airsoft vs paintball

[jal3]

Tell you what, you give me some suggestions, and i'll make a UK tour with some friends =)

[Jon L]

I would welcome you to my local mate. Ravens Airsoft, its in Suffolk, most likely a bit far for you to get at easily but still you would be more than welcome to come and play.

 

Look at airbana, it is a website that has just about every airsoft site in the uk on it, you would be able to get an idea of where you would need to fly into and which sites you could easily attend.

[Paul 8v]

I've played paintball quite a bit, stag do's birthdays etc. It always costs a fortune, the main problem for me is the balls always cost you a load of money, with airsoft you have the initial cost but then the BB's are cheap as chips.

Another problem is you can't have nice gear as every time you end up looking like you've been "gunged" in an early 90's kids gameshow, and you end up covered in welts and look like you have some disease!

Dont have a problem with others playing it but I'd rather airsoft.

[3vi1-D4n]

Jal3: As much as your argument is poorly constructed, I understand where you are coming from.

 

I understand you look at airsoft similar to team sports like professional soccer, with a demand for self discipline like martial arts. The focus is on team skill building, progression, continuous game/scenario/mission planning and improvement. Creating a better game by empowerment of players and teams, continually improving planning and leadership and minimising conflict.

 

However, most people don't see airsoft like this. They just want to have a game where they need not be themselves for a day, a time for a carefree rush. Their definition of "skill", is subconsciously how to get more kills before getting shot. I remember teaching airsofters who have been playing for 10 years some simple basic infantry minor tactics for a day. Majority of the players said that they have learnt more in that day than 10 years playing airsoft. But for those who didn't attend they scoffed at the training because they believed they were sufficiently skilled. Their skills are built in an non-learning environment, from trial and error, in games were there is insufficient time to evaluate their own actions. their skill also doesn't allow cohesive teams to be built so the only games you can run with these players are non-team dependent shootouts.

 

In reality, WE play games because WE deem that we ourselves have some control over the situation and our actions determine at least some part of an outcome towards an objective. For most people, their consciousness only allows them to perceive their own personal gratification, however in a game such as airsoft, the game enjoyment can only be shared when everyone else can perceive the same objective, the players can take in account other constraints, and work together towards the objective. We describe this often as sense of camaraderie, unity, and sense of achievement as a team.

 

So for players who perceive the game to be greater than just individual gratification, can be frustrating. The inndividualistic players don't want to be told what to do, but if you don't get them to do what you need them to do then the game will suck for everyone, though for those individualistic players they have already received their gratification so they don't care. Majority of the players just want to go with the masses or whatever takes the least effort.

 

If you go into airsoft as an individualistic player you will always get something out of it without giving anything to how the game works. For those who are planners, field leaders and organisers who take on the responsibilities to make the game better give so much into the game, many will arrive at Jal3's perspective. Its not exactly fair isn't it?

[kepp]

kids that do not follow MED's or even common sense. We had a private game at a field with empty houses while rushing a house with only a pistol (following rules) the kids unloads his clone gun shooting way to hard... THEN yells and continues to shoot at me when im on the ground because "hit" wasnt the first word out of my mouth

[3vi1-D4n]

Yeah that sucks. Airsoft and CQB do not mix well.

 

Take this example:

 

Player A and Player B play CQB in a busy CQB field. Both have underpowered guns.

 

Player A shoots Player B, PLayer B doesn't feel it as there are too many things going on. Player B returns fire to Player A. Player A gets ###### off.

 

Player B shoots Player A. Player A was ###### off and is too proud to admit being hit by Player B who he thinks is a cheat. Player B gets ###### off.

 

Next game...

 

Player A brings hi-powered gun, Player C gets hit, and gets ###### off. Player B brings hi-powered gun and shoots Player A, Player A doesn't want to admit being shot by a cheater and returns fire, Player B doesn't admit to hits either.

 

 

-----------------

 

What is the solution?

