Fuses

[Hissing_Sid]

Is that fast enough?  Obviously the fuse pops instantly, but how much damage would those few seconds to get in and disconnect the battery cause?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, assuming you stop shooting when there's a problem it should be OK.

 

If the problem causes the the trigger contacts to overheat and begin to melt then there's a very good chance that wires could begin to burn and melt while you're disconnecting the battery though.

 

You're talking to somebody who once went back to a car which caught fire on a petrol-station forecourt, popped the bonnet and disconnected the battery with a 1/2" AF spanner (and got a mention in the local paper for doing it) so the idea of removing the battery from a smoking AEG doesn't really fill me with dread.

 

Basically, though, stopping shooting will break the circuit until something bad happens to the trigger switch.

[Prometheus]

These guns are WAY too expensive to say "I'd rather blow a motor than get a external bag."

 

That is total bull. I know you may be one of those guys that is always going for the "realistic" aspect of the sport. GET OVER IT!!!

 

What is the point of trying to be realistic if your gun is a pile of broken gears and melted plastic (or metal).

 

~P

[Hissing_Sid]

So that'd be a "no" then?

[Duff Beer]

Well, assuming you stop shooting when there's a problem it should be OK.

 

If the problem causes the the trigger contacts to overheat and begin to melt then there's a very good chance that wires could begin to burn and melt while you're disconnecting the battery though.

 

You're talking to somebody who once went back to a car which caught fire on a petrol-station forecourt, popped the bonnet and disconnected the battery with a 1/2" AF spanner (and got a mention in the local paper for doing it) so the idea of removing the battery from a smoking AEG doesn't really fill me with dread.

 

Basically, though, stopping shooting will break the circuit until something bad happens to the trigger switch.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well obvously the damage won't be nuclear scale, but I was thinking financially more than anything. I guess the possibility of the wiring melting is motivation to get the battery out sharpish.

 

Smooth work with the car as well.

[ColSanders]

Well then... I'll be honest and say in just about every gun... save my MP5K... I had one problem with my SR16 at one point and upon hearing the weird sound I pulled the finger off the trigger and checked it out... Other than that I've never had any reason for a fuse nor have I used one...

 

Is it a good idea to have one? Probably

Do I use one? Nope...

 

Alex "Col Sanders"

[nuclear_darkness]

My fuse is removed but i had no choice in the matter as WGC took it upon themselves to remove it. The first few times i used it, it sounded as normal as an aeg should do. But i noticed a distinct acidic burning smell. Like the kindof smell u get with batteries that are rusting and old. It has stopped now i think, but could that have anything to do with the fuse or is it just the gun "breaking itself in"?

[Duff Beer]

Your fuse should still be in there, you have the clip for it. Have they bridged the connection in such a way you can't replace it for a fuse?

[kronic]

These guns are WAY too expensive to say "I'd rather blow a motor than get a external bag."

 

That is total bull. I know you may be one of those guys that is always going for the "realistic" aspect of the sport. GET OVER IT!!!

 

What is the point of trying to be realistic if your gun is a pile of broken gears and melted plastic (or metal).

 

~P

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

My gun, my money.

 

If i want to have an internal battery and no fuse, but run the risk of breaking something, then i'll do it.

 

Also i don't see how an electrical fault would break my gears?

[ColSanders]

If too much current passes it either

A. overexerts the motor against a stoppage of some sort (the usual case) causing a burn out... usually something else has gone wrong before this happens so only thing you've done is save your motor... chances are though the S***'s already hit the fan in this case so fuse or not your probably SOL.

B. Gets past the blockage by nailing the motor on overdrive and if you've got weak gears, snap there goes the teeth.

C. No blockage whatsoever but the jump in current from... something causes a quick burst on the gears and strips them (once again only if lousy gears or weak gears).

 

I'm sure there's more cases, but there's more than a few for you to think about.

