BBs that do degrade.. and have seen em (over time)

[Wege]

In light of the various spamming.. and one with a NZ flag too.. for shame for shame!

 

These ones I know break down.

Why? Because (as I was shifting houses) I found a small white thing.

And went OHHH... it DOES break down.

 

It changed colour from an off white to a brown white AND it was looking like a very small but manky golfball.

 

It had been outside for about 6-8months? and not in a very wet place (Hawkes Bay NZ was officially in drought conditions at the time).

 

 

 

What other experiences have people PERSONALLY had with seeing 'decomposing BBs'?

(nothing kinky please)

 

edit- Tis a crappy webcam image i know.. they are EXCEL brand .25s and come in a bag of 1500 for 1000yen. (patent #296117 in Japan)

[Pyrodex]

a truely useful post sir. i have been literaly just seaching to buy a big bag of bios, but didnt know which are good, and which are BS.. Many thanks. *toddles off to buy some excels*

[Marlowe]

This is an example for any curious ammo companies of how to successfully promote a product. Oddly it seems to generate more interest than just signing up with false accounts to slate rivals.

 

N1 Wege.

[Stealthbomber]

Ages ago I "planted" half a dozen Bioval BBs in a little pot of soil and left it on my kitchen window sill outside.

After a year I dug them out to find they were still the same (kinda yellow-grey) colour ans still shiny.

I left em for another year and then dug em out again, only to find that nothing had changed.

I put them back again but, alas, the pot vanished.

 

I mentioned this before and I had people telling me I was "doing it wrong" and that the BBs needed sunlight to degrade or that other chemicals needed to be present.

I hope they don't need sunlight to degrade because most bioval BBs shot in woodland areas will be trampled into the soil.

 

I read somewhere else that they take 100 years or more to degrade.

I dunno.

I know they don't even begin to degrade in 2 years though.

[scorch]

I had some of the Xtreme Bio-X ones that apparently are so biodegradable, they come in a black bag as they also photo-degrade.

 

The packet said they could biodegrade in as little as 80 days.

 

 

Really good BBs too.

[Frontiers]

Ages ago I "planted" half a dozen Bioval BBs in a little pot of soil and left it on my kitchen window sill outside.

After a year I dug them out to find they were still the same (kinda yellow-grey) colour ans still shiny.

I left em for another year and then dug em out again, only to find that nothing had changed.

I put them back again but, alas, the pot vanished.

 

I mentioned this before and I had people telling me I was "doing it wrong" and that the BBs needed sunlight to degrade or that other chemicals needed to be present.

I hope they don't need sunlight to degrade because most bioval BBs shot in woodland areas will be trampled into the soil.

 

I read somewhere else that they take 100 years or more to degrade.

I dunno.

I know they don't even begin to degrade in 2 years though.

 

really interesting finding, would it be possible in Arnies to make some section for testing of these as we are a big community, with pictures and proof (some solid members of ours could do) with many different manufacturers Bios tested so we could really get some Green intel on these, that would surely benefit all of us and the damn earth we love to destroy now and then.

[Marlowe]

I don't know that a new section would be needed - could carry out a test and place the findings in the accessories review section though.

[Horsem4n]

it is true that most bio BBs need sunlight to degrade. they rely on cycles of damp/wet to dry and sunny. they degrade by slowly loosing moisture with the water collected on its surface via some kind of osmosis. the higher the plastic side of the ratio is of the plastic:starch ratio, the longer it takes to degrade.

 

some bad companies coat a starch ball with plastic to get a good surface, they don't degrade until the starchy inner ball is exposed. good companies spend the time to make a nice composite of mostly starch so it can hold a good surface and so that there is starch throughout the BB instead of just inside.

[P.S.I.]

There was/is a bio-degradable BB called "ECO BB" that dissolves in water in about one hour. Or a few minutes if put in a water bottle and shaken.

 

However, the BBs were/are complete rubbish. Severely out of round, break in GBBs, springers, etc. They also crush while being loaded in to non hi-cap mags, and "explode" into powder when they hit a hard surface. They are undergoing reformulation so who knows what they'll be like when that's done.

 

Here's a video I found featuring them.

[Raffles]

That sounds pretty lethal. Ive heard this used to be a common problem with biodegradable bb's but this company seems to be really behind the times.

[kustom]

great thread idea , i can confirm the cpappyness that is ecco brand bb's total hot garbage you can break them in between your fingers.

[uscmCorps]

I thought the concerns with Bio BBs, was less about whether or not they'd degrade/dissolve over time ... but more about whether they'd leave behind toxic metals and impurities harmful to the environment and fauna.

 

Personally I've always used Excel Bio BBs (0.25g and 0.2g) for years. They feed great and are labelled (Biodegradable). But until recently, I didn't really consider whether or not they're harmful once degraded/dissolved. After almost 20 years of playing obviously I'm not overly anal about BB littering, but if there are a few steps I can make to reduce my footprint, I'd like to know about them.

