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Anybody else miss the good old days?


Stealthbomber

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I've been thinking about this for a while but never really took the time to form it all into words...

 

Am I the only one who seems to think a lot of the initiative has gone out of airsoft in the last few years?

 

It seems, to me, that airsofters these days seem to have everything handed to them "on a plate".

You want a gun with a metal body or a gun that shoots 450fps or a gun with 3-round burst or a gun that looks just like one you saw on Milphotos and it's all there for you, on the shelf.

 

Seems like, in the old days, you'd read threads about people who spent their evenings chopping bits off guns or grafting mismatched parts together or slowly whittling replica PEQs out of lumps of plasticard and chewing gum and you just don't see that so often any more.

 

It used to be that the tech' forum was filled with discussion about how to graft an MP5 lower onto a G3 or how to fit a V3 gearbox into a FAMAS but these days it's mostly just reduced to repairs and upgrades.

 

I guess, with regard to performance, it's because we used to spend our time investigating how stuff worked and what we could do to improve it. These days almost everything is understood about how the guns work and there are known solutions to most problems.

 

This always becomes apparent to me when I look through the picture threads which just seem to be filled with a vast array of almost standard guns which have had off-the-shelf bits bolted to them.

Kudos is directly related to cash spent rather than skill or inventiveness.

 

I look back fondly on the days when the forums were sprinkled with threads about P90/FAMAS hybrids and advice on how to build a rock-solid G3 or advice on what webbing was easiest to modify into a replica of some real kit rather than discussion of stickle-brick M4s with trendy bits attached.

 

I guess airsofters have always loved their toys and it's just that because there's a so much wider variety of stuff available (for guns and kit) that we don't need to work at it any more. We can just buy whatever we want.

 

I think we've lost something along the way though. :(

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Think you mean to say the work "custom" doesn't have the same meaning anymore. It used to mean where a person fabricated/modified his own parts/from existing parts, not just bolting accessories and whatnot to a gun. And yes, I do miss those days, where creativity and ingenuity flourished...now we have people duct taping scopes and stuff to guns and calling it "custom".

 

I personally think there's a downward trend in overall "appearance" of guns, at least in my state. I know that airsoft is all for fun and not always for show, but when someone takes a gun and just bolts random stuff to it, it comes out REALLY bad, and I just hate that. If you're going to do a custom build, do it right - it has to be balanced.

 

Regarding the FPS/metal, I can't agree more. The term "FPS sells" doesn't get any worse than that - people wanting more FPS out of their guns, when they don't understand the physics of projectile motion and all that jazz. The "metal" craze makes me even more PO'ed - I've had multiple people on forums back out of sales just because the gun wasn't "full metal" or something. Just because it's metal doesn't mean it's good QUALITY metal.

 

And there was only one P90/FAMAS/G36C hybrid...not multiple ones IIRC XD. But regarding custom jobs, I still have Badger's homepage bookmarked, just in case I need ideas for making new stuff :D

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I am afraid I wasn't here back in the day so.. pictures available at all of the P90/FAMAS/G36C hybrid?

 

Because that sounds totally awesome.

 

The growth has pushed things away from Custom jobs I would imagine, in two ways.

 

1) more people means more people buying straight off the shelf stuff and showing it.

 

2) companies see prospect of higher profit and produce what used to have to be made.

 

I would say it sounded pretty clever back in the old days with all the graft involved but progress in terms of growth is normally a pretty good thing.

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Good old Frankensoft :3

 

1165426196815ln4.jpg

 

I believe I just made my pants damp ...

 

I want one.

 

Scrap what I said progress was bad (j/k ish :P), if people used to make that *suitcase* I need to learn how.

 

Seriously that is something that made my jaw just sort of flop open a bit.

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I remember, way back, when midcaps were non-existant and people were recommended AEGs on the size of their hicaps...

 

"Get an AK Spetznaz! It can take the big 600 round hicaps!"

 

Sigh. *nostaglic haze*

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Remember the eager release of TM p90 Hicaps?

 

I remember my shop had maybe a dozen p90's sitting on the racks because the only thing available was the Standards. A week after the p90 Hi-caps landed, the guns were picked clean and placed on backorder. 1 Hicap Limit per customer too -_-.

 

I agree with OP...

On another forum, the Customs Guns/blah/blah/blah section has been reduced to "hey! look at my bolt on M4 arrangement #831"

 

I lost faith when I saw Spiggy post up a thread about his K98 cup launcher, machined from a block of Delrin and have QD cams and etc and have Custom M4 thread #743 have more views and replies... usually the same rubbish covered by M4 thread #742.

 

I remember the days when I would follow Inferno's build posts and projects like some people watch Lost.

Or the Days when KWC Gas M4's were still in stores with the KWC 12g Boosters.

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[glasses]

 

Ah the days.

When I bought my first MP5 I was worried my hicaps only took 200 rounds.

