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VFC MP5 (Umarex Licensed)

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I'll give the metal cylinder a try, but in my opinion it should not effect the variation in FPS...shouldn't the gas control valve stay open longer if the seal between the piston and cylinder is bad? It's more likely that it will help improve efficiency and the amount of shots you get per full charge. Maybe it's the nozzle or some other combination of parts you have. Nevertheless, I'll pick one up to see what it does.

 

My FPS loss in semi-auto is VERY bad on the stock gun. Anywhere between 5 to 15 FPS loss per shot (0.25g, propane, about 65 degrees here now)...yes, the last round rolled out at less than 100 FPS. Almost feels like I can throw a BB faster than that. I think this is mostly due to cool down caused by the terrible magazine design.

 

The full auto will kill your trigger pack and bolt carrier. I've been using the semi auto trigger pack and the wear slows down a bit but it still needs to be constantly maintained (FYI, my trigger pack was dry when I first got it). The performance I get in full auto is VERY poor and the cycle rate drops significantly as it fires. The bolt carrier definitely is weak, but a steel bolt carrier might slow the full-auto rate even more.

 

I can fully relate to this... in full auto the gun is worn down REALLY bad. So I have pretty much drenched the gun in silicone oil and ceramic grease. Hopefully it will stop the wear and tear on the gun at a slower rate. The body of this gun is nothing but perfect though, the stamping and metal feels so solid. I only wish the internals were better.

I am going to get the CNC Steel bolt head, the original doesn't seem to be very strong... I hope it doesn't ruin my bolt carrier.

I haven't looked into the trigger pack, but it seems to me that everything in it is pretty strong unless I am wrong....

The mags have some terrible cooldown effect if your playing in cold weather, I find that the gun works great using green gas, but with Top gas the cool down is worse. With HFC134 the gun seems to be seriously weak.

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Whats so wrong with the mags?

 

Also I found that replacing the internal parts on my WE G36 with CNC ones just caused more problems as it was a tougher metal hitting a softer one. It eventually just destroyed itself internally. I assume the same would happen in the VFC model.

 

How many rounds did you put through before the bolt carrier wore down?

 

As for the trigger pack what exactly in there wares down?

 

I think the double shell design causes a tremendous amount of cool down...I don't have any quantifiable proof of this, it might just be psychological (since a pistol magazine in a metal frame also can also act as a second shell). Unless there is some significant internal damage I'm not seeing, the FPS variation from shot to shot is the highest I've experienced. It's also extremely difficult to take apart. The good thing is once you replace the followers, you really don't need to take it apart again for regular maintenance (unless the main valve fails...you can't unscrew it unless you take the entire outer shell off).

 

I didn't count exactly how many shot I put through to cause the wear on the bolt carrier (something I noticed when I was cleaning it out) - if it gets worn down enough, it might lock the hammer as it would fail to release the trip lever. Regarding the trigger pack, how fast a part wears down to failure is judgement...I'm basing my opinion on my stock WA M16 internals. The various components, especially those that make hard contact against each other (i.e. hammer, valve knocker, etc.) appears to wear down faster than my WA M16. A bit of silicone grease between these parts helps.

 

The rate of wear appeared to slow down and the gun definitely performed better when I switched to the FBI-Picto lower since it has less moving components...the gun is a poor performer in full auto anyways.

 

I want to stress that none of the stock parts actually wore down to failure, not even my nozzle. My safety selector also seems to be getting looser as time goes by and seems to no longer click into place. I agree that steel parts will probably just cause more wear to the weaker parts, especially to the trigger frame and those components that rapidly cycle. As with any airsoft gun, it just needs to be maintained well and it should be ok.

 

The inner barrel does LOOK like a standard AEG barrel, but I don't have any AEG barrels to compare it to. Same with the hop rubber...it LOOKS the same, but I can't be for sure unless I try and swap it. The hop system is also terrible and difficult to adjust and set correctly (at least, it's not as easy as a Marui pistol or WA rifle).

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Thank you very much.

 

On research through various retailers it does seem as thought the hop rubber is of AEG format, I have ordered two AEG rubbers, one PDI W & One Guarder Clear that I will attempt to fit, as well as I already have a barrel I can check and will report back. Also got some H-Nubs which ill see if fit, from diagrams it looks asthough they may fit if not be able to mod it to fit.

 

On top of that I bought a spare bolt carrier, Crusader Cylinder, Azimuth Nozzle, Azimuth Bolt Stops. So with any luck im all set.

 

I also contacted VFC (weather I get a reply or not is somthing else) as to weather they would sell me a spare trigger pack without the grip etc.. Which would be useful. As well as a retailer I know well who will contact them on my behalf regarding the same part.

