that manufacturers acknowledge that if the trend is to customise ones gear and weapons as the USER sees fit, why then is the user still buying guns as the manufacturer sees fit? I own several M4's and have collected enough parts to make a whole new gun, I just need the internals... and I am sure that i am not the only one. My suggestion seems like a plausible evolution of airsoft IMO and I think whichever company figures this out first, will get a leg up on the airsoft industry.

*ehem.

WE is not so much a parts manufacturer but a full gun maker so keep that in mind. People would just go the cheap-ER route and then less people would buy the full $360 gun that they sell.

you've already said that if they were to come out with a skeleton rig, you would buy one. And if they did, I WOULD BUY ONE. And I am guessing, so would hundreds of other people who otherwise would not buy a GBB. This is EXTRA money in WETTI's bank that they wouldn't have had anyway. If ppl start going the cheaper route (especially durring this global reccession) would that be a bad thing? WETTI might make less money from each sale, but they will sell more units. I dont care how skeptical u are about GBB.. if it was $200. you would be more inclined to take a chance than if it was $600.00

On the other hand, if WE or a sister company were to sell INDIVIDUAL REPLACEMENT parts to buy so you can custom build your own from scratch then I can see it being a better business idea. *hint hint*

That will work too. If King Arms ever got into the GBB market, having a skeleton rig or a "build it yourself" gun might benifit them greatly since they manufacture guns AND parts .

To me...a full gbb rifle at $360 is a pretty darn good price already.

agreed. But with all of the upgraded parts that may be needed and the fear of getting a lemon; its still not worth it to some people.

I DO have a 360 AND a PS3. I like them both so I bought them both. You gotta pay to play!

True. Its not like I am saying NEVER produce a full gun any more.. just a new variation. I have both a PS3 and a 360 as well. Being that I hardly use my PS3, buying one was a costly mistake. And I try to learn from my mistakes. So I do not own a GBB right now. I will patiently wait to see where the GBB market goes.

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As much as I dislike fixing these rifles, if there was a skeleton rig I would get one.

 

First thing I got rid of when I got my M4 was:

 

- Front sights

- Carry handle

- Foregrip

- Long barrel

 

If there was options to have a stock tube that is compatible with a solid stock it would be fantastic. I am looking at either a DMR with a steel free float barrel (when the steel barrels come out) or a 7" Stubby/Adam Arms style PDW.

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Switch bulbs every time you empty the mag. Once the bb's are gone, switch bulbs. Lots of work me thinks. Sticking with propane. My gun is nearly perfect right now with the new hop and inner barrel. Im done.

 

 

Hmmm...that does seem like a lot of work. I wonder if fore-going cool down is worth it. I'm just gonna have to wait and see.

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you've already said that if they were to come out with a skeleton rig, you would buy one.

<text>

you would be more inclined to take a chance than if it was $600.00?

I never said if they came out with a skeleton rig...i said: "If WE decided on their own to sell parts separately then I see no problem with that and heck maybe then I may pick one up." I like the option to build things myself not because it's cheaper (cuz it's not)...but that way I can learn how everything works and improve on things myself if i see it's necessary. As for your comment about me being skeptical or willing to take a chance...I already have 3 WA M4's, one which I custom built from the ground up using only replacement parts that can be purchased. I've been keeping track of this WE thread from page 1 because I still think it has potential and I've just been waiting for the co2 capability of it before buying one. I'm waiting for the WE to be close to perfected on co2 but until the co2 platform is actually released and reviewed by public consumers i'm going to wait. I don't know what new problems may be encountered with co2. Although seeing as how one co2 caplet = one 30rnd magazine, with the way I play my hopes are slowly fading away. Still...it seems to be perfect for training or mil-sim purposes.

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Shinhk;

I didnt mean YOU personally. rather "you" being anyone in general.

 

Since u have built a full rifle as well as purchased it stock woudln't having an option to buy just the skeleton appeal to you? If WETTI came out with skeleton CO2 GBB that addresses all the issues u have with it and was cheaper than the stock version; and you had plans to customise it; would u honestly buy the full veresion or the Skeletal one?

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