 

I feverishly read reviews over which to get. TM, ICS or CA... Oh no wait that was it.

 

I remember thinking about buying an ACOG once because it was the closest thing to a SUSAT.

 

I bought my second rifle (a CA M15 tactical carbine) because it had room for a large battery.

No LiPo nonsense then.

 

[/glasses]

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Good old Frankensoft :3

 

1165426196815ln4.jpg

 

Wow, that is just incredible. :wub:

 

I only started airsoft about a year a go, so I never experienced the 'good old days'. I just have to say though, it sounds brilliant the way people used to just graft together bits and peices to create something they wanted. You could say it's a shame people no longer do this, but the market has developed to what the majority of people want. So I guess more people want their 'M4 set up 5002309090' than something unique and interesting.

 

I would pay good money for that G36C/FAMAS/P90 :L

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people used to create something they wanted. You could say it's a shame people no longer do this...

Whoever said people stopped? Have a go at the projects section, always plenty of neat stuff there. It's just that the number of people or the frequency of such creations being made have slowed down.

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I remember, way back, when midcaps were non-existant and people were recommended AEGs on the size of their hicaps...

I did that...

I remember the days when I would follow Inferno's build posts and projects like some people watch Lost.

... and that...

I feverishly read reviews over which to get. TM, ICS or CA... Oh no wait that was it.

 

I bought my second rifle (a CA M15 tactical carbine) because it had room for a large battery.

... and that, too.

 

I remember buying my TM AUG because it had the best barrel length to overall length ratio of TM's entire lineup. I actually laid out an Excel spreadsheet and did percentage calculations for every model available in 2003.

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I remember the good old days when people knew that quoting pictures was frowned upon <_<

 

Joking aside I do kinda miss the days when custom meant builds like the creation above or builds like Candyman's.

I also miss the days when 328fps was considered high fps and a stock TM was the bee's knees.

 

 

I bought my second rifle (a CA M15 tactical carbine) because it had room for a large battery.

No LiPo nonsense then.

+1 for that.

I also remember when a mag clamp was considered a gucci part for quick reloads and magpuls were made of tape and string not rubber and plastic.

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Wow, that gun is surprisingly amazing. Beautiful work, whoever did it.

 

The rose-colored glasses in here, though, are just a variation on "99 channels and nothing's on," I think. There's just more of everything. But then again I've only been here a couple years, can't really say.

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I miss when Gremlin Gun Workz was THE custom gun site for home builders to drool over.

 

Remember when The Q Project announced their MP7 and G36? Hell, I remember when the MP5 EOD model was the coolest custom around (still is) and Arnie's Airsoft started the project page for it.

 

THAT is custom build work. Most of the stuff up today is not, not in the least.

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I remember back in the day when gun releases were relatively few and far between and we (at least I) waited with baited breath for FarEast to release a new review.

 

There are so many different guns today and the reviews are so exceptionally shallow that despite having tons more written about different models it is difficult to actually get any decent information.

 

The advent of youtube in which any nob can post a review (lulz! 500fps roxor!) has really hurt the "art" of the review.

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I can understand the nostalgia, I miss the time when players weren't ready to tear open an AEG the minute they bought them. A lot of persons who I interact with are not content with the stock performance of the AEGs they've purchased. Not in terms of accuracy and consistency, but almost always in terms of FPS. I'm used to 420 fps being the auto FPS limit, so 380 fps seems just fine to me, but I continue to get IMs asking for part recommendations and spring combinations. My response is generally "Why do you need that FPS?"

 

I think a lot of the contemporary custom guns are build because they're status symbols, not because there is actual enjoyment in the build. I like tinkering and working on guns, but on a lark decided to build a MAGPUL-festooned GBBR just to see the reaction of others. Romulus had an article about the term "Checkbook Custom," which I think is an apt description of many of the items in the Custom thread. However, a possible counter argument is that many of the real steel rifles are assembled from off the shelf components, and not fabricated from scratch. Some off the shelf components require modification, and part kits like those made by Poseidon's maybe fall into the grey area. I guess it's like comparing Boyd Coddington's creations with the primer grey hondas that I see driving around with Coke-can exhausts; yes they're both custom work, but I would prefer to see the former over the latter.

 

However, there can be a bit of an elitist attitude attached to the feelings of nostalgia. The whole "back in my day, we had to do without so you should to" attitude should be nipped in the bud. While it might be a reaction to the polar opposite "the next new thing" attitude that seems more and more prevalent these days, I think a more pragmatic approach is needed. Take for instance, LiPo batteries. There are plenty of players who see the advantages that they provide, but there are also many who are too dogmatic for my tastes.

 

Speaking of customs, I need to either find a donor AR for my Gong kit, or perhaps build one from scratch from a mag fed shotgun.

 

-Piano

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A good example of the sort of thing I'm talking about was a custon MP7 made years ago by a guy called Matthew Marsh (I think).

He took a GBB USP and went to work with plasticard.

