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sacairsoftsn00py

WE M14 Gas Blowback Rifle

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I believe you partially strip the magazine, and change the follower spring for a longer/shorter one, depending on whether you want 20 or 30 round capacity. I think it was the Evike video review on YouTube that mentioned this.

 

This being true, it's completely reversible, and you could probably change a mag between capacities in about 2 or 3 minutes.

 

Who uses a GBBR on full-auto?! I have 5 mags for my SCAR, making it 150 rounds, and don't go through them all in a game day usually - semi-auto all the way. P226 with two 30 round mags just incase on my hip as well; that's 210 rounds tops - still under a 300 round milsim limit, for example.

 

These definitely aren't the ideal systems for laying down blankets of plastic covering fire. Pick your shots, etc.

 

It looks like a great platform for a DMR, especially with the VSR-type HOP.

 

Ben.

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Who uses a GBBR on full-auto?!

 

Plenty of people, and if you don't why even have a GBBR, that's part of the fun of owning them, and one of the reasons why the escort/DTG system is still superior. Also why do you read suppressing fire as full-auto, sometimes keeping peoples heads down only requires a few shots, and is all that is needed to complete an objective.

 

that's 210 rounds tops - still under a 300 round milsim limit, for example.

 

You and I are playing two completely different games, I have never ever been to a game that limited the amount of ammo you carry. Only games that limited mag capacity, but those have died out since cheap clones became widely available, and high ROF, BOX mag laden, FPS whores became the scourge of my existence.

 

how long do your games last, I can go through 210 rounds very quickly even when picking shots, mostly because it can take five hits for some people to call their hits. Some days I go through a mag or two, others I can go through a 2,000 round bag, it all depends. Either way disengaging to reload takes me out of the game to help my side, and it forces me to stop playing earlier. My games last anywhere from a half day to a day, and most have pretty heavy engagements designed into them, even under disciplined fire BBs don't travel straight, one direct hit can take several shots before hand to obtain, especially when you are at great range.

 

Having a VSR hop-up can mean very little. CA AUGs have the same hop as TMs yet they aren't known for great range or consistency. TM p90 hop is known for great range, yet even with a new bucking clone P90s cannot replicate. We have a completely different mechanical process going on here than with a TM VSR it could have ###### range due to that. However that doesn't mean it won't shoot like a VSR 10 we just don't know.

 

So far 420 FPS w/gg is above reasonable velocities for a full auto capable replica at most sites I play at, especially close combat/indoor locations, with duster being weak this could cause other issues with a weighty mechanism. and we have yet to see any data on accuracy at a decent range or max effective range. I would say this isn't shaping up to be anything other than a wall hanger with what's been given so far, but again we haven't been given the info to make any statement other than that it shoots.

Edited by frogfish

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Got to try it outdoors over the week end. Its definitely better than the WE M4 and WE SCAR series as far as range and consistency goes. Still, its not a straight/consistent shooter.

 

It does easily achieve torso hits at 100 feet (BUT WITHOUT MISSING). I had been using duster gas at 95 degrees (which supposedly has the same pressure of green gas at about 65-70 degrees) and .25g BBs. The gun was chronoing below 320 FPS with .20g BBs.

 

So far, I'm not all that pleased (but at the same time not all that disappointed on the rifle). I would like to do more shooting with it.

 

Range is there (for the most part) just the lack of consistency is not quite there. That is, the gun shoots fliers (I use Javelin .25g and Toytec .25g BBs) and some dip down while others shoot out to 200 feet with the duster gas that I am using at the temperature I mentions.

 

You can always decrease the FPS of the gun by adding spacers to the back of the flute valve...I'm sure RA-Tech will be making the NPAS for it.

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Do you know if the BBs have a pretty consistent weight/size? It's interesting that it has issues like that, although this is common with WA GBBRs as well as many other classic style rifles if the replica dose not like the ammo or gas you are using, even inconsistencies in weight less than 1/100 of a gram can change things. However I would not expect them to be that extreme.

 

A lack of shot to shot consistency worries me, I really want this replica to be decent, or at least have issues that can be fixed (have yet to see if these can). Those 200ft shots really pique my interest, yet the fact that it's only a sometimes affair makes me wonder what is going on with the mechanism.

 

So it jumps 100 FPS going from duster to green, although the temps seem to be slightly different where you guys where, 420fps at 77f on GG (I have to assume .2s anything heavier would be worse) and 320fps at 95f on duster. I'd hate to see GG or even propane at 95F.

