Airsoft Turning to Paintball

[renegadecow]

Airsoft speedball competitions have been growing in popularity over here through the years though I myself stay clear from them for personal reasons. Browsing through the local forums, I came across this picture (dated 2009 to boot):

 

Yes, that's a plastic water bottle stuck to a modified magazine used in said speedball competitions. As much as an elitist as I may sound but WHAT IN HELL IS HAPPENING TO THE SPORT?!? *at least in my country* What's worse is a lot of the locals support it and don't see anything wrong whatsoever with sticking a plastic water bottle on your gun making it look even worse than paintball hoppers. Sticking a box mag on every M4 to turn them into SAW's is one thing, and being unable to afford said box mags is another. But it seems no effort is made to even conceal the damn bottle, not even with paint (so you could count your rounds by the thousand?) which leads me to question why they even bother with tactical pants and chest rigs. Help me out guys, I'm practically having an aneurysm over here.

[hwagan]

That guy in the picture isn't an Airsofter; He's a paintballer who can't afford a paintball gun. It's literally that simple.

 

'Speedball' is simply paintballing with an airsoft gun, i don't consider it related to the sport at all really.

[faramon]

Its airsoft, that's what he is saying, some poor smucks are sticking bottles of bbs onto mags modified to feed directly from them .....

 

 

that looks so horrible it makes me want to cry

[hwagan]

That doesn't look like a paintball field to me, there's no paint splatter on any of the cover or the ground.

 

 

I didn't mean quite so literally... What i'm saying is it's essentially a field made for paintballing and paintball games, with paintball players, paintball tactics and paintball styled airsoft equipment. Basically, what those 'speedballers' are doing is recreating the experience of paintballing for less money, rather than actual airsofting.

[Agent Hunk]

A lot of games are turning more paintball like.

 

It's because so many people get into stupid fights over which is better. Then people say airsoft is cheaper. So poor paint ballers come over to this sport. And MOST of them promote a less then tactical style of play.

 

Games were engagements are fought by spraying the other dude with as many BBs as possible, until one lands. Just ignore flanking and bounding. That would make the game too dynamic and confusing.

[FireKnife]

Please tell me that this is not going to spread, keep me sane.

 

This looks terrible and to be honest i hope that this keeps away from the real side of airsoft. Bad enough to have paintball firing armalites for these speedballers then now this.

 

The only thing i would say is slightly positive from this is the fact that there is public viewing. But other than that i feel sorry for you renegadecow to have to witness this.

 

EDIT:

 

Games were engagements are fought by spraying the other dude with as many BBs as possible, until one lands. Just ignore flanking and bounding. That would make the game too dynamic and confusing.

 

Hence the reason i don't do paintball, unless invited to a birthday party etc. where i often never get hit as i use airsoft tactics, then watch in disbelief as the 'mid-range' paintball gun fires about 1/3 the range of my Marui 1911A1.

 

Think i might start a site that demands tactically play and encourages true team work, not just spray and pray players. For them we will have a little pen with some sheets of corrugated iron and a high wall so they don't get out.

 

'FireKnife'

[faramon]

I don't think this could spread to here mainly because well you know plainly speaking we don't like to look like paintballing *twilights*.

[NeoVeNoM]

The only thing i would say is slightly positive from this is the fact that there is public viewing. But other than that i feel sorry for you renegadecow to have to witness this.

 

Let's hope those spectators are all wearing eye protection... or there won't be much 'viewing' left.

[Azubi]

Not as bad with the upside down bottle but games in UAE are similar sort of game, most the players are filipino though so I just assumed that is the sort of game you guys play over there. Unfortunately I take what I can get.

[Azubi]

Let's hope those spectators are all wearing eye protection... or there won't be much 'viewing' left.

 

Heavy-Duty nets and screens are up. You can see the slight colour difference in the photo. We have the same in UAE.

[L473ncy]

I think I need to go and chop off my own *rickroll* now. I don't need my children growing up in a world with this ######. I just had an aneurysm, I'm dying are you happy.

