WE Gas Blow Back M4A1 Carbine

[rvlyssup]

The concern I have is when the front or the carrier mars the edge of the hop up. Unlike the Magna system, WE is one piece assembly and like Reppy pointed out, pot metal & a *suitcase*-ty one at that. However, it looks like the marring does not get any worse. That may change when using an AL nozzle. RAT still having it in its prototype stage may be to address issues and may also be working on an AL hop up. That will be golden.

[Reppyboyo]

Steel hop up would be my choice.

Would buy instantly.

[rvlyssup]

Steel hop up would be my choice.

Would buy instantly.

Hell, I'll take one or each.

[jkpics]

YES, there IS a market for a really nice steel hopup for WE M4/M16/416, make it 30-40 USD and se them fly of the shelf.

 

There is also a market for a nozzel in some good fiber reinforced plastic.

[kullwarrior]

YES, there IS a market for a really nice steel hopup for WE M4/M16/416, make it 30-40 USD and se them fly of the shelf.

 

There is also a market for a nozzel in some good fiber reinforced plastic.

 

Nozzle for $30-40USD is reasonable by RA-Tech's standard

 

But last time I saw RA-tech's WA NPAS nozzle....$150USD makes one wonder why such a price.

[Basic-Wedge]

I received my first batch of second generation magazines from WGC today.

 

Externally, these new mags look no different from the first series, so I removed the baseplate to make sure they are, in fact, the new type. (The new series has an extra screw to hold the magazine halves together)

 

The packaging looks the same, with just a sticker listing the new model number being added. Inside, WE now encloses the magazines inside a thin foam sleeve for a slight bit of protection. As always, the mags arrived charged with some sort of gas.

 

I'll give them a test in the coming days, and I'll report on their performance.

[NonEx]

What do you mean charged with gas? Full load ? If not I would assume it is the air and/or vapour inside the chamber that expands and contracts slightly during transport due to temperature and pressure changes that give you that slight *pfft* exhale when newly delivered from HK. Transporting pressurized containers via Air is strictly forbidden so I doubt they were intentionally charged with gas.

Edited May 9, 2012 by NonEx

[Reppyboyo]

Mine did not come with any foam protection, nor charged with gas.

P-mags and the Tango Down mag shell still fit perfectly.

[Basic-Wedge]

No, it was more than a slight Pffftt. They may have just half filled the mags with air, but they were definitely pressurized - equal to about half a mag full.

[rvlyssup]

I'm going to be placing an order soon for a coupe of these new design mags. Along with my curiosity, it will be interesting to see how these new mags will hold up. If they do well, all of us WE owners just need to be supplied with OB hop up parts to be golden.

[Reppyboyo]

 

RA-Tech alu nozzle.

Goes from 400 to 460fps.

So a bit useless for most of us.

[rvlyssup]

I'm sure they'll have an NPAS for it Reppy...

[Reppyboyo]

The NPAS is built into it.

[intinerious]

The NPAS is built into it.

 

From what I can tell it seems like they redesigned the whole nozzle system with the Alu nozzle? If they stuck with the original WE design you can always fit a weaker floating valve spring to lower the fps beyond the range the NPAS valve works with the stock valve spring, but I'm not sure what exactly did RATECH do with the new design. They said it's modelled after the WA system, can anyone chime in on how the valve mech should look like? It's not very clear from his ppt.

[rvlyssup]

Duh ...Lol, now I see...couldn't watch the video where I was @ this morning when I posted my response.

[kullwarrior]

From what I can tell it seems like they redesigned the whole nozzle system with the Alu nozzle? If they stuck with the original WE design you can always fit a weaker floating valve spring to lower the fps beyond the range the NPAS valve works with the stock valve spring, but I'm not sure what exactly did RATECH do with the new design. They said it's modelled after the WA system, can anyone chime in on how the valve mech should look like? It's not very clear from his ppt.

I had the WA NPAS before, let me put it this way: ITS A DISASTER

1) Flute valve nub tends to break (the NPAS key is a female end attached to the NPAS as Male end, It gets so twisted typically it breaks

2) The NPAS is adjust by length of the nozzle base (the current WE adjust the flute valve length) the recoil of the gun tends to loosen the base causing it to auto decrease the FPS (without temperature influence) people tends to put loctite or harder spring, which increase the likely hood of causing problem #1

3) There's too many stuff obstructing the nozzle port where gas go in base of nozzle (four prongs) AND the flute valve (three prongs), It self adjust so fps changes dramatically (one shot can be 400s next shot 100s, as shown in video....IT'S NORMAL)

 

One thing I'm surprise is the lowest fps setting. WA NPAS can set the fps to zero (where bb just fall out or incapable of being shot out of the barrel)

 

And guys let me just let you know the cost....

