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Lupus78

WE Gas Blow Back M4A1 Carbine

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Just a quick question - with the newest version of the WE, have most of the problems been ironed out? Or is it probably more cost effective (in terms of time, money, and maintenance/repair effort) to get a WOC? I really love the way the WE seems to be shaping out, and also how fast they roll out improvements based on their close relationship to their customers. Just wondering if it's the right time to get one, or wait a bit more for the WE platform to mature like the Magna.

 

 

Just wait. A couple more months and many new manufacturers will be releasing their own GBBR's. KWA has the most potential to be the best GBBR platform in terms of performance.

 

I wouldn't hold my breath for WE. They haven't fixed the problems 3vi1-D4n mentioned since their M4 V1 release and most likely never will.

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The WE system is possibly the more robust and useful system compared to the WA system so far, but that is offsetted by the lack of improvement in their system in terms of durability. WEs have the potential to be near perfect, working indefinately if the right parts are in the right place, but it seems that the manufacturer either doesn't want to make the best product, which is really against their selling promise.

 

I do hope WE steps up to the game or else it will definately fall behind, because if KSC/KWA pumps out an M4 thats >450fps capable and is indestructable (which the new KSC/KWAs guns are) and are cheap (again the new KSC/KWAs are now much cheaper), then you know who we will end up backing.

 

Like i said in the past and having owned both plataforms , WA - that includes the WOC - and WE , if i had to choose again between any of them and pondering the problems of both i would have to choose the WE any day.

Although the WE platform as is, is plagued with small problems, i still find them much more manageable ( and way cheaper too ) than the one i had with my WA. From the problems that 3vi1-D4n listed i only consider two of them critical, the trigger system wear and the rubber components ( part #117 ) "fail" on low temperatures wich in my opinion is in great part, the culprit for the many broken nozzles.

Although 3vi1-D4n listed the hop-up/accuracy, i honestly, after installing stinger's/ra-tech's hop-up kit found the accuracy although not sniper grade ( can't compare it to the precision of my sniper guns aw338/vsr ) very skirmishable, i can hit torso sized targets at up to 70m, 8 out of 10 times ( measured and tested, .25g 400fps we m16 ).

 

Get me a good quality steel made trigger group and i won't ever need another replica ....

 

 

 

... ok that's not true because i can't see a gbbr and not buy it :P

 

 

BTW, ain't the new KSC/KWA be using WA type mechanics ? Pretty sure i saw something about it, if confirmed i wouldn't hold my breath ... anyone who chooses a WA based design is getting a one way ticket to Problem Town.

Edited by danielsilva

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Thanks for the quick replies, seems I have a tough choice to make seeing as I have little experience with gas platforms. I love to tinker just as much as anyone. Tinkering for the sake of improving something is fine; what I don't look forward to is something that falls apart on me regularly to the point of frustration. Performance is tweakable, but without a stable base to work from, who cares if my rifle is an uber accurate high-fps monster rof machine if it goes kaput every other game?

 

Funnily enough, the thing discouraging me from going 100% WE is the price. I guess the phrase "Buy expensive, cry once. Buy cheap, cry every day" is something that I've learned the hard way over the years. I guess I'll have to buy both? lol

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Funnily enough, the thing discouraging me from going 100% WE is the price. I guess the phrase "Buy expensive, cry once. Buy cheap, cry every day"

 

This doesn't apply to WE. The problem here are the trigger parts, no matter how much you tinker or work on them you cannot fix the auto/burst fire problem. Eventually you will end up replacing these parts every 2 months or so. Everything else is "fixable", with time and money.

 

Also, one thing to mention, if your receivers, outer barrels or any other build parts should break you'll be out of luck trying to find a replacement. KJW will sell you these parts for their platform, and WA/WOC has many aftermarket replacements available as well. That's another problem that's never been mentioned.

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This doesn't apply to WE. The problem here are the trigger parts, no matter how much you tinker or work on them you cannot fix the auto/burst fire problem. Eventually you will end up replacing these parts every 2 months or so. Everything else is "fixable", with time and money.

 

My v1 still has the original trigger group ( only filed it once ), with propane that isn't such a huge problem, Co2 on the other hand ...

 

Also, one thing to mention, if your receivers, outer barrels or any other build parts should break you'll be out of luck trying to find a replacement. KJW will sell you these parts for their platform, and WA/WOC has many aftermarket replacements available as well. That's another problem that's never been mentioned.

 

So you're afraid of breaking a receiver or outer barrel ? I mean ... holy shinto :blink: My M16 has a 4/5mm thick steel outer barrel that it's heavier than the gun itself.

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So you're afraid of breaking a receiver or outer barrel ? I mean ... holy shinto :blink: My M16 has a 4/5mm thick steel outer barrel that it's heavier than the gun itself.

 

There have been numerous reports of broken threads on the upper receiver, broken trigger guard ears as well as receiving factory broken uppers and lowers. Good luck trying to replace them.

 

Co2 might be the culprit behind the trigger set degradation, but aren't the newest WE GBBR's marketed as "Co2 versions"??? It makes no sense ordering a "Co2 version" if you can only use Green gas.

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There have been numerous reports of broken threads on the upper receiver, broken trigger guard ears as well as receiving factory broken uppers and lowers. Good luck trying to replace them.

 

Co2 might be the culprit behind the trigger set degradation, but aren't the newest WE GBBR's marketed as "Co2 versions"??? It makes no sense ordering a "Co2 version" if you can only use Green gas.

