danielsilva Posted June 4, 2011 Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 Yeeeey it arrived !! First of all let me just say that what i'll post now is just my first impressions, opinions and quick "facts" that i found during my initial "inspection" and by no means is a in depth review. Now that we've put that out in the open .... FUCLKGIUGNG FINALLY !! The first thing you notice when picking it up from the box is how damn light the thing is I was surprised to see how light it is compared to my old M16 AWSS, so i picked one of my AWSS M4's ( vanilla ) and compared the two on a scale. Surprise surprise, the M16VN weighted the same as the much shorter M4 that didn't have any trigger group installed and has a partly steel outer barrel ( compared to the M16VN that came with a potmetal *?* one ). The weight of it surprised me a lot and how flimsy the receiver looked/felt to the touch ... even the old AWSS felt "beefier" and found myself a bit disappointed while i was comparing the old AWSS receiver to the receiver found on the M16. But after i cooled down and the "omfg moment" dissipated i put some thought to it and couldn't find a reason why the new receiver was so much lighter than the crappy AWSS v1 receiver and decided to give one for the team and went to get a x-acto. I scraped the old AWSS receiver and saw a dull grey colour denoting that it was the zinc alloy i was expecting, i then did the same to the new receiver and gladly found a very bright shiny grey, this means of course that the receiver is actually mostly aluminium ! But since that now the BCG, charging handle, outer barrel and and how there's no steel parts on a removable carrying handle allied with such a lightweight aluminium upper receiver, you can't shake off that feeling of "how can this be so lightweight and still be strong enough not to brake as soon as i play with it ?!?". It's still a aluminium cast tough but fortunately the outer finish is almost perfect without any blemishes, cast marks and the surface is VERY smooth. Tt has a very shiny finish though ... it is the totally opposite of my old AFC dull grey AWSS receiver. I can only see two differences in the lower receiver, the new bolt stop and that the auto sear is a couple of mm shorter ( and it looks like it is just an old AWSS sear that was filled down to spec ) and all other dimensions appear to be the same but i'll have to disassemble it first to be sure. The steel parts appear to be: Charging Handle Latch Delta Ring Takedown Pins Flashider Bolt Stop The rest is a mix of potmetal, aluminium and plastic. Now the really bad part of this gun ... the plastic used on the handguards are ######, pure stinking ######. It looks like they made them out of plastic bags that were melted down and formed into the shape of handguards. And of course, since the material is balls and the fact that the gun came disassembled in 2 parts, my handguard set came obliterated from the transport The BCG although being potmetal actually appears to be able to last quite a while ! Unlike the ###### poor attempted of reinforcing the potmetal carrier on the g39/SCAR with a tiny cube of steel, the AR carrier has a long strip of steel that goes from the bottom of the carrier right until to the middle of it, being surrounded with the rest of the carrier and only a small part of it actually interfaces with the bolt stop, not only that but the reinforced part of the carrier is a just a tiny bit larger than the rest of the carrier. But only time will tell how long the original carrier will last, although Ra-Tech already has a steel bcg in the works. And now the interesting part ... how does it shoot ? Beautifully ... i just gassed up the mag, put some .25g BB's on it and went shooting on the usual spot. In the first couple of mags there were a few flyers ( the hop up came DRENCHED in silicone oil ) but after that the thing was shooting laser straight with .25g BB's and easily passing the 70m mark ( where i shoot i have a measured landmark at 80m and the BB's were falling very short of it ). This is how the WE M4 should have been made from day 1 !! The 20 round VN magazine really is a one piece design, there's no shell ! It comes leak free though and handled 30ºC propane just fine, it cools down like crazy and even with on this weather became VERY cold to the touch after fully dumping the mag. Surprisingly though it didn't have any measurable effect on the performance and the gun performed flawlessly without any hiccups :eh: But only time will tell if this is a problem or not, it's so hot outside that even a really cold mag might not do any "damage". I'll be taking a few nice pictures of it during the weekend and if time allows, i will try to transplant the internal bit into my old AFC receiver and see what changed, what is compatible and what isn't. Stay tuned :wave: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