 

(

)

 

Anyways.... I feel that in Canada at least we are more milsim oriented in our games and as such (as well we still do play smaller milsim, scenario and "deathmatch" games too so don't think all we do is play milsim) the "speedsoft" trend hasn't hit us but at the same time the quality of player has definitely declined from 3 or 4 years ago. Don't get me wrong it's a good thing that more people are joining but at the same time quality of player has declined vs quantity of players increasing and I feel that things are really unbalanced and that if we had 50% less people joining but they were 50% "higher quality" players (I know it's a qualitative description and you can't quantify quality players) then things would be a lot better.

 

There always is the option of private/invite only games with strict ammo limits though (although I run with a little less than 450 BB's in my loadout (split up between 8 mags) so I probably could be seen as being one of those "BB hoses" (mine are split up between real (30 rnd) and lowcap (68 rnd) mags)).

 

Anyways..... got a night class soon so I'm off.

 

EDIT: YT link fixed....

[FireKnife]

Let's hope those spectators are all wearing eye protection... or there won't be much 'viewing' left.

 

Heavy-Duty nets and screens are up. You can see the slight colour difference in the photo. We have the same in UAE.

 

Still a few ricochets in the wrong place and you are left with one eye injury (or many) and that is actually a thankful reason as to why this exact thing won't reach the UK, the Health and Safety Nazis will ponce on this and shred it, mainly as there is a chance of injury (even if a slim one). For once i am happy they exist. (Note this is assuming that spectators are allowed etc, hopefully they will be confined to their own woods, in the Highlands etc).

 

'FireKnife'

[NeoVeNoM]

I agree with FireKnife. If the hole in the net is as big as 6mm. no one is save behind it.

And I think those holes are larger than 6mm.

After all, a hard 6mm bb is different from a paint ball by a mile.

[ED-SKaR]

Paintballers play "speedball" "capture the flag" and other such basic simple stuff. We airsofters play "disarm the bomb" "attack and defend" and other such tactocal situations.

 

usually.

[LordElpus]

Thankfully, that type of site is rare in the UK as we appear to prefer the classic style airsoft skirmish which bounces between Team Deathmatch (with some objectives) to milsim lite (full on objectives but without the ammo/mag limits). And I pray it stays that way.

[hwagan]

Thankfully, that type of site is rare in the UK as we appear to prefer the classic style airsoft skirmish which bounces between Team Deathmatch (with some objectives) to milsim lite (full on objectives but without the ammo/mag limits). And I pray it stays that way.

 

 

This, basically. The way i figure it, Airsoft is like call of duty, only in real life, and more expensive. And you get to shout arnie quotes.

[Shift]

Our group tried doing speed ball but found out that it doesn't work out at 200ft ranges, even at 100 ft.

XD

 

Yes, at some local multipurpose airsoft/paintball fields this type of game occurs, where two teams go against each other with BB hoses. But there are better options here than just repurposed paintball fields.

 

The local CQB/ MOUT airsoft dedicated field has a semi only rule so BB hoses are relatively non existent here. I honostly think it promotes better play, makes GBBs more competitive, and keeps competition closer.

 

 

A little incoherent but I think I got my point across.

[LordElpus]

Our group tried doing speed ball but found out that it doesn't work out at 200ft ranges, even at 100 ft.

XD

 

Yes, at some local multipurpose airsoft/paintball fields this type of game occurs, where two teams go against each other with BB hoses. But there are better options here than just repurposed paintball fields.

 

The local CQB/ MOUT airsoft dedicated field has a semi only rule so BB hoses are relatively non existent here. I honostly think it promotes better play, makes GBBs more competitive, and keeps competition closer.

 

 

A little incoherent but I think I got my point across.

 

Agreed. Since F&O Drakeslow Tunnels (Outpost) changed to semi only inside and whatever outside and in the woods, game play has improved massively. It also means GBBrs can compete and the sound of multiple GBBRs firing in the tunnel complex is totally awesome in every way.

[signal319]

Sorry, is that semi-only in ALL of the tunnels? I thought that was only confined to certain areas.

[3vi1-D4n]

LOL, its not so different to a box mag anyways.

 

TBH airsoft has so many different shades, I don't even know how to argue anymore.

