Sniper Pistols

[mimesis]

http://www.fire-support.co.uk/product/marui-maker-parts-for-de-blk--50ae29-chamber-p

 

http://www.tokyo-model.com.hk/ecshop/goods.php?id=5042

[bankz5152]

Thankyou! Dont know why I could find them!

[Dagonet]

Hopefully tomorrow, or some time this week i pick up a JG G-spec inner barrel.

 

So some MK23 modding to do this week and of course a stock barrel chrono test...then the g-spec barrel chrono test. Had to wait a while for this but curious as to the chrono outcome ?

 

Glock platform will get a good workout in the morning as well

[gisburn20]

My TM MK23 was doing 315 fps on propane with the stock barrel, with a JG G spec barrel 420 fps.

 

Your mileage may vary...

 

I mainly used mine whilst marshalling to test players ( from 30m+ )

 

interesting beasty, I did play a few games with it as primary but had issues with leaky mags at the time

 

it got sidelined for a HERA kitted TM G17 for a time then I went back to aegs to combat rising levels of Teflonism.

 

Jim

[Dagonet]

Time to compare notes Gisburn.

 

Didn't play today, but did collect a JG g-spec brass inner barrel 303mm most likely 6.08 bore.

Spent the afternoon messing around getting it fitted, did test fire before and after modding

 

 

So first was a stock TM MK23 with stock magazine, then followed by the 303mm barrel with a purple nineball hop rubber in place.

Gas used was Aim Top Arm green gas, temp around 18 oc.

 

Stock Barrel...........................................................JG G-spec barrel

.20 LAC club bb..320fps........................................438fps

.25 LAC club bb..285fps........................................375fps

.28 Guarder........274fps........................................ 358fps

.30 Zero One......278fps.........................................348fps

 

A short string of shots then divided to obtain an average FPS reading as above.

I did have a random spike of 524fps and i expect to see a change in readings as the barrel/hop rubber bed in.

Later i will retest on Abbey Ultra gas a slightly lower PSI green gas.

 

Some photos will appear with the next test. Also the sound report is louder with the silencer attached (expected) so some possible work to do inside the can. I play on lower limits so a change of gas or cutting down of barrel will be in order. But i would expect a higher reading with a 6.03/6.01 inner barrel, which confirms some of the reports i have seen around the world about claimed FPS ratings and long range ability. Not that much louder than stock but quite the performance gain from £10 for a second hand barrel !

 

[Cuppycake]

I dont know what this is yet... lol I got bored while waiting for material for my WA700 project and this is what I came up with. Going for a target pistol look in the end with plans of a detachable collapsible stock.

[bankz5152]

Lol it looks interesting to say the least.

 

How does it perform?

[renegadecow]

A tacticool Savage Striker in the making?

[Cuppycake]

Yeah pretty much Renegade lol.

 

I havent tested anything out. Hopefully I can get it all together and firing this weekend. Need to get the mag release and the barrel cut and back in.

[Dagonet]

Been to game i don't get to play too often.

 

The vsr Mk23 was too hot for play, along with a few CO2 pistols as well today.

 

A trip down to Lincolns Combat zone, for airsoft a fast paced venue and high volume of fire, my 2 8.4 mini stick batterys only lasted a few hours (get nearly a whole days play at more open roaming sites) so after a few early quips about no pistols today, well before lunch both G17s where in play, much to the amusment of the other team.

 

During lunch break, a OPFOR member came up to me, and in a nice,jokey manner stated "you, your a marked man, our team are hacked off with you already" bit of pistol chat friendly banter etc etc.

Overheard a few other comments about me as well....

Then the afternoon session began.

 

While many will look down at going pistol only, no point, no volume of fire, be a medic you are of no tactical use ? well it turns out i pysched out the other team, by being fast, mobile, pop up double tap, vanish, then repeat. I went frontline hunting and was able to engage and hit at silly ranges.

 

Someone came up to me post game , i had shot him right between the eyes at around 35m, he ran on the first double tap, then tried to sneak back, i triple tapped and got him, a fluke shot, i am not that good i can shoot you between the eyes. Pysched him out though.

 

By the end of the day the game went to a 3 team split, strange that a mostly OPFOR team picked me to join them ( bit like being the cool kid at school sports that everyone wants on there team ) i even fixed up one of there pistols in lunch break, a very dirty 1911 that was full of tacky grease that kept jamming the slide.

 

Anyways, i tried out a pot of zero-in 1200x.30 BBs, excellent, bought 2 more pots before i went home. Only used about 700rds no feed issues. BBs did start to curl right beyond 45-50m but i could compensate for that by triple tap and walking back to target.