The end result was rather impressive and he got lots of praise for it.

 

I get the feeling that these days he'd get more criticism for the imperfections (grip angle is all wrong, no full-auto, wrong controls) and people would spend more time telling him what optic it should have on it.

 

Just seems as though, for guns AND kit, we used to be happier to achieve something that was "near enough" or "a good effort" rather than worrying about whether our CIRAS has the correct coloured buckles on it or whether the dust cap on our PEQ is supposed to be black or not.

 

Basically, we seem to spend a lot of time criticising people for their failings and ignoring what they DO achieve.

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back in my days, i was lucky if i could pull the slide back fast enough to make a plastic model kit [complete with metal weights] uzi or p220 fire fast enough to appear at least semi-auto.

[mate had better luck with an elastic band trick]

and i pulled the spring to make it 'more powerful'.

lol

 

i was lucky if i could hit the shed 5ft at the bottom of the garden [a small garden it was]

 

saying that, back in the old days [edited - mumbo jumbo about being a kid and playing with guns outside.] we're just kids playing, and werent being problem to anyone.

cowboys and indians,

cops and robbers,

doctors and nurses.. no wait, thats something else...

 

i do recall that when i got into gbb's i really wanted a gbb rifle, but the closest was those escort gas types, but if anything larger than a handgun was gas powered, it was a nbb.

 

now, today, we have them, the goal of what i really wanted in an airsoft rifle.

and now, i dont have one. because i dont play enough to be on ukara, and/or work simply takes up too much time >.<

 

 

 

 

 

[edited jokey but dodgy bit]

 

 

ps.

i tried to convert a flippin' Korean L85 springer into an AEG.

then i wanted to convert it into a L85/UGL that had started appearing in war photos.

because we didnt think anyone would ever produce an AEG version.

bloody waste of time.

 

oh yeah, paid shitloads for a bloody custom AEG M14, actually twice as i was ripped off once.

again, because we thought no one would produce one, and i was drooling at a Hudson [rip] M14 in a shop in HK.

bloody waste of time.

 

oh yeah, is Japan's fabled Smokeys garage gun works still around?

i have their underpowered custom Sten MkV - awesome-ish.

 

 

[edited because i am so old i have forgotten how to hit the damn keys on the damn keyboard. bloody waste of time.]

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A good example of the sort of thing I'm talking about was a custon MP7 made years ago by a guy called Matthew Marsh (I think).

He took a GBB USP and went to work with plasticard.

The end result was rather impressive and he got lots of praise for it.

 

I get the feeling that these days he'd get more criticism for the imperfections (grip angle is all wrong, no full-auto, wrong controls) and people would spend more time telling him what optic it should have on it.

 

Just seems as though, for guns AND kit, we used to be happier to achieve something that was "near enough" or "a good effort" rather than worrying about whether our CIRAS has the correct coloured buckles on it or whether the dust cap on our PEQ is supposed to be black or not.

 

Basically, we seem to spend a lot of time criticising people for their failings and ignoring what they DO achieve.

 

Kinda applies to renegadecow and his HERA Glock rifle kit - it's not 100% accurate, but the fact it's all custom makes it very unique.

 

Epyon on ASR did similar things - homemade 9mm conversion for the AUG, MP7 that took UZI mags, custom UMP-9 magazines, and my favorite, his CYMA G18C-based KRISS Super V.

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You see a lot custom creativity in the WWII scene still.

 

We've a a *very* small pool of available small arms at sensible prices so you see a lot of folk building their own rifles around a cheap springer and often using orignal wood furniture.

 

To date i've seen a PPSH (a good two years before the off the shelf ones), Moisin Nagants, stens, SMLE's Garands, Patchetts, MP44 (three years before the one you can buy off the self now when the only other option was a shoei gas one) and... one of our lads built a 2" mortar!

 

I suppose the crowning glory goes to Webbys 'radio' bazooka that detonate pre set pyros on vehicles and has its own charge in it... if you didnt know they were two seperate pyros you'd swear you saw a real launch!

 

Note: Start watching at 40 seconds in unless you like watching long build ups :)

 

 

 

In all seriousness though I feel that while there are a lot more 'off the peg' solutions I'm bloody sick of seeing more RIS and M4 nonesence pretty much what drove me off modern airsoft in the first place.

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The old days were great werent they? Not even just the guns, the kit.

 

Remember the only gucci kit available were the relics you would pick up from a surplus store, if you were lucky enough to find some or had a surplus shop close by. Airsofters today have it too easy.

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While I do agree that the over-availability of guns has decreased the amount of true customs being built, I still see the drive behind it. In my opinion, people will always try to set themselves apart from the crowd by building something nobody else has. With the recent advancement of GBBRs, I think people are going to start making some pretty sweet gas customs. I'm thinking of building a gas AUG myself.

 

That being said, I'm going airsofting in two days, after a 2 year hiatus. We'll see if my opinion on this whole matter changes. ;)

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