danielsilva Posted June 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 4, 2011 (edited) Yaaay purty pictures! The rifle itself: Some close ups on the receivers: Yes the receiver has a shiny finish although not as bad as it looks on the pictures, the sun and the fact that it's full of oil ampliated the effect a bit. The holes for the takedown pins appear to be made post anodizing and "hand made" rather than from the cast itself. Interestingly enough the inside of the magwell still has the same cast fault that the old v1 AWSS lower receivers had Close ups: Apart from a new bolt stop and a somewhat shortened auto sear, the trigger box appears to be pretty much the same. As you can the the mock gas key is a bit different and you also can see the small steel reinforcement on the carrier where it engages with the bolt stop. It looks sturdier than that found on the G39 and SCAR. The hop up unit. Some completely random pictures: Feel free to ask for any other specific picture PS. Mods feel free to remove my post from the WE M4 thread that is a copy of the first post of this thread. Edited June 4, 2011 by danielsilva Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Reppyboyo Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Any idea what size allen wrench/key is needed for the hop? I unfortunately dont have a calliper/ruler handy to check. Going to look for a ball end allen wrench to make adjusting the hop easier. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
danielsilva Posted June 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Any idea what size allen wrench/key is needed for the hop? I unfortunately dont have a calliper/ruler handy to check. Going to look for a ball end allen wrench to make adjusting the hop easier. Dunno cause the thing didn't came with it's own allen key and the smallest i have around here is 1,5mmm which doesn't fit. So it's either 1mm or .5mm, i'll have to buy them before i can say for sure. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
maxou Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Any idea what size allen wrench/key is needed for the hop? I unfortunately dont have a calliper/ruler handy to check. Going to look for a ball end allen wrench to make adjusting the hop easier. hi, the size it's 0,05" (~1,25mm) (my 416 don't came with the right key ) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Megalomaniac Posted June 5, 2011 Report Share Posted June 5, 2011 Receiver and FCG, look the same as my Version 2(?3?) AWSS M4. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
carabinero Posted June 6, 2011 Report Share Posted June 6, 2011 hi, the size it's 0,05" (~1,25mm) (my 416 don't came with the right key ) Hi Maxou, Where did get from your OB 4168? How is it shooting? I'm very interested about the OB 4168 receiver and finish, thanks for any info. Great pics Mr Silva, I was waiting for those first impressions, Did you swapped the internals already? Thanks... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
maxou Posted June 6, 2011 Report Share Posted June 6, 2011 Hi Maxou, Where did get from your OB 4168? How is it shooting? I'm very interested about the OB 4168 receiver and finish, thanks for any info. Hi, It came from airsoftglobal for me it shoots great (better after having the right key for the hop-up ) for the finish,... can't really compare, it's my first GBBR (I just have a Dboys M4....) at this moment don't regret my purchase only one thing... 1 magazine it's not enough (just buy 4 from WGC this morning for 32 $/each) now I want the M16 A1/VN (but I'll try to wait for the scar H ) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
danielsilva Posted June 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2011 A little update. As you can see, the new open bolt M4/M16/HK416 doesn't use the same trigger cage nor the old type valve delayer, instead it uses the new type delayer found in the newer OB guns and the trigger cage from the OB SCAR(?). So you CANNOT use the old trigger cage ( and thus not be able to use the upgraded ra-tech delayer if you already have one ) because the "new" trigger cage is a bit thinner near the firing pin ( encircled in red ) than the old cage and the new bolt stop won't allow the cage to fit. However if you're a cheap bastird like me and don't want to loose the old upgraded parts, you can just file down the old trigger cage to spec and use the old parts. I shot a couple of mags with the old trigger cage that i filled down and had no stoppages. You can also see that the new OB system uses a "different" auto sear but it's nothing than an old type sear that had about .5~1mm shaved off, so you can just either pop the new one into the old cage or file down to spec the old auto sear. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
carabinero Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 Thanks Maxou for the info, enjoy your rifle Thanks Mr Silva, I was wondering about the fit and finish of the new OB 4168, and if the receiver came with the new lighter material as in the M16A1/VN, I think the only way to know is ordering one Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bastel Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Does the Boltlock works flawlesly? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Megalomaniac Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 My "closed bolt" Bolt lock works 100% of the time that I don't accidentally switch the mags to unlocked mode, so I'd assume that that the new system does as well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