 

1) Initially set the FPS to very high so people know when they are hit and provide disincentives to hose a fellow player? or

2) Set haphazard MED rules and low FPS limits so it encourages people to get hit more and cheat more?

 

hmm...?

[kepp]

the games went well all day when players would get close to the house the would switch to low powered guns usually pistols..

one of the reasons i dont paintball anymore is because it was all about who could hurt each other more... and that wasn't my idea of fun on a saturday

[3vi1-D4n]

Normally I would agree, that pain isn't fun. Having seen some very unsavoury behaviours in paintball games whereby people are out to cause deliberate harm by sneaking up to people and capping them in the back of the head and neck, and laughing about it. Its gut wrenching. Paintball seems to attract those who think them can take the pain, which is not what the game is about.

 

However, 6mm BBs are not easy to recognise hits with especially upclose. In field games where you have time to register your hits, its not so bad, but up close with body armour/vest webbing and helmets its not easy. In an ideal world, I would insist airsoft to be all real caps and very high velocities as it would give no room for spam, felt shots, least amount of room for arguments in CQB (no MEDs required if you only ever offload 15 rounds/30 rounds a pop), and good range and accuracy for a relatively safe projectile. But as we know, thats not possible.

 

The other side for casual games is; MEDs, FPS limits, hicaps, and the distrust and arguments as we have now.

 

Having played paintball, RAP4 and airsoft, because of RAP4's ability to only load a limited number of rounds, and that their impact energy is lower than paintballs but higher than airsoft, makes them not only ideal for CQB, but also forces people to consider operational constraints (such as ammo and gas) and hence in effect the games in general are better planned, and people are more prepared.

 

So yes, the problem with this sport cannot just be fixed by simple common sense, its actually about identifying and solving the root of the problem. And keeping an open mind we can learn much from the other wargaming fraternities...

[volante]

hmm... there are many 6mm paintballs.

 

but many of them are not verry good with aeg....

 

if some company can make 6mm painball better, then this kind of arguments would become pointless.

[Cannonfodder80]

IMO these arguments are already pointless as people will naturally go to which game they prefer (go ask the same question on a paintball forum and you will get an obvious awnser). As long as all concerned are having fun then that's all that matters

[mcnuggets]

I play both airsoft and paintball. For me my preference goes like this:

 

Stockclass Paintball > Pump Paintball > Airsoft > Paintball

 

Airsoft is great because it is so cheap to play compared to paintball. The increased range and accuracy is also niec. However I'm indifferent to the realism and role-playing aspect of the game. I can take it or leave it. Also many airsoft guns unfortunately feel more like toys than sports equipment.

 

Paintball is great because it allows for a greater level of competition because it can definitively show a hit. The greater impact energy makes the game more exciting. However paintballs are very expensive and a day of play can be pricey. Stockclass and pump paintball helps assuage this by lowering the overall rate of fire and making the game feel like less of an arms race.

[LeeBristolAirsoft]

Paintball is probably best for a game out with a lot of mates as most people have played before and it's well known.

Whereas if it's a mate, or two, or three, it's good to introduce them to airsoft.

Also if you brung a huge group of mates, you'll probably end up being on one team and losing every game which may get a little boring after a while. Whereas with paintball everyone rents (or atleast at my local paintball site)

 

But airsoft FTW

[Bjerhof]

Jal: I don't know where you've been playing airsoft (though I do have an idea) but I've yet to experience anything of what you've said and somehow I can't help but feel that what you're trying to say is that paintball players are "better" than airsoft players.

And I constantly try to improve my skills and gear to get better, but I'm not concerned about getting as many kills as I can, that is not the main reason I play and I really don't see why that would make me a bad player compared to a PB player.

 

So you like the competition, fine, nothing wrong with that and I bet paintball is great for that but that is not the main focus of airsoft and I don't believe that was ever the case.

And regarding airsofter switching to PB, the only airsofters here I've seen do that are speedballers (who in my opinion is just trying to play PB with airsoft guns) and can't really believe that the rest of us are "wrong"...perhaps it was you who played airsoft for the wrong reasons? thought of that?