 

[Kraut]

I never really concerned myself with whether or not the BBs actually degrade. As long as they're accepted by the site that is requiring them, then I don't really care beyond that. The environment as tried enough to maim and kill me that I couldn't give a rodent's rear end if it gets seeded by a few tiny plastic BBs.

 

I have had Excel and G&G Bios turn to dust when I shot concrete from less than a foot away. The G&Gs performed the best out of a few brands I tried.

[Azulsky]

The most degrading i have seen is a color change to brown. Like i said in the other thread they will stay in my backyard forever and the lawnmower will fling them way over fps limits from time to time

[Sharamik]

My local site only allows Xtreme Bio BBs as they say they are the only BBs they have successfully tested to degrade. They don't shatter on contact but I have heard complaints about fouling in the barrel after a lot of use, though it is not something I've experienced personally.

[heroshark]

green devils are good too

[greg]

In all the years I've played airsoft, I've never seen a degraded bb.

 

Checking the floor of regular skirmish sites you find a verity of bb's but none that look 'degraded'.

 

This could by due to many things. Perhaps they take years to degrade, or they degrade suddenly, so you don't actually see them in the 'mid-degrade' stage.

 

Who cares, we wont be here when the planet dies.

 

A few bb's wont make any difference compared to what the top Chinese & US manufacturing industries are doing.

 

If you think your local forest is a mess, due to bbs, check out the mess your local land fill has made.

 

 

Greg.

[Clot]

Not sure which bb's I am talkin about here, but my mates went to a site which required them to use bio's that they sold.

 

After about a week after playing there, a couple guys had left ammo in their mags, and it had began to degrade and choke stuff up when fired.

 

They all franticly cleaned everythin once they found out.

 

Must find which brand they were.

[Furey]

i still dont get the point of bio BB's. At spectre's woodland they fire hundreds of thousands of rounds a year in a very small area, but year to year you dont see any accumulation of BB's as they all get trodden into the ground or covered with decomposing foliage. as i see it, all is well as long as BB's dont decompose and release toxins.

[trecam]

Sticks and Stones to Wege and Marlowe . This thread is poo and i am the fly.

 

As Bioval's official defence lawyer (gawd you guys are awesome) their compound has been cited BY A RIVAL COMPANY/INDIVIDUALS in US Patent 2007/0240601 section [0004] "1 year to degrade". You can't do that unless it actually works. :

 

http://www.google.com/patents?id=_OqkAAAAE...;q=&f=false

 

I thought the concerns with Bio BBs, was less about whether or not they'd degrade/dissolve over time ... but more about whether they'd leave behind toxic metals and impurities harmful to the environment and fauna.

 

Spot on and that's what the Pub Talk Press blog is about (yes i actually read all the attached documents ).

 

So now we know that some bbs degrade, some fragment, some erode a little, some are toxic, while others just sit there for a million years.

[Samm]

That Patent number you provided also mentions that BIOVAL BBs contain the same PLA (Polylactic Acid) as the Madbull and G&G brands. Along with polycaprolactone which is quite equally as selective with it's biodegradability, needing a very specific and not so natural environment in which to degrade and Polyhydroxybutyrate valerate, which is insoluble and ultraviolet light resistant.

 

It also states barium sulfate being used as a filler, which was apparently not present in Bioval BBs in their laboratory tests but listed as present in Excel and Cybergun BBs as "a compound found in plastic that doesn't beak down in our environment."

 

 

So Bioval's are just the same, if not worse for toxicity than G&G or Madbull.

[trecam]

That Patent number you provided also mentions that BIOVAL BBs contain the same PLA (Polylactic Acid) as the Madbull and G&G brands. Along with polycaprolactone which is quite equally as selective with it's biodegradability, needing a very specific and not so natural environment in which to degrade and Polyhydroxybutyrate valerate, which is insoluble and ultraviolet light resistant.

 

It also states barium sulfate being used as a filler, which was apparently not present in Bioval BBs in their laboratory tests but listed as present in Excel and Cybergun BBs as "a compound found in plastic that doesn't beak down in our environment."

 

 

So Bioval's are just the same, if not worse for toxicity than G&G or Madbull.

 

Mmm no it doesn't. Read it more carefully please.

[Marlowe]

Trecam: I suggest you leave the thread now.

 

You've been banned already for failing to state any commercial affiliation, and were only allowed back on following your communication. Your position here is, at best, probationary; a position which looks worringly jeapordized by your choosing to snipe at me for not allowing Bioval to carry out unscrupulous marketing techniques here. For that action, I have warned you. Continuation will result in a suspension and / or ban.

 

If you wish to sell Bioval products to the forum, do so in a reputable way; contact me, ask for commercial status and promote bioval on their strengths - not through cloak-and-dagger references to blogs of questionable origins which seek to criticise your rivals.

 

If I do see you continuing with your current attitude and intent to ram that Bioval's blog down people's throats, then I'm afraid I'll be obliged to treat you as an unsolicited commercial poster, and remove you from the forum in the same fashion that I would any other member.

 

Thanks.

[uscmCorps]

That kind of behavior just makes me not want to ever buy Biovals.

[Apex]

 

i think that says it all