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Philbucknall

WE SCAR Review

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It really doesn't make sense to rework the SCAR's trigger design, as WE themselves have re-used the same basic design with minor changes on 4 guns (M4, SCAR, PDW and G36). Changing the design means retooling, redesigning and recasting, which costs a lot of money - heck, if they didn't change the trigger group for a relatively drastically different gun (G36) why would they change it for an old one? My money is on just the hop, outer barrel and bolt, just like the PDW.

 

 

Yes a new design can have a "drastic impact" on how the gbbr will work. thing is ... The PDW still uses the same trigger group and possibly the M4/HK416 too, why on Earth would they change it just for the SCAR ? Not only that would mean the price would go up but that they would be screwing ALOT of costumers.

 

The old SCAR had the same trigger group as the M4/Hk416 and they ( apart from the firing pin assembly and valve locker, cheap upgrade ) always functioned perfectly with GG, why change something that works ?

 

 

 

If they really have changed the trigger so much that it wouldn't be compatible with the old one why on Mars would i be happy "just for being able to upgrade the old SCARs in the first place" ? Would you be happy to be screwed in the butt without lub too ?

 

 

 

Well maybe that's good for you but you have how many old WE rifles ? One SCAR ? Well maybe it isn't a big deal for you but what about people like me who has 4 of them ( and i'm just counting the bras tube ones here ) ? And even have some of them right from the beginning ( aka first gen M4's ) ?

I love my WE AR's a LOT but i also "wasted" a LOT of time putting them into working order, wasted a LOT of time coming up with solutions to fix the old versions problems and "wasted" a LOT of good money upgrading those parts ( half of them on the lower ) and now there's is a chance that all those things were pointless ?

IF that's really the case and we will not be able to use our older "complete" lowers on the open bolt versions, that's a serious case of bad costumer service and consideration for us first gen and old customers, period.

 

 

You guys were saying? :)

http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthread.php?p=1369316&posted=1#post1369316

 

This guy also is logic and says that an open bolt conversion is more than just replacing the brass tube.....

 

Just think for a while, if the open bolt system makes the gun more reliable, consistent and efficient could't it be just plain and simple consequence that the close bolt trigger assembly MIGHT just not be good enough to hold up with the new system?

 

AND i bet that the M4 will also keep it current trigger group when the open bolt system comes for that riffle.

 

 

If you do want to complain, complain about what they did to the PDW owners....

The PDW is a quite recent gun yet an open bolt version came very fast for it....i bet if they waited a bit longer they could have released it as open bolt first!

Because it seems indeed as you say that the PDW can keep its trigger assembly when converting to open bolt.

You might think WE did that delibirately :)

 

But for the M4 and Scar its a whole different story, those rifles are already some years old and just now they think about making them open bolt.

There trigger assembly is much older than the PDW wich seems to be open bolt capable!

The M4/Scar is not made with open bolt in their mind, so i repeat, i think its PERFECTLY normal if they had to redesign the trigger. Assemvly on those 2 OLD close bolt rifles to make the open bolt system work flawlessly!

 

Pure logic imo

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But for the M4 and Scar its a whole different story, those rifles are already some years old and just now they think about making them open bolt.

There trigger assembly is much older than the PDW wich seems to be open bolt capable!

The M4/Scar is not made with open bolt in their mind, so i repeat, i think its PERFECTLY normal if they had to redesign the trigger. Assemvly on those 2 OLD close bolt rifles to make the open bolt system work flawlessly!

 

Pure logic imo

 

Do you even research about what your saying ? The basic trigger assembly still is the freaking same since the Gen1 guns. You say things like "trigger assembly is much older than the PDW wich seems to be open bolt capable!" and yet i can transplant almost all of my Gen1 trigger components into a "latest gen" open bolt PDW trigger cage, hell i can put them on the latest G39c !! The only new gun that doesn't use the old M4 style trigger assembly is the M14 ...

 

Is your flawless logic saying that newly design products can all use the OLD trigger assembly yet the future original products can't use them on their new versions ? That's BS.

 

Yeeeeah good logic there buddeh. Advice for free, 1) stop copy-pasting other peoples thoughts and facts 2) get your own thoughts and facts ;)

 

I won't drag this issue anymore as i'll just wait for what they'll do when the time comes cause after that last post it seems this diiscussion is a bit pointless ...