 

I'm sure RA tech will pump out some parts that may help resolve any issues.

Edited by frogfish

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All the WE M14 chrono videos show huge fps variation, so flyers, inconsistent groups are not that surprising....

Edited by Trasher

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All the WE M14 chrono videos show huge fps variation, so flyers, inconsistent groups are not that surprising....

 

I still can't give any "numbers" about range and accuracy past 25m ( that's the biggest distance i can shoot at home ) but if i get perfectly straight and stable shots at 25m, i don't believe that 50m will be THAT MUCH different. The shot can get deviated a few cm's past those 25m but not much more. I tested with Propane and Blaster Devil's .34g .

 

One thing i CAN give for sure, during my chrono session i wasted two complete mags ( 46 rounds ) looking at the FPS numbers and the most significant deviation was of about 10fps, taking all the results i got and doing the math i got a standard deviation of ~5fps ( this was outdoors with 25C temperature, again with coleman propane and Madbull .20 Bio ).

 

At the moment i'm out of gas and i'm waiting for some green gas ( Guarder ) from fire-support to arrive and do further testing, i'll post a video with new chrono readings as soon as the GG arrives.

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if i get perfectly straight and stable shots at 25m, i don't believe that 50m will be THAT MUCH different.

 

Well it can be that much different, the hop may not be efficient causing BBs to plummet to the ground, or it may be overly effective in giving hop causing BBs to rocket skyward, and it may not have a setting in between.

 

I'm hoping your right, we'll have to see how it does when you get more gas.

Edited by frogfish

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Toytec and Javelin .25g BBs work great with AEG's and GBB pistols. They work great with my KJW M4 GBBR.

 

One of my friends who I hadn't seen in a while had his G&P WOC M4 and was very impressed with my KJW M4's precision, range, and accuracy as it is noticeably better than his GBBR.

 

I'm thinking that the hop rubber used on the M14 isn't the best. I'll try those Bioval .27g (clear) bbs. Supposedly, those are the ABSOLUTE BEST bbs as they are the most consistent in weight, diameter, and roundness amongst all BB brands available in the market. I have had nothing but positive results from those BBs. Performance through my APS2 (with the Firefly Kurage Hop Bucking) has been better than Maruzen Super Grandmaster .29g BBs.

 

Will report when I get to shoot the WE M14 again.

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You and I are playing two completely different games, I have never ever been to a game that limited the amount of ammo you carry.

 

Certain sites and events here in the UK limit round counts - it makes it more realistic, and also prevents the game turning into a spray-fest. It's honour-based of course, like everything in Airsoft.

 

how long do your games last, I can go through 210 rounds very quickly even when picking shots, mostly because it can take five hits for some people to call their hits.

 

I'm talking a game day, not just a game. It all depends on how you play, and I was a sniper for a few years. As for people not taking their hits, play at a better site? A double-tap is normally enough for me, but if they're close, one shot usually does the trick. I use 0.30g's, which obviously retain their energy longer, the end result being they hurt more I suppose.

 

Back On Topic: I spoke to Mark at TQM. He says that the new VSR-type HOP may be included with the Open Bolt Kits that WE are bringing out for all the other guns in the GBBR range.

 

If this is true, I need to know if it's any good before I switch to it - extended accuracy tests please!

 

Ben.

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Well it can be that much different, the hop may not be efficient causing BBs to plummet to the ground, or it may be overly effective in giving hop causing BBs to rocket skyward, and it may not have a setting in between.

 

But that's something very different from what i was talking about, i was purely speaking about shot consistency and not range. I can't say anything about the effectiveness of the hop up unit regarding range yet has i've run out of gas, so i don't know if the hop up is giving too much hop up or not.

 

But i could definitely see the projectile flying path and it was very smooth, i could see them drop and fall always at the same place. The BB's had a very predictable flight.

 

Nevertheless i have a Firefly bucking ready to be installed ( bought a few for my P226 and M.E.U ) and i'm also waiting for a marui vsr inner barrel which i'll install and check if it provides better results than the original barrel.

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As for people not taking their hits, play at a better site? A double-tap is normally enough for me, but if they're close, one shot usually does the trick.

 

Having moved around the US the past few years, I find it's more an issue with a certain age group than with a specific site, although not all players from that age group are bad players. I have seen some players call themselves on a graze, while others I've seen an entire Box mag from a saw dumped on them, watching every shot bounce right off of them, probably a full 100-200 hits before they called themselves out.

 

Some sites here in the US have a "Play to the pain" rule, basically you aren't out until you can't stand the pain anymore. Which is ridiculous.