 

Anyone know what double clamps fit? I think I read at the begining that airsoft & real steel do not fit, which doesnt make sense seeing as the mags are fitted into real 9mm shells? Can somone clear this up?

Edited by bankz5152

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Sadly VFC will not sell the trigger internals independantly... Only a set with the Navy lower for $150.00 shipped

 

 

One other question anyone tried to fit a laser into the top gas tube?

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Any difference in the SD6 making it better build quality then the A2?

I am very curious.... I also want to to know if they made second generation mags!

I need new mags!

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If they have made new mags im guna be ######! Just ordered 4!

 

Hahaha... I was thinking of buying the mags but I think they probably will make new mags to fix the leaking problem.

 

I wish I can spend another chunk of money buying the Mp5SD6... I've already spent $700.00 for my Mp5A2... Just a few months ago..

Edited by Studie

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Wouldn't supprise me WGC or VFC will release the front end as a kit.

 

Its pretty easy to fix leaking mags when you know how and have an abundance of Orings!

Edited by bankz5152

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My MP5 A3 just arrived today. It is fantastic, nice firm recoil, outstanding body work, lovley weight. Stock was a bit stiff but that just needs to be used.

 

Also ZERO mag leaks! All totally gas tight.

 

Only thing I didn't like is that the bolt is also showing signs of ware! Only had about 100 rounds through, that black peice in the TMH is the culprit. What does it actually do?

 

Same as Studie - http://www.arniesairsoft.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/198210-vfc-mp5-umarex-licensed/page__st__40

 

Eitherway Ive got a spare bolt so any catastrophic failures can be fixed in a jiff.

 

Also the TMH was BONE DRY so added some silicone spray to there and some thick silicone greese to the bolt and the black peice. Which should slow the ware.

 

Anyone know of thicker greese that could be used? To slow the ware?

 

The hop is a *bramston pickle* to adjust and is the best but its ok. Havn't looked inside that bit yet but from diagrams it looks asthough it could easily be modified to take H-Nubs, and it does use AEG barrels & Hops as confirmed by WGC Shop though when I look myself I can be sure.

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Only thing I didn't like is that the bolt is also showing signs of ware! Only had about 100 rounds through, that black peice in the TMH is the culprit. What does it actually do?

 

That's the release or trip lever. The lever is needed during full auto fire - in the full auto trigger pack there are actually two sears...trigger and secondary. When set to full auto, as long as the trigger is pulled, as the hammer rotates it will skip the trigger sear and only intercept the secondary sear. When the trip lever is pushed, it releases the hammer to allow it rotate forward and strike the valve knocker. The bolt carrier travels forward over the lever to release the hammer from the secondary sear. This cycle is repeated as long as the trigger is pulled. In my opinion, this is why the springs should never be strengthened as it MIGHT alter the correct timing and might increase wear, cause miss or double feeds, lower efficiency, etc.

 

Once the trigger is released, the hammer will intercept the trigger sear to stop the firing cycle. The FBI lower does not need this lever or a secondary sear (since it's semi only) so the rate of wear to the bolt carrier is much lower.

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Ahhh ok then, cheers. Would using in semi only reduce ware? Is it just the auto function that causes this?

 

With my time in GBBRs and friends I have found that installing CNC parts cause more problems than they solve. Unless every single part is CNC'd.

 

What I think may be useful is listing all the internals of the trigger pack, bolt carrier than can bought as CNC'd parts.

 

Firing Pin Assembly - FE/Precision CNC Steel

Firing Pin - FE CNC Steel

Hammer - FE CNC Steel - Black & Silver - Don't know the difference

Hammer Pressure Shank - FE CNC Steel - Black & Silver - Don't know the difference

Sear - TSC CNC Steel/FE CNC Steel

 

Hop Chamber - FE CNC Steel

Cylinder - Crusader CNC Aluminium/FE Copper CNC

Bolt Head - TSC CNC Steel

Cylinder Valve - FE CNC Copper

Nozzle - Azimuth Polycarbonate

 

Misc -

Bolt Stops - Azimuth Polycarbonate

Cocking Tube - Precision CNC Steel

Recoil Spring - Precision 130%

AEG Hop Rubbers

AEG Inner Barrels

 

Thats all the parts I can find over WGC & Airsoft Global. Have I missed any currently available parts?

 

Secondly could someone list any other parts that currently do not have CNC counterparts? Aswell as any standard parts that are already CNC'd.

 

Though it would be helpful, if there is a CNC'd counterpart for every main internal peice then it would be worth upgrading and a tank of a gun.