Edited by danielsilva

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Do you even research about what your saying ? The basic trigger assembly still is the freaking same since the Gen1 guns. You say things like "trigger assembly is much older than the PDW wich seems to be open bolt capable!" and yet i can transplant almost all of my Gen1 trigger components into a "latest gen" open bolt PDW trigger cage, hell i can put them on the latest G39c !! The only new gun that doesn't use the old M4 style trigger assembly is the M14 ...

 

Is your flawless logic saying that newly design products can all use the OLD trigger assembly yet the future original products can't use them on their new versions ? That's BS.

 

Yeeeeah good logic there buddeh. Advice for free, 1) stop copy-pasting other peoples thoughts and facts 2) get your own thoughts and facts ;)

 

I won't drag this issue anymore as i'll just wait for what they'll do when the time comes cause after that last post it seems this diiscussion is a bit pointless ...

 

... Changing from their "Closed bolt" to their "open bolt" system is an entire re-vamp of the internals.

 

They don't just remove the brass tube.

And when the time comes, I will say: I told you say.

And you will be all like: ow *suitcase*, you were absolutely right! :)

Edited by Riko

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So now your "logic" now is copy pasting another persons obvious opinion ? Your reasoning is astonishing lol

 

Sorry but i must stop here, this discussion has gotten low/bad enough ...

 

you are gonna stop now? well thats very smart :) and exactly what I would do if I were losing a discussion....;)

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That sure is an interesting statement frontal someone who

 

a) only copy pastes other peoples opinions

B) fails to justify is opinions and moves to the next one to escape it

c) still fails to justify why the SCAR couldnt use the old trigger group when, besides the M14, the other already existant open bolt models use the old trigger group

d) fails to know that the current open bolt models still use the same basic trigger group than the old closed bolt ones

 

The only thing you do is forward other people thoughts on the matter and when you dont have them move on to the next thing.

 

Am i really losing lol ? Feel free to reply all you want i shouldnt have replied in the first place. I apolagize to the rest for putting up with this ridiculous discussion.

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That sure is an interesting statement frontal someone who

 

a) only copy pastes other peoples opinions

B) fails to justify is opinions and moves to the next one to escape it

c) still fails to justify why the SCAR couldnt use the old trigger group when, besides the M14, the other already existant open bolt models use the old trigger group

d) fails to know that the current open bolt models still use the same basic trigger group than the old closed bolt ones

 

The only thing you do is forward other people thoughts on the matter and when you dont have them move on to the next thing.

 

Am i really losing lol ? Feel free to reply all you want i shouldnt have replied in the first place. I apolagize to the rest for putting up with this ridiculous discussion.

Aaahaha, you actually replied in a serious way even though you said you would stop :)

So, you just cant let go huh....? Omg this is fun :P i wonder what comes next

 

ow and i did already form an opinion on this matter, and its my arguments that got you pumped up in the first place... ;) remember, or forgot already?

So dont make up false arguments.

The guy i refered to just confirmed what i was saying AFTER i said it and INDEPENDANT from this board

 

 

Also you are an hypocrite ego tripper for apologizing.

If you really did care about the rest of the board, you would have replied in a PM....

But the truth is, you cant let go and you must always have the last word. The fact that you say you would stop because this discussion "has gotten low/bad enough" and you still continue to go on proves me right.

You can say about me what you want, but at least I don't make promises about stopping, I actually enjoy the fact that you keep coming back :)

 

Ps: its normal to adjust the trigger assembly of the scar when converting to open bolt....:)

I wonder what will come next from danielsilva xD

Edited by Riko

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I have both SCAR's and PWD's here with me right now, and there is so much BS and and guesswork flying around.

 

The openbolt PDW uses 100% the same lower as the brass tube apart from the bolt release, the PDW also uses a M4 trigger pack with a extender rod for FA, the SCAR uses almost the same trigger pack the only non standard part in a SCAR trigger pack is the trigger it self, it is longer, so a M4 trigger will fit, but only half the trigger will be visible out of the lower resiver.

 

The openbolt PWD is a good gun, the only real problem (that can't be fixed IFAK) is the bolt release not working 100%, this goes back to the M4 magazines with the puny lever (M14 and G36 mags about 5X bigger) so to fix this problem for good new mags and new bolt release, but not necessarily the trigger pack.