danielsilva Posted June 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Does the Boltlock works flawlesly? Yeah it never failed to lock back, although both my old v3 AWSS guns never failed to lock back either. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
david pithers Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 So with regards to the front handguards, were they broken out of the box? and do they wobble around? Id of hoped they would have used the same plastic from the g39, which is pretty high quality. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
1st Commando Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 they dont wobble around but are made realistic to the M16 and are therefore cheap plastic . I'd go as far as to say they are real handguards to be honest Quote Link to post Share on other sites
faramon Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Ahhh I am still at a undecided nature on whether to go for the M14 or the M16A1 ... damn my flittery mind. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
danielsilva Posted June 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 So with regards to the front handguards, were they broken out of the box? and do they wobble around? Id of hoped they would have used the same plastic from the g39, which is pretty high quality. About the plastics quality, see 1st Commando's post above. They didn't come "broken" but they came all dinged up, they shipped the gun with the receivers apart and the handguards were being rubbed on by the hammer Ahhh I am still at a undecided nature on whether to go for the M14 or the M16A1 ... damn my flittery mind. Although i have both and love my M14's. GO FOR THE M16 NAO !!! The more i shoot it, the more i'm loving it Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wingmann Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Oh 416, where are thou? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
carabinero Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Oh 416, where are thou? You can order right away the non trademarked version from airsoftglobal: http://www.airsoftglobal.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=552_553&products_id=13894 The AFC trademarked version seems to be out of stock for now, more shops are carrying these as availability increases... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wingmann Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 You can order right away the non trademarked version from airsoftglobal: Divorce, here we go! Wait!, I'm not married!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
carabinero Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Divorce, here we go! Wait!, I'm not married!!! HA HA! I'm married and surely marriage doesn't get along too well with airsoft toys Saludos camarada desde Mexicali, Baja California Mexico... (Greetings from Mexicali Baja comrade...) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wingmann Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 (edited) ¡Saludos cordiales compadre! I'll wait until the end of the month for the non-trademarked 416 (it's going to get painted anyway). What do you guys reckon is a good place for magazines? Airsoftglobal has them at $38, RA-tech at $32. EDIT: Oh Lord, RA-Tech already has it, standard and modified. How needed are the steel parts of their custom build? Does anyone have them? Edited June 9, 2011 by Wingmann Quote Link to post Share on other sites
danielsilva Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 (edited) I tested the M16 today and oddly enough quite a few BB's would get any hopup effect applied to them. At first i though that it was because the system was full of oil ( came this way from the shop ) and so i went and disassembled the gun. The a flaw in the hopup unit, the inner barrel is able to rotate quite a bit on the hopup unit The fix was easy, i just applied a good amount of Teflon tape around the barrel and with a drill bit i removed a bit of material from the end of the hopup unit, just enough to fir a small ring to help centre the inner barrel on the hopup unit. Edited June 10, 2011 by danielsilva Quote Link to post Share on other sites
blablabla Posted June 17, 2011 Report Share Posted June 17, 2011 So Ratech is making a NPAS for this ? or not ? I seem to remember somebody mentioning it on here, or might have read it somewhere else. Can't seem to find it on there site neither... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wingmann Posted June 17, 2011 Report Share Posted June 17, 2011 If you take a look at their custom build you'll see the NPAS in the picture. So, I think it exists (probably the same as in the M14 and others) but the RA-T $400 build doesn't include it. I would try a fixed valve that does what you need, though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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