 

 

 

But i could definitely see the projectile flying path and it was very smooth, i could see them drop and fall always at the same place. The BB's had a very predictable flight.

 

 

That's very good to hear and quite promising.

Edited by frogfish

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Got to shoot the WE M14 with propane and TSD .28g BBs.

 

Just eyeballing the bb, shots do go past 200 feet with somewhat consistent flight pattern. The gun will be competitive against AEG's provided that you have enough ammo. With the heavier weight bbs, there were less fliers.

 

The theory behind heavier weight BBs as being better is due to percentage of weight difference.

 

For example:

 

.20g BBs may actually be .195g BBs on some and .200g on others. The difference of .005g is a variation of 2.5% in weigh difference.

 

.40g BBs may actually be .395g bbs on some and .400g on others. The difference of .005g is a variation of 1.25% in weight difference.

 

Then there are variatons in diameter, roundness and finish.

 

Sorry. I didn't chrono this time around.

-------------------------

 

 

Another thing to note....as the magazine cools down, shots will tend to sail up higher. Having spare mags instead of reloading the magazines is highly recommended.

 

 

At this point, I can say that I'm NOT recommending AGAINST the rifle. It looks to be a solid performer. If only it did not weigh so darn heavy...

Edited by sacairsoftsn00py

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looking forward to a SOCOM variant then. smile.gif

 

There is a lot of weight in the stock, I doubt that a SOCOM will weigh all that much less...

 

My M14 arrived today, and I have some initial impressions:

 

Mine had quite a bit of rattle and wobble around the barrel and spring guide (pictured) as well as wobble with the magazine.

 

IMG_2695.jpg

 

...and oh my goodness sacairsoftsn00py how did you get all of that orange paint off of the flash hider (you can PM the method)

 

"...My Eys, They Burn!!!"

 

IMG_2700.jpg

 

Also is this feature normal (bent butt plate)?:

 

IMG_2693.jpg

 

The look and feel of this rifle is awesome, asside from a few quirks here and there. I have only fired 40 rounds thus far, so I cannot add much more, except that I can't wait to get to the nitty-gritty.

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Don't care about the weight, just want a SOCOM.

 

If the weight is in the rifle mech and barrel I'd hate to hear how much the EBR will weigh

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It's not bent like that accidently. Thats how the real one is, it's to facilitate shouldering with body armor on. If you fold it out and shoulder it, it helps with the weight a little bit. I personally consider it useless in every position but prone, but that bend is there intentionally.

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Don't care about the weight, just want a SOCOM.

 

If the weight is in the rifle mech and barrel I'd hate to hear how much the EBR will weigh

 

I too would love to have an EBR, but if this model is any indication of the weight to come, the EBR may require some physical training to carry for a days a event heh, heh.

 

 

The stock is about 1/3 of the total weight, it is a solid lump of plastic.

 

It sure is, it will last a good share of many battles.

 

It's not bent like that accidently. Thats how the real one is, it's to facilitate shouldering with body armor on. If you fold it out and shoulder it, it helps with the weight a little bit. I personally consider it useless in every position but prone, but that bend is there intentionally.

 

This is good to know; I guess I should have read up more on the real deal, then I would have known this small factoid.

 

Question: Does a plume of gas emitted from the breech indicate that a GBBR has a sealing problem? or that the rifle is a 'gas hog'? ...or both? One obervation when firing my rifle, is that the rifle has visual 'farts' (gas plumes) escaping from the breech after the bolt cycles. I thought that maybe it was because I live in the Heart of Dixie (USA, Alabama), where it is quite humid (94% humidity). Even if this was the case, if sealing were efficient then the gas should not form clouds in my face...right?

Edited by DRAGON64

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You will be able to se gas in high humidity, We just had some insain rainfall (50mm-100mm in 24 houres 2"-4") in the last few days with insain high humidity as a result, and any escaping gas from anything was wery visible.

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Hello,

 

Does it have CO2 magazines? How does it handle in cool weather?

 

Thanks

 

Rt

 

No Co2 mags yet and we are in summer now so that's something hard to test :P

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So i skirmished with it today ( with just one mag ! ) and got some interesting results.

 

Don't know why but with Madbull .20g Bio BB's the M14 had TERRIBLE accuracy and i mean REALLY bad! It was very windy today but it couldn't be the wind's fault cause the BB's would go everywhere, it was like trying to play airsoft in a tornado. I didn't had any other brand of .20g BB's on hand so i can't tell if it was because of the weight or the brand of BB's ( which i believe is a bit of both since my other GBBR's/GBB Pistols also have many problems with this brand ).

