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ECHO1 M28 Sniper's Rifle


DRAGON64

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Dragon--

 

All the replica M1s and M3s seem to be made by the same manufacturer somewhere in China. Then they get rebranded. The G&P and King Arms models are again the same, though with higher QC. Ditto for Evike's "Matrix".

 

See all the M3s here: http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?q=M3&cat=192&mode=list&limit=all

And M1s: http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?q=M1+scope&x=33&y=14&cat=192

 

KHMountain often has the cheapest price.

http://www.khmountain.com/airsoft/product_info.php?products_id=373

http://www.khmountain.com/airsoft/product_info.php?products_id=1893

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RockOn! mimesis, thank you for the info and links.

 

Dragon--

 

All the replica M1s and M3s seem to be made by the same manufacturer somewhere in China. Then they get rebranded. The G&P and King Arms models are again the same, though with higher QC. Ditto for Evike's "Matrix".

 

See all the M3s here: http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?q=M3&cat=192&mode=list&limit=all

And M1s: http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/catalogsearch/result/index/?q=M1+scope&x=33&y=14&cat=192

 

KHMountain often has the cheapest price.

http://www.khmountain.com/airsoft/product_info.php?products_id=373

http://www.khmountain.com/airsoft/product_info.php?products_id=1893

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Review Continued - Internal Components

 

Continuing on, I will review the internal components of the M28 from ECHO1. A dayn or so after Christmas (2010) I set up a small shooting table and rest, and tried to sight in the scope on the M28 by targeting a paper target at 40 yards.

 

IMG_2965.jpg

 

IMG_2967.jpg

 

Much to my disappointment, in two full mags I could not get the scope sighted in, nor did I ever hit the box. 40 yards (120ft) should have been a walk in the park, but even with the scope removed, I could not hit the box. The issue was, that te BB's tracked right and left when fired. It was obvious to me, that the hop up arm had too much lateral movement, causing the BB's to spin sideways. Other than that, the hop worked as designed as far as altitude and distance are concerned.

 

Needless to say, I could not wait for the warranty to expire in order to dive into the internals...

 

Action Assembly

 

The outer barrel is made from thick aluminum; the aluminum is 3/16" (.1375"/3.5mm) thick in the barrel length, and is nominally thin in the hop up areas. By nominally, I am referring to the standard thickness airsoft outer barrel.

 

Pictured next is he inner barrel, hop up and barrel spacers.

 

IMG_3042.jpg

 

The barrel spacers are a nice addition, as I always disliked the DIY mod of wrapping electrical tape around rhe inner barrel to make my own. The ECHO1 M28 conveniently comes with three. I will note however, that although the spacers fit tight on the inner barrel, they fit somewaht loose inside of the outer barrel. It would seem that the spacer could benefit from abigger o-rings, or a wrap for two of teflon tape to better close the air-gap between the spacer and the outer barrel.

 

IMG_3043.jpg

 

The hop up is a slightly modified VSR-10 hop up unit. There is really only 1 improvement, and that is the addition of a 3rd screw to keep the two halfs of the hop up unit closed together. I will note here, that I have no experience with a quality Tokyo Marui hop unit, all of my VSR-10 hop experience lies with the WELL and TSD clones. If you are familiar with the VSR-10 hop unit at all, albeit a clone or a TM, you would note the 3rd screw addition in the upper right hand area of the hop up unit as seen in the next picture.

 

IMG_3044.jpg

 

Here is the hop up disassembled, note the cut on the inner barrel where the bucking would located.

 

IMG_3046.jpg

 

closer look...

 

IMG_3045.jpg

 

Here I would like to point out a major difference between the M28 hop and the VSR-10, and that is the hop up arms; pictured are the M28 (white) and a WELL clone VSR-10 hop up arm. The M28 has omitted half of the slot that the adjustment slide rod moves in, and the nubs are 1/16" (.0625"/1.6mm) shorter than that of the WELL arm.

 

IMG_3049.jpg

 

As I stated at the intro to this post, the rifle was shooting left and right, and getting this far into the inner workings of the hop up is exactly where I wanted to be to find the problem.

 

Two other notable change between the M28 and the WELL, has to do with the hop up adjuster assembly. First off, mine was missing the o-ring that goes around the barrel, where the two halves of the adjuster slide screws together. Also, where the little nub sticks out to register the clicks you feel when you are adjusting the hop, it is made of the same white plastic as the other components. The nub on the WELL clone is made of brass or copper, is much more durable.

 

IMG_3050.jpg

 

Removed from the hop up enclosure, the nub and spring ejected themselve...what a pain that could be to re-install.