 

You CAN use CO2, the trigger group just degrades way faster. But still that doesn't imply that you can't use CO2, i use CO2 exclusively on my M16, but that is with a custom/DIY re-enforced trigger group. Is the perfect solution ? no. Do i want a better trigger group from the beginning ? Hell yes. But that doesn't change the fact that i still use CO2 and it's currently the one GBBR replica who offers CO2 support from the box ( if a bit screwed ).

 

Regarding the numerous broken upper threads reports, i've just seen two cases and one of them was to actually show that somewhere, somehow someone was selling "fake" receivers and that the WETTI ones were somehow better ( highly dubious ). Although the KJW/Tanio Koba GBBR seems very durable, i've seen receivers break ( it is in the Arnies KJW thread anyway ), can you get them from KJW ? Apparently so, but that doesn't make it a perfect solution since not everyone is from USA or HK and there are various country's with severe/strict importation laws regarding these kind of parts ( unfortunately i'm in one of them ) and getting parts directly from KJW is simply not an option.

 

Point is, 90% of failures are due to internal parts breaking and that, at least on Europe, i can get and have all of them at home without any hassle.

Edited by danielsilva

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in total i've bought 4 WE. two m4, a scar, and the last was 416. Three "major" problems are broken nozzle (fixed by co2 stainless nozzle), charging handle (fixed by steel charging handle from 3rd party product), and hop up rubber (i plan to buy ratech stinger if it is recommended).

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It's a number of reasons actually, could be any one or more of the following:

-Worn/rounded corner on bolt carrier (area that bolt stop hits). Fixed by lightly filing down the area back to right angles.

-Wobbly bolt stop. Fixed by adding a shim to keep it upright.

-Spring under bolt stop lever too stiff. Some have replaced it with a weaker one or cut a couple coils from the original.

-Resistance of movement by plates on the mag. Fixed with oil or smoothing out sharp corners that could snag.

-Severely worn plates on the mag. Fixed by replacing them.

 

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Does anyone know why my bolt stop only works when I don't have BBs in the mag? When I do, the bolt stop switch doesn't want to stay up. Very strange.

 

Not really, that is how it is designed to work.

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Does anyone know why my bolt stop only works when I don't have BBs in the mag? When I do, the bolt stop switch doesn't want to stay up. Very strange.

 

Sounds like you should take your gun back and get one that locks back when there are still BB's in the mag.

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Apparently there are good news coming for the WE long running problem, it appears there is a new trigger group coming, made from forged and CNC'd finished steel ( maybe a bit overkill but hey ). Let's hope the fitting quality is as good as the manufacturing process is.

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Apparently there are good news coming for the WE long running problem, it appears there is a new trigger group coming, made from forged and CNC'd finished steel ( maybe a bit overkill but hey ). Let's hope the fitting quality is as good as the manufacturing process is.

 

 

Where did you get this information? And who is making these?

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Sounds like you should take your gun back and get one that locks back when there are still BB's in the mag.

Like an AGM? Tilt the gun sideways to the left while firing and the bolt stop engages even with bbs. ;)

 

thanks RC: my bolt stop indeed has worn /rounded parts. i tried filing. it's still the same

Check the BCG as well. If that part has rounded out it would keep slipping just the same.

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Well since there isn't much support from 3rd party's ( at least good companies like RA-Tech/Stinger )) i think i'll just create my own parts for it. I was already building parts for a custom M16 based DMR project but wasn't planning to "release" anything but now i think i'll reconsider it. So ... not counting the trigger set ( will test the CWI one first ) and hop-up ( already beeing worked on from others ) what do you would like to see for the WE ?

 

- Custom Lenght/Design Outer Barrel ( already on the works for me, manufacturing in short time )

- Ambi Mag Catch ?

- Redesigned Bolt Release/Catch ?

- ???

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Well since there isn't much support from 3rd party's ( at least good companies like RA-Tech/Stinger )) i think i'll just create my own parts for it. I was already building parts for a custom M16 based DMR project but wasn't planning to "release" anything but now i think i'll reconsider it. So ... not counting the trigger set ( will test the CWI one first ) and hop-up ( already beeing worked on from others ) what do you would like to see for the WE ?

 

- Custom Lenght/Design Outer Barrel ( already on the works for me, manufacturing in short time )

- Ambi Mag Catch ?

- Redesigned Bolt Release/Catch ?

- ???

 

thats a good idea, i was thinking to custom my own parts as well but im not good in designing :P

there are a lot of companies out there and 1 of them is http://www.emachineshop.com/

so to those who are good in designing using cad, show us your work :D

i'd love to get a steel ambi-selector

 

anyway prime just released magpul receiver in tan

http://www.tokyo-model.com.hk/ecshop/goods.php?id=6284

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Well since there isn't much support from 3rd party's ( at least good companies like RA-Tech/Stinger )) i think i'll just create my own parts for it. I was already building parts for a custom M16 based DMR project but wasn't planning to "release" anything but now i think i'll reconsider it. So ... not counting the trigger set ( will test the CWI one first ) and hop-up ( already beeing worked on from others ) what do you would like to see for the WE ?

 

- Custom Lenght/Design Outer Barrel ( already on the works for me, manufacturing in short time )

- Ambi Mag Catch ?

- Redesigned Bolt Release/Catch ?

- ???

 

Will you release a trigger in the TSC(type 1)style? I bought 2 of them, but my SPR keep firing in Auto with it, so I was forced to put the original trigger back in...

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