WA NPAS w/ Aluminium nozzle $150USD (I'm not joking)

WA Steel Carrier by RA-Tech is $120USD

Steel Carrier w/ NPAs Aluminium Nozzle is $260USD

 

WE is ~$90USD for the carrier, I suspect it's going to be $100-$150 for the NPAS Nozzle

 

I'm actually quite excited about the product, but if the price is high, I might buy a KWA LM4 see how it performs before continue turning my gun from WE w/ RA-Tech upgrade into RA-Tech w/ WE downgrades.

[intinerious]

I had the WA NPAS before, let me put it this way: ITS A DISASTER

1) Flute valve nub tends to break (the NPAS key is a female end attached to the NPAS as Male end, It gets so twisted typically it breaks

2) The NPAS is adjust by length of the nozzle base (the current WE adjust the flute valve length) the recoil of the gun tends to loosen the base causing it to auto decrease the FPS (without temperature influence) people tends to put loctite or harder spring, which increase the likely hood of causing problem #1

3) There's too many stuff obstructing the nozzle port where gas go in base of nozzle (four prongs) AND the flute valve (three prongs), It self adjust so fps changes dramatically (one shot can be 400s next shot 100s, as shown in video....IT'S NORMAL)

 

One thing I'm surprise is the lowest fps setting. WA NPAS can set the fps to zero (where bb just fall out or incapable of being shot out of the barrel)

 

And guys let me just let you know the cost....

WA NPAS w/ Aluminium nozzle $150USD (I'm not joking)

WA Steel Carrier by RA-Tech is $120USD

Steel Carrier w/ NPAs Aluminium Nozzle is $260USD

 

WE is ~$90USD for the carrier, I suspect it's going to be $100-$150 for the NPAS Nozzle

 

I'm actually quite excited about the product, but if the price is high, I might buy a KWA LM4 see how it performs before continue turning my gun from WE w/ RA-Tech upgrade into RA-Tech w/ WE downgrades.

 

Hmmm so there's a chance they went a step in the wrong direction with this one...

 

You've seen the previous vid right? Does the ppt diagram look anything like the WA NPAS? To me it does but I've never held one before so I wouldn't know ><;

[kullwarrior]

The prototype the had in the 2011 Dec, KSC's NPAS are the exact same as WA. The end of the nozzle is so similiar between those system I'm not sure if they're interchangeable (there isn't any tell tale sign by itself compared to others.

[NonEx]

They responded to the YT video feedback of the FPS being too high, let's see if they release a low powered version as well!

[Basic-Wedge]

I'm surprised by RA-Tech's assertion gas can leak from the connection where the two WE nozzle parts join. The connection on my nozzle seems tight and precise. Does anyone else see that as a source for gas leaking? Would it really matter?

[LordElpus]

or could it be that RA-Tech use a "could happen" scenario to push their upgrade parts?

[kullwarrior]

or could it be that RA-Tech use a "could happen" scenario to push their upgrade parts?

 

I call BS on that, RA-Tech still also a two piece design, the gas goes all the way to the end of the nozzle pushing the bolt carrier. Let me make it simple for you guys to understand what's the biggest difference between stock WE nozzle + NPAS and RA-Tech Nozzle w/ NPAS

 

Stock WE Nozzle:

-$15-25/nozzle+$15/NPAS

-Made of plastic

-NPAS is the flute valve length

-less damaging to the hopup chamber

 

RA-Tech Aluminium nozzle

-Unknown price, but probably significantly more expensive (It's two piece CNC, the frontal end requires quite a bit of CNC programming aka lots of time aka more pricy)

-NPAS is the nozzle base's height

-potentially more damaging to the hop-up chamber

 

 

We'll see how pricy it is, but I really wish that RA-Tech allow the use of WE NPAS (it's a better design than the WA NPAS) IMHO the reason why RA-Tech kept falling back to the WA NPAS is because of patent rights (they have it patented in Japan)

[NonEx]

If you listened to what he had to say about twe two piece design he stated quiet blatantly that even though it might be a source for MINIOR leaks it was inisgnificant. It was just to highlight the differenses between the different nozzles.

[jkpics]

RA-Tech, fixing stuff that ain't broken.

[NonEx]

Well aren't you guys a happy bunch.

 

Yes, let's just hope all third party spare and upgrade parts manufacturers die out and disappear, who needs em anyways!

 

/sarcasm

 

If you don't like it, don't need it or don't want it then don't buy it or bother complaining. Manufacturers don't just produce random *suitcase* nobody wants, they are in it for a profit and make parts that the buyers want and they expect to offload enough to make a profit from the manufacturing process of said part.