 

IMG_3051.jpg

 

That is pretty much it for the barrel side of the action. I will disassemble the receiver and delve a little closer into the cylinder and trigger assembly in the next continuation of my review.

 

 

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It could be barrel/hop alignment. When I put the barrel assembly back together I didn't get the hop up/barrel cut to line up exactly perpendicular to the horizon, so BBs were curving to the right. I then redid everything again and got the barrel aligned correctly and its shooting straight.

 

One thing I also did find, is that the barrel doesn't fit into the receiver tightly, which means it relies on the stock to "bed" the barrel, which is a source of inaccuracy. Though I free floated the outer barrel, I don't know how good that would be either.

 

Mine is shooting 539fps with a 0.2g.

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It could be barrel/hop alignment. When I put the barrel assembly back together I didn't get the hop up/barrel cut to line up exactly perpendicular to the horizon, so BBs were curving to the right. I then redid everything again and got the barrel aligned correctly and its shooting straight.

 

One thing I also did find, is that the barrel doesn't fit into the receiver tightly, which means it relies on the stock to "bed" the barrel, which is a source of inaccuracy. Though I free floated the outer barrel, I don't know how good that would be either.

 

Mine is shooting 539fps with a 0.2g.

 

While I was reviewing the barrel side of the action, I developed a small plan and set of mods to help with the rifles tendancy to shoot left and right. Here is how the hop unit looks now, and I will outline what changes were made.

 

IMG_3054.jpg

 

As you can see, this a far cry from the M28 original parts which used allwhite plastic parts. Essentiall I replaced all of the platic M28 components with the WELL VSR-10 clone parts that I salvaged from a WELL MB07 that fell apart sometime back.

 

I also replaced the hop rubber with one that came with the WELL MB07, as the M28 hop rubber was a shiney gummy-bear of a bucking...

 

IMG_3053.jpg

 

To start, I replaced the above mentioned components with what I had on hand, which were old WELL components. I also replaced the M28 barrel with a suitable WELL barrel, that had a standard VSR-10 cut on the end.

 

I added the teflon tape mod to the bucking...

 

IMG_3056.jpg

 

Finally, I cheaply modified what I feel is the most important issue that was causing the rifle to shoot left and right, and that was adding tape to the hop up arm pivot pin.

 

IMG_3057.jpg

 

I noticed ealier, that when the slide was actuated, the hop up arm would skew to oneside due to the slack tolerance between the pin and the pivot hole in the arm. This skew would allow the nubs on the hop up arm to move to the side of the bb, thus causing it fire left or right. I added a little electrical tape to take up some of the slack, and this seems to have ultimately fixed the left right issue with the rifle.

 

IMG_3058.jpg

 

Mind you, I have only fired two full magazines through the rifle since this fix, but every shot has been straight and true. Without a scope or iron sight, I was able to sight down the barrel and hit a 4" diameter tree trunk from 80ft...

 

Now admittedly, I am not an advocate for UPGRADE UPGRADE UPGRADE!! that so many airsofters love to talk about, but I believe that this rifle could benefit from a new quality hop up bucking like the Nine ball, and maybe a nice VSR-10 cut barrel... remains to be seen how I will feel about the receiver side of the action, as to whether or not I would deem it necessary for upgrading... that section is in my next installment of this in-depth review.

 

To finish this fix up, I will video the rifle on the chronograph again...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuPkUpQaVyA

 

 

 

 

 

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I thought the M28 used a 6.03mm inner barrel, so, why install the barrel from a Well? unsure.gif

 

BTW: if you have the chance, can you test if a TM hop chamber fits fine?

 

Thanks :)

 

The WELL barrel is 6.03 and has a slightly different cut at the end of the barrel... a VSR-10 cut.

 

I do not have a Tokyo Marui hop unit to try, this may be left up to anyone else who may own both the Tokyo Marui VSR-10 and the M28.

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Got mine finally today.

 

So its the same as the Echo1 but has the mag well attached to the barrel which i prefer as it means the mags clip straight in easy as.

 

Other than that its the same in every way. Fires 525-548fps .2g bb.

 

So now i will have to wait to get it out to test the range, hop etc.

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Got mine finally today.

 

So its the same as the Echo1 but has the mag well attached to the barrel which i prefer as it means the mags clip straight in easy as.

 

Other than that its the same in every way. Fires 525-548fps .2g bb.

 

So now i will have to wait to get it out to test the range, hop etc.

 

 

I looked again at the link you supplied from RSOV, and the images they posted of the rifle do indeed show that the mag well is attached to the action side of the rifle.

 

Reference Link: http://new.rsov.com/product.php?langId=1&currencyId=1&manufacturerId=10&prodId=13368&cateId=61

 

I have been thoroughly enjoying mine. I just re-crowned the factory barrel and I plan to re-install it in the rifle tommorrow. I hope to see that the rifle will still shoot the straight and narrow as it is doing right now with the borrowed WELL inner barrel.

