GBB M4's Confiscated and Destroyed

[Stealthbomber]

I remember intensely debating the issue previously when someone posted the 'rumor' about WE M4's getting banned from import. Of course that turned in to an 80 page flame war and we never did hear from the original poster again.

 

So is this just a continuation of policy that's been in place for some time? Or is it just a one off (and idiotic) occurrence on behalf of US Customs?

TBH, I wouldn't like to comment.

All I know is that WE apparently altered the design of the trigger components for their SCAR because of problems they had importing their M4 into the USA.

I dunno if you recall but I seem to remember that even WETTi posted something to this effect when people asked if their SCAR would face the same import hassles their M4 had.

 

Note that the feature, although dated 24th Feb 2010, is actually referring to "30 machine guns that arrived in an ocean container at the Tacoma Seaport last October".

It's probably the same seizure that caused the original panic and 80 page thread.

 

I guess only an American could confirm if WE M4s have been available from US suppliers in the period between October and now.

If they haven't then I guess it's an ongoing issue.

If they have then I guess it was a one-time thing and it's just made the news again, possibly cos the guns have just been crushed.

 

Certainly you do not mean that... XD

Erm, I don't understand.

 

I DO mean that a well known manufacturer of airsoft products was trying to secure a deal to import WE M4s into the USA and, when the deal fell through, they handed several WE M4s over to the ATF.

There's actually a little more to the story too, related to the AGM M4, but that's kinda beside the point.

[renegadecow]

The ATF did classify the rubber band as a machine gun part (or was it a shoe lace) so no surprise they'd assume a WE M4 is a machine gun too. Now all the tweens in the US wanting to buy one are going "I can has machine gun?".

[ST19AG_WGreymon]

The ATF did classify the rubber band as a machine gun part (or was it a shoe lace) so no surprise they'd assume a WE M4 is a machine gun too. Now all the tweens in the US wanting to buy one are going "I can has machine gun?".

 

It was a shoe lace.

[leejinwen]

didn't the same thing happen with horizon tactical last year?

[fireman]

One of the Investigators for the security department of the corporation I work for just retired from the the ATF. I spoke with him about the legality of the WE and other GBB rifles and he said he would check into it and let me know. I haven't heard back from him yet but when I do I'll pass on the information.

 

[Seraphim989]

No you can not and yes I have tried. It is not possible without significant machining/alteration of the lower receiver to make it work. Hell we might as well ban aluminum blocks while were at it, cause those could be "illegally modified" too. Think of it, it's for the children.

 

I thought you fit a RS sear into yours?

[ultimentra]

I hate the idiotic people of my country sometimes.

[fiddlesticks4220]

I hate the idiotic people of my country sometimes.

 

They are not idiots, they just are not gun nuts. They shouldn't have to explain why they took something that LOOKED AND FELT like it could be made into a real weapon and didn't let it pass.

 

I am 100 percent ANYONE here having not know A LOT about airsoft would have done the same thing.

[Noart]

"These rifles could have had far-reaching and potentially devastating ramifications if they had gotten into the hands of individuals who wanted to do harm in the American population,"

 

 

So, what, the thousands of AR15's and hundreds of FA AR15's and not to mention the sheer amount of illegal weapons alredy in the US don't "harm the american population"?

 

 

And now we're talking about airsoft rifles too... Idiots. It's like Swedens import rules. Airsoft guns that uses "compressed gas" are illegal to import for individuals, except for CO2 because that's used in paintball markers and air rifles. Can you smell the irony?

[BrooklynBorn]

What *fruitcage* idiots.

 

I want to see them PROVE they can convert it.

 

If it was a WA- understandable. But a WE? Most unrealistic GBBR evar

[GI0VANNI]

But when I started in LARP I was able to put my hads on the guns, show them and even train in parks, it is the always "fear=ban/prosecution" equation.

For this kind of things is that I say 5 minutes teaching an ignorant bystander are worth 5 hour explaining a police oficer.

Personally I have seen in one of my facebook groups an american getting a clear "plastic" AR15 lower working but not the kind of plastic airsoft uses (security templates) and I think a baseball bat or a hammer is much more damaging than an airsoft.

Also, are you the ones that have the lay saying an armed assault can be made with real or fake guns with the same punishment, arent you?, so where is the problem? make something illeegal with an airsoft gun/toy/marker or hammer, bat, stick... I can not see the problem with WE m4's if the LOWER (were the serial number is) is not compatible while I know you can buy a 80% finished AK47 lower with the ATF ok, or machining NON AUTOMATIC GUNS at home with no more problems.

[Presley1977]

Wow! Convert them to fire real ammo - now why hasn't anyone thought of doing that...erm....because it would be like trying to convert a dog into a Ferrari?

 

Aren't these people supposed to be real-firearms experts?

 

 

[hwagan]

Firearms experts maybe, but let's be fair here - A quick glance at the trigger group of a GBBR, and it's going to look pretty damn similar to a real F/A trigger group. Obviously the chances of a WE M4 firing even one round of live ammunition are insignificant, but i can kind of see where they're coming from. From an uneducated member of the public's point of view, if i looked into the chamber of even a WE GBBR, i'd be immediately convinced it was R/S.