 

I then switched to G&G .28g BB's and oh boy ... what a difference! After tuning the hop-up i could hit tree trunks ( about the same width of a human torso ) 8 out of 10 times from about 50~60m and the BB's would fly past that easily. Measuring with the GPS we could estimate that with the .28g BB's and with the M14 shooting at 500fps the maximum range was in average 70 to 80m with an effective range of about 60~70m.

 

I never had the time to properly test the accuracy from kneeling and prone positions, supported or otherwise and only played/tested it standing. Since it was windy and cause the gun weight's a ton ( add to that the nice recoil it gives ), full auto accuracy suffered a bit but with short bursts i could still easily see the BB's land in the area i was shooting at and it would definitely hit the player.

 

The hop-up unit even with the stock hop rubber gives enough hop effect to use heavier BB's, even without using the maximum hop setting i could see the .28g sail up into the sky and it had no trouble giving enough spin on the Devil Blaster .34g BB's i previously used/tested. But until i can test other brand's of BB's, i can't recommend using anything that weights less than .28g on this gun.

 

After more than 500 rounds,

 

- i haven't had any leak from the magazine

- the bolt ALWAYS locked back on the last BB

- the gun never jammed or had a double feed

- after field stripping the gun i didn't noticed any visible wear on any of the vital parts

 

There are some nitpicks however .... don't wait until the mag runs out of gas to charge it again, after the third recharge of BB's the FPS had dropped too much due to the gas pressure being too low. I chronoed a difference of >100fps between the first shot and the last ( 540fps and 380 fps respectively ), the first shot always came WAY too hot ( 540 fps :blink: ) but after the first few shots it stabilized at 480~500fps with Guarder Power Up Gas. At the end of the 3rd consecutive recharge the FPS dropped too much and the accuracy began to be very bad. Don't charge the same mag more than 3 consecutive times with BB's before charging it again with more gas. Strangely the temperature of the mag didn't affect THAT much the accuracy of the gun ( maybe because it has a large reservoir ? ) and after i recharged the mag with gas the accuracy was again top notch although you could definitely the cooldown effects on the recoil strength and rate of fire.

 

There was the odd fliyer now and then, specially when the mag was very cold but i believe it was because of the water condensation that formed because of so many consecutive shots with the same mag ( i could see liquid propane or water escaping from the ejection port/bolt cover ) and i never saw one with a fresh mag.

 

Just like other's already said you need to locktite some parts ( like the operating rod plug ). The front sight kept getting out of place even after i tighten it and since this isn't something you really should be using locktite on, i'll try to put some teflon tape on the threads and see if that helps.

I could shoot a total of 75 consecutive BB's with one recharge of gas but the bolt didn't lock back on the last shot since the blowback action simply wasn't enough for the bolt to completely cycle, but past the 60 consecutive BB mark the accuracy would be sheite anyways.

 

So unless somethings breaks prematurely i'm actually very pleased with the performance of the gun. It still can't compete with a nicely tuned VSR on the accuracy department but with the right choice of BB's it offers a very viable DMR platform for us GBBR users.

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Nice report danielsilva, pretty informative for the schirmisher in us all.

 

I chrono'd or better yet, tried to chrono my M14 yesterday. The flash hider was removed for a color change, so I had a replica silencer on instead. But the chrono machine, Xcortech model X3200, had issues with the gas expansion from the silencer, so it was removed. of the 15 shots fired, we managed 3 cohereant readings with the upper and lower extremes being: 427 and 384.

 

The magazine was loaded with 5-rounds each of .28's, .25's and .20's in order so that they would be fired in reverse order. Unfortunately, I spilled the loader when loading, so the bb's got mixed. So the chrono readings are errant, in that we dod not know exactly what reading went with what bb, and which reading might be showqing signs of the cool-down effect.

 

As for the cool down effect, I loaded two more mags with 15 rounds in the first, and 20 in the second. These mags represented the first firings on full auto:

 

1st mag (and yes, I need to know how to operate my rifle a little better...):

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5ORC9RqmX4

 

And then a second mag shortly after...note here that the rifle quit firing at round 12 for some reason. When we cycled the bolt, a bb felt out of the chamber, and then the rifle continued on with issue, firing the remaining 7 rounds:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiHd5oiUD4Q

 

No issues with cool down, and yes, the bolt locks back everytime when emptied.

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