 

Alex "Col Sanders"

[Chinopants]

Umm I did remove a fuse when it blew and had to fix my gun. gears were jammed up and Its a good thing I did have a fuse blow. rather replace a .40cent piece then 30$ motor. But in my laziness and i'm imbarresed to say this I haven't replaced the fuse yet on my gun and the brass clips are just clipped together after 4 months of playing.

[Ghost_Rider]

Umm I did remove a fuse when it blew and had to fix my gun. gears were jammed up and Its a good thing I did have a fuse blow. rather replace a .40cent piece then 30$ motor. But in my laziness and i'm imbarresed to say this I haven't replaced the fuse yet on my gun and the brass clips are just clipped together after 4 months of playing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'm guilty of the same.

 

Really should get around to replacing the fuse in my M4 from when I blew it at AG05.

[Sale]

These guns are WAY too expensive to say "I'd rather blow a motor than get a external bag."

 

That is total bull. I know you may be one of those guys that is always going for the "realistic" aspect of the sport. GET OVER IT!!!

People already pay good money to make their guns realistic so it makes sense to me. If I had absolutely no space for a fuse in my gun, I'd leave out without thinking twice. Still though, I have a 9,6 V 1700 mAh battery in the handguards of my M4. I took out the fuse plate, but left the fuse in in a smaller housing. Most of the time you can fit the fuse inside the gun if you bother to think about it a little.

 

Still, removing the fuse does not cause anything. It'll only be a problem if something goes wrong, and usually not even then. Whenever I've seen or heard gears strip, they usually whine free inside the box. It's pretty safe to say at that point that the gun is broken, and a fuse won't help diagnosing the problem. You hear terrible noise from the box and that's it.

 

In a nutshell, it's there for a reason and there's no benefit of removing it. Usually there are ways to work around the space problem also.

 

-Sale

[AKRay]

Used the slightly more polite response of no.

 

I have three AEGs which don't have fuses, two of which were removed by UNCompany when I bought the guns, the third is due to re wiring the motor, which was bought separately and didn't come with one any way.

 

If I can get my hands on new fuse holders, then I'll have fuses in all three straight away.

[TriChrome]

There is NOTHING to be gained by operating an AEG with no fuse, and EVERYTHING to lose.

 

Myth: Removing the fuse gives you a higher rate of fire.

Truth: False.  A correct fuse will not alter the ROF of your gun.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Before I start with my opposing opinion, I would like to say you're absolutely correct that removing the fuse can damage your gun; so if you want to be safe, keep the fuse in. If you want to squeeze every bit of performance out of your gun, and know when to stop pulling the trigger when the gun isn't working, read below.

 

 

 

It's an electrical fact that the types of fuses AEG's use are detrimental to the resistance of the circuit. So with that fact in mind: removing the fuse lets more power flow to the gun which increases the ROF (although ever so slightly).

 

I recently re-wired all my guns with Deans Ultra connectors, and used sound editing software and a microphone to find each guns ROF before and after the upgrade. On the gun I upgraded last, I tested the ROF of the stock gun (stock connectors and fuse), then tested the ROF with the fuse removed, then tested the ROF with the fuse removed and Deans ultra connectors installed. With a 8.4v 1100mah Ni-Mh stick battery: Stock was shooting at 13.2 RPS, fuse removed was 13.6 RPS, and fuse removed and Deans connector installed was 14.2 RPS.

 

That may not be a large jump, but it's something. It still gave me 24 more RPM with the fuse removed, and 60 more RPM with the fuse removed and deans connectors installed. Try that with a high-speed set-up with a 9.6v or 10.8v battery and I bet you'll see even higher numbers and performance gained by simply removing the fuse (and even more gained by changing to deans connectors).

 

 

 

Now, is this worth frying your gun when it stops working and you still have your finger on the trigger? I think it's worth it for the people who know AEG's since not much is going to happen if you pull the trigger for a second or two. The wires may get hot, the battery may get hot, but the motor isn't going to blow-up because it had current going to it for a second when it couldn't spin (also, many people adjust their motor height in a manner that forces the motor to be seized for a little bit, and we all know this isn't likely to blow a motor).