 

What i think is stupid is the Media's coverage - All the news report serves to achieve is to alarm the public, spread further misinformation about airsoft and make the authorities seem even more annoying to us lot. Why didn't the ATF just quietly melt them down (assuming they had good reason, i'm guessing they would have at least some kind of customs violation to go on) and let that be the end of it?

 

Further evidence the modern media is going to be the death of human society...

 

Fact is, i have a variety of big sharp knives in my kitchen. I could easily go out and waste 15 people, if i were so inclined - The ABSOLUTE WORST i could do with an airsoft gun would be to beat someone to death with it, which would probably break the gun in the process. This news story is a huge pile of fail for everyone but the media organisation publishing it.

[nickberry66]

What i think is stupid is the Media's coverage - All the news report serves to achieve is to alarm the public, spread further misinformation about airsoft and make the authorities seem even more annoying to us lot. Why didn't the ATF just quietly melt them down (assuming they had good reason, i'm guessing they would have at least some kind of customs violation to go on) and let that be the end of it?

 

Really? The Media passing the chance to report something sensationalist? A government department missing the opportunity to make it look like they are keeping people safe in their beds from all the nasty terrorists that want to do them harm?

 

[hwagan]

*fruitcage* *suitcasey* prickish *Ubar* *albartroth* *fruitcage* *rickroller* media peckheads.

 

*ahem*

 

Things like this news story are why i hate the government/media/most other things so very much.

[WhiteHawksan]

if only that story finished with, in other news a container or AR15's bound for several highschools passed by without any hassle.

 

I believe this was said best by a well known signature, I'll let you in on a secret, I can do way more damage with a cricket bat!

[somegirls]

Well, people in germany freak out about guns here all the time, so I'm kinda used to it.

 

But that whole story has the word "bull.." written all over it.

 

Btw, they are WEs, they can't even shoot BBs properly, how are they supposed to shoot live rounds?

[The lolinator]

It's depressing how ignorant some people are...

[Stealthbomber]

If it was a WA- understandable. But a WE? Most unrealistic GBBR evar

I'll be surprised if that statement doesn't come back and bite you on the *ss.

[GuzziHero]

Once again the question to customs has to be raised...

 

"If one could convert these with real AR actions to fire real bullets...why would you disassemble a real working AR in the first place?"

 

Changing an AR15 to look like...well...an AR15. Makes no sense!

[emp3ror86]

I'm glad the american people is saved from these evil tools of terror masked as toys... and what a luck that the real firearms are produced within the country.

 

I hope they will make a live demonstration of how they can shoot a live round with one of these. It's gonna be an exploding success.

[Trasher]

The current crop of GBB rifles offer a too good opportunity for the ignorant authorities to miss.

 

They look/feel like real guns.

The internals look real(ish).

They operate like real guns.

Some RS parts are interchangeable with AS parts.

Some RS rifles look more toyish than these GBBRs (.22 LR AR-lookalikes using pot metal parts, for example).

 

GBBRs can do more harm than good to our sport.... They all shoot like cr*p, anyway.

 

[Desolation mkII]

If I am honest, if a terrorist tells me he wants to use a plastic toy gun that can cause an irritating welt over a real steel AK47 (which at one point you could pick up in Leeds for around £150) I am heppy to let him.

[DiscoBiscuit]

if only that story finished with, in other news a container or AR15's bound for several highschools passed by without any hassle.

 

Ha! Well put. Reminds me of a George Carlin routine: "so they're getting rid of the toy guns now...but they're keeping the F----ing real ones!

 

Homeland security at its finest, countless lived saved by this action. If I'm an ATF superior I work extra hard to keep a lid on this as it's F----ing embarassing. Maybe they'll end up training with them and WE will have a new customer.

[Kalmar]

They are not idiots, they just are not gun nuts. They shouldn't have to explain why they took something that LOOKED AND FELT like it could be made into a real weapon and didn't let it pass.

 

I am 100 percent ANYONE here having not know A LOT about airsoft would have done the same thing.

 

No. They are idiots. You can't go around inforcing make believe laws on a whim simply because you feel something might be illegal - Oh wait! - That's what the ATF is for! Fact is these people are supposed to be experts in the field. THATS THEIR JOB. Just because they think something might be illegal doesn't mean it is and just because they think something might be a machingun does not make it so. They need to provide solid evidence if that's the case and simply looking at something does not constitute a life fire test. Like others have said, it would be interesting to see them try... it's not happening. So what we have here is $10,000 of someones livelihood destroyed. Pretty sad if it was a customs screw up (no orange tip), effing ridiculous if it's what the articles report as true. I mean, if these things really are machine guns - that means they've been screwing up the past 2-3 years these have gotten in the country. And what does that mean for the people who already own them? Should I be hearing black helicopters soon? Or am I grandfathered in... Pre-'10 assault airsoft ban ha!