 

Josh.

 

EDIT -

 

Also to add ive installed a PDI W Hop with some decent results, easily able to over hop .3gs and its flinging .28gs & .25gs miles with a high amount of accuracy though the consistancy is a little off though I put that down to needing a bed in. Ill post more of a report after my game on Sat. Also decided agains modding to fit an H-Nub for now, as the VFC arm looks pretty close anyway.

Edited by bankz5152

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Ahhh ok then, cheers. Would using in semi only reduce ware? Is it just the auto function that causes this?

 

No - when the trigger pack is set to semi, the cycle operates differently. The hammer ends up intercepting both sears and the release lever is still needed for the hammer to fully rotate. The only way for it to operate without the lever is to remove the secondary sear. However, once the secondary sear is removed, the existing full-auto elbow spring won't work. You'll need to replace the elbow spring with one specifically designed for semi-auto operation.

 

Also, even if you replace every moving component with CNC'd stainless steel, it's still "garbage in, garbage out". I've run into quite a few aftermarket parts that are CNC'd and, for whatever reason, do not quite work as well as the original component.

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Sounds good! My mag did not leak on the first week, after the second week it started to leak.

It is because the cool down effect on the gun and the way the mag is designed. It is flawed for sure.

Instead of using lots of silicone oil on the mechanisms use the Tamiya Molybdenum grease on the trigger parts.

I've noticed that it helps a lot. Cause the silicone oil just drips away.

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Quick question, how's the quality of the stock hop up rubber? I'm planning on getting one for my WA M4 AEG hop up since it has no protruding lip, which should make it more durable in the long run.

 

Thanks.

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Good to know booey, I know what you mean. My experience in the matter comes from a friend who installed every CNC'd part available (trigger pack & bolt carrier) into a WE M4 and now it runs so well. Coming up to around 30K rounds with no problems now.

 

I would prefer to stick with standard parts and replace when they fail. Its just the bolt is so weak!

 

 

Also Ive just run into two unusual problems.

 

Mp5 has had around 300 rounds through now with the Azimuth Loading Nozzle, Propane & Madbull .25g & .28g bbs.

 

IMG_1165.jpg

IMG_1164.jpg

 

First off my loading nozzle bent in at the bottom, I fixed it but still that should not have happend.

 

It seems that the loading nozzle is shattering the rounds! Straight in half, the Madbulls seem to be fine in all my other guns. Though I do not have any other round to test with.

 

EDIT -

 

The rounds are the problem. Madbull rounds are just shattering, terrible terrible rounds.

Edited by bankz5152

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Ok on top of the above. I had an idea on how to 'reinforce' the bolt carrier inspired by a chap who reinforced his WE G39 trigger in a similar way to avoid using CNCd parts.

 

Let me know if this would work or not.

 

The peice that wares down on the bolt carrier could be further sanded down then a peice of aluminium sheet shaped and placed there. Either glued or low level welded.

 

This would avoid the need for a steel bolt carrier which would likely cause more problems than solve. Though would reinforce the weak peice to a point where it should not ware down so quickly, and even if/when it does it can easily and very cheaply be replaced.

 

Heres a crude diagram -

 

bolt05.jpg

 

 

Since Ive got two bolts, when the first becomes un-usable ill give this a go. From what I know this should work.

 

Anyone know what material the black bar peice is made of?

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To be honest, I wouldn't know where to start with that potmetal bolt carrier...

I hope you have some progress, let us know. I only have 1 bolt carrier and I wish to keep it as good as possible.

I only use Japanese rounds in my airsoft guns, I have only experienced jamming once with my original loading nozzle.

The Azimuth loading nozzle should be very strong! I am surprised to see it bend up like that!

Edited by Studie

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The bending I found to be my fault.. Slamming too loaded mags in.... In conjunction with the *suitcasey* mabdull rounds shattering inside and the nozzle hitting that....

 

I had a gander through the Gas Guns froum as directed by another member. Many people on there using WA M4s (much heavier recoil than the MP5) reinforcing them using JB Weld (one chaps still going storng with 6K rounds) and the other is reinforcing via a crude tig weld/solder using aluminium rods then sanding to size.

 

Did the JB Weld mod to my worn carrier and it works a treat. Its soft enough not to damage the trip lever or any other Trigger Internals but hard enough to stay in place and not ware down and even if it does it costs 3p to replace. I also sanded down a few peices on the carrier with some 1000grit wet & dry to reduce resistance and hopefully reduce ware.

 

With the above mods done 500 rounds so far without incident. Working better infact.

 

Heres the link on Gas Guns -

 

http://gasguns.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=8067

 

Josh.

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