 

TM G17 with a red dot and extended barrel was laughed at by some in the morning, by lunchtime i had freaked them out and was a primary target

 

Also got to look at a Tanfoglio Gold custom, nice balance, not sure on the grip, and currently in the UK no spare mags, this was the back up for the sniper on our team. Holstering will need attention as our sniper kept losing his only mag....

 

Enjoy the hot weather while you can in the UK, prime gas pistol only playing time is now !

[Fed]

UPDATED

Best pistols for a sniper pistol

 

Non Blowback:

TM Mk23 NBB

Maruzen P99 NBB

KJW Mk1 NBB

CZ75D compact NBB

ASG CZ75 P07 NBB CO2

Digicon Straight Custom

Digicon Target T/C Contender

Digicon Beretta NBB

 

Blowback:

TM G17

TM Desert Eagle

TM 5/7

TM 1911

Maruzen M93R

STII Stealth Assassin

 

Revolver:

Tanaka S&W .500

Marushin Super Blackhawk

 

Machine pistol:

KSC MP7

TM Mac 10

 

Barrel:

JG G-spec brass 303mm (VSR)

10" 6.02mm tightbore

Lalax 6.03 303mm G-SPEC barrel

6.03 112mm hiCap 1911 barrel

Edgi 6.00 300 barrel

Magpul 6.01

TK twist barrel

 

Hopup and bucking:

TM stock hopup best

Laila's purple hopup

9-ball hopup rubber

 

BBs:

Blaster Devil 0.4

Digicon 0.3

 

Rails/carbine conversion kit:

HERA

 

Other:

CNC rocket valve

 

 

Any more or criticisms suggestions are welcome.

[Dagonet]

The last game was too much for the TM G17 slide and it cracked.

Had repaired it once allready ages ago, a more indepth repair job may work for winter time.

 

Got a Guarder slide, couldn't find the cheap unbranded one so next one up with markings.

Fitment was quite good, did enlarge the barrel hole as i have a fixed extended outer barrel. BBU drop fit, but it sits a touch higher than in the stock TM slide.

 

The rails had a light buff up with a whet-stone, as did the base of the BBU, after several fitments and strip down, buff up rebuild try again, it now cycles smoothly and still on the stock recoil spring/guide.

 

Stock plastic slide weighs 36grams

Guarder alloy slide weighs 71grams

My BBU is modded and lost 10grams, there is scope to lose a few more grams, i will most likely do some work to the alloy slide as it is a stock G17 slide so no porting.

Now the pistol is running smooth i test fired on green gas. Got 2 mags worth of shots, just locked back on the 2nd go, with gas for another 6 shots.

The action is sluggish compared to the stock slide, but still fast enough for double taps......just not as fast.

Noticable amount of cooling to the slide in use, something the stock slides don't really do.

Going to study the porting profiles of Cseries Glocks and IPSC race Glocks slide mods. I reckon i can shed 15 grams off moving mass, this should bring the cycle speed up a little more as i find a double tap hit is called quicker than a single hit, and sometimes a triple tap is required.

 

Gas use is only slightly down on stock, and cycle time is down but can be improved, weight loss will aid gas useage, will see how much cooldown affects operation when used as a primary, hopefully get to a saturday game this week to try it out.

[mimesis]

Wonder what effect a modestly upped recoil spring would have, say in the 120-125% range. Always a trade-off with the gas to push it back vs. the spring to snap the slide back to battery, but it might be worth some experimentation.

[gijohn2]

I recently brought the A-plus barrel and rubber for my tm Hi-capa but the bastards only sent my barrel so I installed it any way not expecting much of a performance boost but to my surprise it was reaching out to 60-70meters! With .25's! I was totally shocked I also installed some of leeprecisions mag shims to help boost the fps, I guess the fps is about 330

[Dagonet]

Did think of getting one. Might try a two stage set up (got a pile of odd springs in the box)

 

I was under the impression uprated springs where more for more felt recoil, trade off is more gas useage, and in some cases of running a heavier slide (steel) or a slide mounted red dot then a stronger spring is required anyway.

I am not after greater recoil

 

The stock guide rod is polished, and after lots of fettling the stock spring will return the slide with the pistol/ barrel pointing upwards, when released from the slide lock and still chamber a BB.

I figured that running a stronger recoil spring could be countered by shedding some more slide weight. Both choices will never fully match stock performance, but i can bring the gap down with losing weight.