 

Looking forward to your review of your new ACM...

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It looks like the magwell could be unscrewed and mounted in the stock if i wanted as there are holes in the stock that they would mount into like the picture you provided a few posts ago.

 

So maybe Echo1 decided to move it?

 

Everything else looks the same as all your pictures, barrel spacers are there and the mag is the same. The end of the barrel screws off for the adapter, but no idea what adapter i could buy as you are provided with one with the Echo1, but im thinking it must be something made for another rifle.

 

So i think this is the same rifle and will look at changing the inner barrel and hop rubber as a start, depending on how it shoots when i can get somewhere with a bit of range.

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FWIW. The Classic Army M24 muzzle brake does not fit in the end of the barrel of the Echo 1 M28. It looks as if it should, but the CA threads are about 0.5mm larger in diameter. I took all the paint off them with a wire brush, but it still refuses to fit. More drastic action will be required. The adaptor supplied with the Echo 1 is quite a loose fit in there. I've measured muzzle brake and adaptor with my calipers, and am not getting any round numbers either in inches or mm.

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Gah, you guys are making me want to buy one of these just for the stock.

 

Shame most of my VSR parts wouldn't make the transfer.

 

It would seem that the Hop up, bucking, and stock trigger group would transfer. Not sure on aftermarket triggers... The cylinder, piston and spring guides are not standard, but springs are... Yeah, this platform needs some support for aftermarket components, which is a tough sell, as the market isalready saturated with to many choices and not enough support. Not to mention, it is a nitch hobby, so no one is going to get rich and retire if they design and implement the parts we desire for the platform.

 

I wish I knew more people in the machine shop world, as I would look into having custom parts made for my rifle. At least have a piston and spring guides cut from aluminum or some other light but strong metal.

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Plisken over at AS-R said the LayLax Spring Guide was a drop-in replacement.

 

Also, DangerWerx made mention of possibly machining a piston.

 

I believe that Dangerwerx needed an actual psiton so that he could copy one. I wonder if he could work from a CAD file...if so, I could model a piston up and send him the file.

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This is what ZERO_WOLF posted on ASF a while ago about VSR cross-compatibility.

 

"...here is what is drop-in compatible:

 

Sears

Cylinder Head (Laylax Fits with o-ring at the seat of the head)

Spring

Spring Guide

Bucking

Hop-Up (Exact Replica)

Hop-Up Arms ( Hello nickswimfast :) )

Barrel ( Order longer barrel for M28. Will post size in review )

 

Yes I know what your saying. "What about the Piston"? The VSR's piston is microscopicley wider than the M28 and 1/4" shorter. The Cylinder is also about 1/4" longer on the M28. I called ECHO1 and they said they already have the ECHO1 High Performance Piston, Spring, Spring Guide Upgrade Kit ready to ship to distributors.

 

I looked at my PSS10 VSR Spring and it was the exact same size as the M28 stock spring. I chrono tested both in the M28. The stock spring was giving me 527 FPS with .2's and the 170 Spring whas giving me 535 FPS with .2's.

 

Nickswimfasts Hop-Arms work perfectly in the M28. The Stock Hop-Up arm and lever is a very interesting design. It really does not allow much movement (if any) and takes away the need for a screw or Guide Plate MOD. Pics in review.

 

The M28 barrel is longer, but everything else fits perfectly. The M28 barrel is a 6.03 barrel by my measurements."

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Well until the trigger parts wear or break, its taking the stresses quite well and I don't see a need to upgrade. The spring guide and piston seems strong enough to take the stress, as is the trigger which is not made of pot metal but I cannot determine what its made of. It is shiny and doesn't tarnish like pot metal, but isn't ferromagnetic.

 

Mine is the LS M24 which is 99.5% identical to the M28 except for the mag well which is secured onto the receiver rather than the stock.

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I just recently received a couple items for exterior upgrades, and I took the opportunity to take some "Dressed to Kill" pics... sorry, no paint, as I really dig the clean look. I may work with a small amount of camo for the rifle that I can strap on, otherwise she remains plain.

 

List:

ECHO1 M28 - $153

AMMO Cheek pad - $30

MadBull Blackside Mock Supressor - $35

Guarder M700 Sling - $27

M1 Leupold Replica Scope - $80

 

Her Name is Elizabeth...

 

IMG_3109.jpg

 

IMG_3111.jpg

 

W/ Silencer...

 

IMG_3118.jpg

 

IMG_3115.jpg

 

Personally, I like the rifle without the supressor, but she looks pretty good with it too.

 

 

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