 

Well the trigger pack IS a weak link, it wears out to fast, but only until you upgrade to steel from ra-tech, then it is fine, but not for the SCAR ra-tech don't make a SCAR steel trigger, if WE wants a total redesign they might be shooting them self in the foot, the PDW openbolt kit was about 100 USD and new magasin tops about 4 USD, if the SCAR kit includes a trigger pack and need new mags we are talking about the same as a new gun, and you can't use the old mags.

 

But on the other hand just make the best damn gun you can, new mags and all, and drop the idea of upgrading the older models.

 

And FFS fix the M4's already

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Quick question, I've just traded for a WE Scar, and it works fine, but there is one small problem. When I manually pull the bold handle back it's very stiff, like something is binding. It works fine when it shoots, it's just when you pull the handle manually.

 

Can anyone please help?

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hmm if that is his problem I think he would also have a problem with the bolt moving forward, not only backwards...

but he might have to check to for sure...

happy.al look at the hammer and see if you still got the silver roller on the hammer and if the pin is still there that holds the roller on the hammer....

 

 

I you lost it, try to find it and when you do superglue the pin but not the roller.

You need that roller for smooth contact between bolt and hammer otherwise you will destroy your hammer....

Edited by Riko

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Does it have the RA Tech NPAS installed?

 

I found on mine, with the NPAS, the bolt can sometimes bind, because the NPAS O-ring is a very tight fit in the chamber.

 

It works fine - you just need to keep applying silicone. When I skirmish it, I give it a big spray of silicone in the morning before the game starts, and then again at lunchtime.

 

Ben.

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Quick question, I've just traded for a WE Scar, and it works fine, but there is one small problem. When I manually pull the bold handle back it's very stiff, like something is binding. It works fine when it shoots, it's just when you pull the handle manually.

 

Can anyone please help?

 

There are quite a few problems that can make that happen.

When you pull back the handle is the "stiffness" feeling only at the beginning or through the entire bolt travel ?

Do you feel it "stiff" only when pulling it back or it also very stiff pushing it forward ?

Again when you push it forward, is the stiffness throughout the entire bolt travel of just in the end ?

 

Here's the common causes for it:

 

Insufficient lubing on the nozzle's main o-ring

If you use an NPAS, the o-ring that comes with it absorbs too much oil and swells

Bent brass tube, remove the brass tube and check if it's not bent upwards

 

This following mod should be made regardless of part#117 being the problem or not,

 

Part #117 ( at least on the M4, don't know the part number on the SCAR ) is too tight on the nozzle. You should take it out and smooth the insides ( if you look through it you should see that it is ribbed, just remove sufficient material so that you don't see the ribs anymore ). Also modify the tip of the nozzle, the standard M4/SCAR nozzle is "fatter" on the tip, compare the tip of the M4/SCAR nozzle to the PDW one ( on the bottom ).

 

TSC-TS-19_1_mark.jpg

 

09.jpg

 

With this mod not only is the bolt movement much smoother but you now can use Co2 without the nozzle pillars always breaking, and it actually helps accuracy too cause you also remove the excess material that makes the BB's hook. You will loose a bit of compression though!

Ohh and it also helps with the cold since now even with that part shrinking with the cold it still has enough leeway for the nozzle not get stuck in it ;)

Edited by danielsilva

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Nice mod danielsilva, with this mod i no longer have bb´s hooking to sides and no shaved bb´s accumulating in the lower reciever and no more rod jamming in the brass tube.

Who would imagine that such a simple mod would do so much for this rifle.

About the open bolt system, imo, i don´t see why there would be a necessity to change the trigger group since it is only related to the magazine, in the way the firing pin hits the gas release valve.

Sure that the magazine lip should be differente and need to be replaced for the open bolt system and the hop-up group to, but to redisign a lower trigger assembly imo it dosen´t make any sense!

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The SCAR bolt has 2 barrings that runs on the top of the resiver, I have seen alot of them installed rather soddy, wack then with a hammer and hit them with a file to make them even and run nicly in the gun, also make sure the guide rails in the resiver are fixed propperly, if lose use loctite to fix in place.

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Check this out guys http://tw.myblog.yahoo.com/frogman-myblog/article?mid=6209&next=6195&l=f&fid=20

It looks like it´s almost ready to be realesed into the market, and it is about time we see our brass tube gone forever!!!

 

look at the date at the top of the page: 2010/05/20

 

also you can see from the date of the youtube film, that this is already old news, being months old.

 

+ I mailed WE on this and he said, they are still in testing fase and its not for soon....but I hope its sooner than he says.

 

But based on that link, its nothing new! waggle.gif

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