 

Was expecting the Guarder slide to come in around 80grams so a saving from the start

[mimesis]

Well, part and parcel of more felt recoil is the slide snapping back into battery a bit quicker. And back into battery quicker equates to faster double taps. Most upgraded springs come in at 150%, which is why I suggested 120/125. I don't have any experience tuning Glocks, but I do have lots tuning hi-capas and 1911s, all with metal slides. I start with a 150 spring, test, snip off one coil, test, etc. etc. It seems as if every pistol, and every slide, is a bit different. Of course, if you've thrown in an upped hammer spring into the 1911s/2011s then that adds another factor into the equation.

[Toast-er]

Hey guys, great thread with tons of really good tips! Eventually persuaded me to bite the bullet and buy a MK23, I also managed to haggle myself a Tm Vsr Gspec barrel but Iv noticed that the cut out for the hop rubber is different in the Vsr barrel compared with the original MK23 one. Now my knowledge of hop units is very basic so I was hoping someone more experienced could tell me if I can just put the original hop rubber over the Vsr barrel or if I need to modify the Vsr barrel to mimic the MK23?

 

Thanks for your help!

[Dagonet]

Hello Toaster.

 

TM stock brass G-spec barrel ? or aftermarket brand to fit TM g-spec barrel ?

 

TM and JG barrels are cut like a pistol barrel for the hop nub placing, some of the aftermarket barrels look like an AEG barrel cut.

 

I have used AEG barrels with un modded hop windows on pistols before, with VSR hop rubbers.

 

Unsure as to the technical reason for a different cut between AEG and pistol barrels on the nub window, but i have not encountered any issue. As long as the hop rubber sits correctly and the locating slots are all correct then you should have no issue.

 

 

Just bear in mind where you play and the power gains.... as it's not a real world rifle/Dmr platform i am tied to 350fps, some sites may allow play under sniper/dmr guidelines and MEDs. Mines for winter use and i expect to be trimming the barrel down a bit before it see's any game time

[Toast-er]

Sorry should have stated it's a stock TM brass barrel. Will just run it as it is for now, may attempt to modify the hop window later on but wasn't sure if it would cause any damage to the hop unit or anything like that if I left it.

 

Yeah I know, will field it as a sniper platform as I expect the FPS to be quite high and wouldn't want to harm anyone!

 

Quite excited to see how this little monster will perform.

 

Thanks for your help.

[Dagonet]

Just take your time rebuilding the hop unit as spares are impossible to get.

 

I have seen odd reports with some claims very low on FPS and some quite high, but after getting high results with a stock clone barrel i can belive the much higher claims some get with 6.03/6.01 barrels and hi-flowed valves on a hot day circa 70m hits with a pistol.

 

The range is handy as the targets get huffy when you laugh out loud at hitting them, then wave the pistol at them.

As per most of this thread, try some quality BB's out for best results, try .25/28/29/30 or heavier if the hop will lift them.

A few reckon .30 my hop arm needs tweeking as it struggles with .28, the Glock on the other hand handles .30 ok so i want to run them in the MK23, save having lots of different weight BB's.

 

Happy Hunting.

[Toast-er]

I had a thought with regards to spares. Can parts perhaps be salvaged from the clone (ASG/STTI) of the TM version? You can pick one up second-hand pretty esily and cheaply. Apart from the heavier trigger pull they appear to be a straight copy as far as I can tell. Just food for thought, hopefully I'll never need to find out!

 

Im gonna try apply some of the tips from the sniping world to my version. Iv noticed that my barrel sits pretty loose so will attempt to make barrel spacers out of electrical tape to hopefully hold it steady in the silencer. Downside ofcourse is that it may lose some of it's sound quashing ability but im hoping it won't be too drastic. Also going to polish the barrel within an inch of it's life! In addition planning on buying a purple prometheus hop rubber as soon as my local has them back in stock. The beauty of these mods I suppose is that they are easily reversible.

 

Just about to order a bag of the digicon .30's to try, my local also stocks a selection of different brands of .28's and .25's. Never used anything heavier than .25's before but im prepared to do a bit of "testing" to find out which I prefer.

[3vi1-D4n]

I know this isn't the easiest mod hence not really a recommended platform to use. But here is what I did:

 

I modded an old SIIS 10" Desert Eagle to be the sniper pistol. SIIS/KWC Desert Eagles work on a WA postive pressure blowback unit which makes them inherently inaccurate, due to the constriction in the hop rubber to hold the BB for the positive pressure valve to engage. This causes secondary hop which is why the SIIS is notorious for being inaccurate.