 

The problems come when you don't know AEG's well and you keep on pulling that trigger for 20 seconds in a row trying to make it shoot again; then something could break. But on the other hand, you really shouldn't be messing with the wiring of your gun if you don't know to stop pulling the trigger when the gun won't shoot, right?

[Jimisin73]

Here Here TriChrome!!!

 

Basically, my rule is this:

If it's an upgraded gun, I am already operating outside of the engineered parameters, so if I can squeeze a bit more out of my battery (think over the limit spring upgrades... sorry UK guys) it might keep me from having to make the jump from 9.6 V to 10 or even 12 V... the fuse must go.

 

In my stock guns I keep it as it isn't hurting anything, and it was designed to be there.

 

To worry about burning your electronics because you don't have a fuse in a highly upgraded gun reminds me of putting a seatbelt on a motorcycle... if it comes to that point, you're already *fruitcage*ed

[visionviper]

I recently re-wired all my guns with Deans Ultra connectors, and used sound editing software and a microphone to find each guns ROF before and after the upgrade. On the gun I upgraded last, I tested the ROF of the stock gun (stock connectors and fuse), then tested the ROF with the fuse removed, then tested the ROF with the fuse removed and Deans ultra connectors installed. With a 8.4v 1100mah Ni-Mh stick battery: Stock was shooting at 13.2 RPS, fuse removed was 13.6 RPS, and fuse removed and Deans connector installed was 14.2 RPS.

 

What grade are you in? Did you fail your science class? You should know you are only supposed to test one variable at a time. You tested two variables at the same time. BAD. So what increased the ROF? Removal of fuse, or the dean connectors? You can't tell me for sure becuase you took out the fuse AND put dean connectors in at the same time. By the way, it's the dean connectors that increased your ROF. Fuses have very low resistance, so by removing the fuse you are not allowing more current to flow through than normal.

 

 

it might keep me from having to make the jump from 9.6 V to 10 or even 12 V... the fuse must go.

 

You don't have to get rid of a fuse becuase of that. Buy a fuse rated for the same voltage of the battery.

 

 

 

If your gun needs to draw more power from the battery, get a fuse for that amount. For example, my (now sold) P-90 has a 20amp fuse in it becuase the motor needed more than 15amps from the battery. Test it your gun. Find out the average amps that the gun draws from the battery, and get a fuse suitable for that amount.

[arizonabay]

What grade are you in? Did you fail your science class? You should know you are only supposed to test one variable at a time. You tested two variables at the same time. BAD. So what increased the ROF? Removal of fuse, or the dean connectors? You can't tell me for sure becuase you took out the fuse AND put dean connectors in at the same time. By the way, it's the dean connectors that increased your ROF. Fuses have very low resistance, so by removing the fuse you are not allowing more current to flow through than normal.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Before you get all insulting, notice that he does give a rof with only the fuse as a variable first. So, I would assume, that what he means is that he took out the fuse first. Otherwise he wouldn't have two seperate rof ratings. So, he did in fact test the fuse variable seperately. Now, if he'd wanted to find out what exact effect the deans connectors had, then he should have put the fuse back before installing them, tested, then taken the fuse back out to determine the combined effect.

[DrewLawson]

UnCo removed my fuse before they shipped it

[TriChrome]

That's correct arizonabay:

 

Test 1: standard connector, fuse installed

 

Test 2: Fuse removed, standard connector

 

Test 3: Fuse removed, Deans Ultra connector

 

To be more thorough I should have tested the gun with the fuse installed and the Deans Ultra connector installed. But it doesn't really matter since I was only out to prove that removing the fuse while still using the standard connectors rased the ROF. I already knew installing the Deans connector would help a little bit (since it's virtually a resistance free connector).

 

 

 

 

You don't have to get rid of a fuse becuase of that. Buy a fuse rated for the same voltage of the battery.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I think you misunderstood Jimisin73. He's saying if you lower the resistance of the circuit by removing the fuse, and installing deans connectors, that he may be content with the ROF of a 9.6v battery instead of switching to a 10.8v battery; which is almost the truth.....on another gun I tested going from a 8.4v battery to a 9.6v (both of similiar mah) the ROF only increased 1.7 RPS. I'm getting 1 RPS increase just from removing the fuse and installing a deans connector.