 

What people consider as sign in on-the-day, any unplanned/adhoc scripted scenarios (what we consider CTF, team deathmatch, BF2 etc), I see as paintball, regardless whether the scenario was scripted and you have ammo limits or not. It doesn't matter if people are all in the same uniform, all have gear standardisation or have real caps, its not milsim.

 

Personally I see the former as nothing more than what IPSC, USPSA and magpul styled shooting is to the gun fraternity. Its an individual sport much like tennis or badminton, where the individual skills define the success of the game, and some teamwork is good but not an end-all factor. Unplanned and adhoc scripted scenarios falls into this.

 

Milsim is the complete mindset where a problem scenario is represented in sets of orders, where there is a structure to approaching the problem, and a level of planning (no matter how long or short, detailed or brief), preparation and coordination that defines the game as MILSIM. Majority of the game is in the training while the actual scenario itself is like a test. In the end the milsim experience is partially a learning process but also a very personal and social experience.

 

Whats interesting is that given the right scripting pre-planning and prep-work, CTF and team deathmatch can become an extremely milsim affair.

 

In Milsim, if one doesn't understand intentions, plan or lead properly, the team doesn't work together or coordinate, it IS an end-all factor that can be the difference between 30 happy guys vs 30 very unhappy and ###### off guys. But when things go well, those 30 guys feel a sense of achievement that cannot be replicated in an unprepared-adhoc scenario.

 

But like USPSA shoots, the individual weapon skills are still applicable in the military/milsim setting. There is a limited cross relevance between the two.

 

For me, Milsim is what I see airsoft "should" be. There is nothing better than people all feeling that they have worked together for a common goal. But because there are so many views of what airsoft "should" be my view is nothing more than an afternoon rant

 

Its just the question of whether you consider tennis better than baseball. Both played with similar sized balls, just how would you like to play it.

[adadqgg]

This is exactly why I lost interest in going to anything other than Opertation East Wind.

[Azubi]

I agree with FireKnife. If the hole in the net is as big as 6mm. no one is save behind it.

And I think those holes are larger than 6mm.

 

The mesh is very finely woven, with the gaps probably less than a mm. You can see through it but bbs can't get through it. The fps levels we play at are alot higher than UK levels and I haven't seen bbs go through the netting yet. It isn't that tight and as such it absorbs most of the energy as it shifts a tiny bit. Or at least that's what it is like where I play.

 

Also, there is no way can see how big the holes are in that mesh in that picture. At least I am bringing some experience with this sort of setup to this thread and not just assuming.

[renegadecow]

For the audiences sake, it would be better if there was no mesh so that they would be permanently blinded by incoming bb's; keeps them from having to see the bottle mags and at least retain their sanity.

 

Just read up further, apparently the device is pretty dated, maybe two years now. As popular as it is, apparently most tournaments don't allow them anymore for various reasons, but can still be seen on weekend skirmishes. I haven't seen one myself personally, and I could only imagine what fit of rage I'd get into if one came into our game site.

[Seraphim989]

To be honest, in my opinion all of this can be explained by the fact that it's from the Philippines. That entire region of the world has always been known for crazy *suitcase* in airsoft, and this sort of play style. Also, the lack of protection for onlookers doesn't surprise me either, as,once again, it is the Philippines. He'll there's tournament pictures of people just playing in aviators. It's just how it is there, it's not something that's spreading or any such thing. It's been like that there for years

[frogfish]

No offense renegade, but when I was in the Philippines (only for a few weeks) I only saw two types of airsoft, kiddies playing in back allies with technocolor guns, and speedball in what looked like converted soccer fields. It's really no surprise to me I see this happening in the US with younger players who just try to look cool for the lowest price, get something with the highest ROF and FPS and assume that makes them awesome, they wouldn't sit down with a copy of magpul dynamics art of the tactical carbine (yes I'm a convert after all my bitching) if you gave them one.

 

On my local boards all the topics I see are devoted to three things, how do I get the maximum RPS out of XXX gun, Can XXX gun use a box mag at XXX game (we have rules), and how do I get the most amount of FPS (not power, lol) out of XXX gun. No-one asks how to improve range at their current power setting, or how proper trigger control will result in more hits with less effort, ect, ect, ect. I feel like I'm talking to paintballers who just want to shoot stuff and not think about how to do things without shooting.