 

So I converted it to a negative pressure System 7 flute valve and spring from a broken KSC SIG P226, and modded the hop rubber. FPS shot up to over 400 on propane at 13*C and have been hitting alu-can sized targets at 25m/80ft with 0.25gs. Because it is heavy barrelled and the KWC has a full 10" inner barrel (unlike the marui), makes it most suitable for accuracy applications. Its inner barrel length is only 2"/5cm shorter than a G-spec.

 

Funny thing is that its out ranges an accurised KWA MP7, as its inner barrel is a lot longer too.

[Dagonet]

sounds interesting 3vi1-D4n any photos

 

 

Toast-er your bang on with the ASG STTI clone MK23, from general chatter it is a direct clone of the TM and internal parts interchange as do magazines.

From what i could grasp, you get what you pay for, the TM is more money but comes as a package, the clone will benefit from a hop rubber change and is not so good in overall quality, but for a fraction of the price is still a really good buy, and great donor for rare spares.

 

Nothing like a good barrel clean, the amount of dirt that gets in there.....

 

Zero one had a some small bags of heavy weight bb's, i scrounged some off other players to see if the hop would lift them.

Blaster Devil .28 are really good, Guarder .28 are good but have been hanging up in feed tracks, on zero one .30 fairly cheap about £5 for 1200 getting so good results i bought another 2 pots. Just need to tweek my MK23 hop to lift them now.

[Dagonet]

Got to a game day.

 

Nice weather, warm, gas gun haven.

After my last game finished off the stock TM G17 slide i bought a Guarder one and the game day was more about bedding it in.

A few hang ups, failure to return to battery, but a random happening and most likely to do with my ghetto hose pipe recoil buffer on the guide rod.

Double/triple tapping was fine. The slide will be shedding some weight for colder days.

 

Possible hop issue has come up. This happened on the stock slide and i sort of thought maybe wind drift, had the same issue again yesterday. Around the 45meter mark the BBs curl to the right (happened with both slides) so 50m shots require some aiming off to hit. Much to the amusement of the marshalls i engaged at silly range and the marshalls called hits just to make sure the players took them i was at a slight disadvantage on ground but was just pipping the enemy on range, also much to the amusement of my own team about 60m behind me watching with interest as the nutter with a Glock waded in and really shot up the other team. Playing in a disused quarry basin, so random ridges and big flat open spaces, not ideal pistol ground.

 

Best go on that engagement, due to heavy rain and the flats being partly flooded the enemy had limited ways of access to the flats, i got up high on a wooded ridgeline, flattened the nettles in front of me and waited.

Didn't wait long, one appears (i wait and watch) then another etc etc, they have a steep slippery slope to get down, there are now 4 in clear sight 35m range standing around as the missile is bought up. Dual G17 time, nail all four, then get another who trys to grab and medic one, then another who pops his head over there ridge, both slides lock back, i run away laughing ( again to the amusment of everyone else but the other team) I reload then wander onto the flats to engage in a long range shootout with marshalls checking my target hits i am now holding up the entire red team on my own, slide locks back, run away, reload.

I work my way back onto our ridgeline, and am now above the clearest path the enemy will take. I wait. They come in about 20m away, no shot, then i see a barrel, i wait the enemy moves forward, triple tap, out, also bagged the player behind him, and chase off another, then run away and re gas reload 6 mags.

 

The afternoon carried on like that until i got shot, fluke angle headshot (bit close too) pinged off the top frame of my glasses, instant swelling of the right eye, it felt like a BB was lodged around my eyelid, so i was escorted out. Now have a black eye apart from that ok.

 

The Glock slide is going to be ported (weight loss) i might strip and rebuild the hop unit, but it's a single sided hop arm and having a curve off at 50m isn't bad going for a pistol, possible room to improve. Stock TM hopunit, Nine ball purple rubber and a Nineball 112.5mm 6.03 barrel firing .30 zero-one BBs on Aim green gas, think the temp was low 20's centigrade so hot for us in the UK strip and clean some minor tweeks and Franken Glock will be finished.

 

Did get to handle a Tanaka Kar98 which was nice. Take some hints from sniping, watch and wait, play to the strengths of a pistol, know when to run away, then double back and hit them again. Nice thing is more players are starting to use pistols more often, and finding out that they are good for a bit more than 20m

[Senor Bear]

What areas from the slide are you planning to take material from? I have a PGC slide which is fairly light but still not as good as the original plastic slide (which I use most of the time).