[visionviper]

Before you get all insulting, notice that he does give a rof with only the fuse as a variable first.

 

ah yes, sorry about that. For some reason I read the fuse and deans as installed at the same time.

 

I think you misunderstood Jimisin73.

 

yes, I did.

 

 

I dunno what happened to me, lol. I guess reading all todya in english fried my brain.

[Jimisin73]

Easy killer (visionviper) while you might disagree with our positions, there is no need to get all internet muscles about it

 

 

Actually to clarify my point, the fuse effects the resistance in the circuit, which is a factor in how much "counterforce" can be displaced by the same input of energy. IF the circuit is more efficient (since the resistance is lowered) than the same "strength" battery will be able to push a bigger spring. Staticzero actually discusses this in his UTG Mp5 Bible thread. With stock wiring (read as higher resistance wiring) his standard battery could not handle the upgraded spring... once he replaced the wiring with lower resistance stuff... No problem. Wiring is only one source of resistance. These fuses can be another bottleneck

[Shao14]

I'm glad that this thread was revived instead of having another one made (because we have a few more of these kind of fuse discussions), so good job, TriChrome

 

What I think is that when your gun is shooting at least 600 RPM, the extra 24 or 60 RPM is insignificant. In fact, my CA M15A4 CQB's ROF is too high to my liking with my crane battery (now I didn't find 8.4v crane stock batteries, so I'm stuck with the 9.6v), and if anything, I'd try to decrease my ROF a bit to conserve ammo.

[TriChrome]

when your gun is shooting at least 600 RPM, the extra 24 or 60 RPM is insignificant.  In fact, my CA M15A4 CQB's ROF is too high to my liking with my crane battery

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

An extra 1 RPS for an inch of wire and a $3.50 deans connector is completely worth it to me. That 1 extra shot per second might save your Airsoft "life" or hit that guy who was running for cover; just like 5 more FPS might give you the extra foot of range to hit your enemy.

[Sale]

TriChrome: I think you also should have tested the ROF with the fuse soldered in place. It might not be the fuse itself that causes resistance, but the connection points where it clips to the wiring. Also, there are fuses that have less resistance than other types. Experimenting with those might give you a similar gain in ROF without losing the fuse.

 

Another thing that I disagree on is quoted from your post: "removing the fuse can damage your gun". -No it won't. Still I'd like to give a big hand in your direction for actually testing this stuff instead of repeating hearsay and rumors.

 

Like your test proved, switching the connectors and wires to better ones will have a bigger effect than removing the fuse. This is exactly what I've always said, although it seems that I was wrong about the effect on ROF. I think it's still safe to say that it will have only a marginal effect, and the difference will be even smaller if you solder the fuse in place.

 

-Sale

[Shao14]

An extra 1 RPS for an inch of wire and a $3.50 deans connector is completely worth it to me. That 1 extra shot per second might save your Airsoft "life" or hit that guy who was running for cover; just like 5 more FPS might give you the extra foot of range to hit your enemy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dude, why'd you switch from talking about ROF to FPS? Or is that a typo? Fuse has no effect whatsoever on the FPS. So even when you have the higher ROF, all those BBs will still travel at the same speed as before. Higher FPS is always good if you are allowed to get it, but not necessarily true for the higher ROF.

 

As for the faster ROF, for every second your aim is off the target, you are wasting more ammo than you need to. Imagine you are shooting in full auto, and trying to "walk" the BBs onto your target, but just when you about to get on target, you run out of BBs because the high ROF wastes all those BBs.

 

Why don't you just aim better, you ask? Why don't you just shoot short burst or on semi then? And it's completely irrelevant when you shoot on semi, so the higher ROF is not really justified by removing the fuse. And like nmcabecadas said, you wouldn't remove the fuse in your home or your car, would you?