dead red rags

[uscmCorps]

I think we're all in agreement that:

• red kill rags isn't a bad thing for the player or the hobby.

• if it became part of common usage it can only help matters.

• if an airsoft culture isn't familiar with it, like all things that represent something different than the norm, people fear change.

• It won't stick unless it was forced on people.

• It's nigh impossible for individual players to change a culture singlehandedly in this regard.

• This is something that event organizers and skirmish sites need to adopt in order for it to become the 'norm'.

 

Beyond that, it's a great idea and can be effective, but won't gain widespread popularity if not already in common use and not encouraged by parties that can make a difference.

[FireKnife]

Pretty much, i think that really it should be, in the UK at least, take one and use it but if it doesn't help then you have tried something new but it isn't for you and the field you play. I carry one and it is effective about 70% of the time, but that for me is good enough, some people want it 100% and others don't want it.

 

'FireKnife'

[paranoiddroid]

I don't think its a bad thing but bearing in mind the amount of times I got shot in hivis with a camera and the times my boy has been laced from 5 foot away by players not looking while in hivis I just dont think most players are noticing the colour difference. it could be a good idea but... i dont think players in general are observant or patient enough to check before firing.

[Azubi]

I think that says more about the crowd you play with really

[WhiteHawksan]

I think that says more about the crowd you play with really

 

The problem with sunday walk on crowds really. Many make simply no effort to pay attention to the rules, they just get a gun in hand and off they go, blat anything that moves and put plastic downrange.

[Inari]

How can you be against a system that is non-invasive, and does not in any way increase the likelihood of being shot while already hit? You get hit, you display you're hit as clear as you possibly can (non aggressive posture, rifle slung and secondary holstered, fingers off of triggers, arm in air etc) in order to reduce the likelihood of being shot again and again. It happens, no doubt, but all you are looking to do is to make sure everyone knows your dead.

 

People will shoot you regardless, be it for fun, or out of ignorance. All you have to do is stay calm, take it on the chin and remember that the honour system works both ways...you should give them the benefit of the doubt. Kill rags make it a little more overt about who is dead, and who is not - some will not understand, but education is key...if they shoot you, explain why you had your hand up while wearing a luminous doo-rag.

 

It is easy to lose your head, and even easier to say "not going to work" but more important is the fact to remember that it will not damage the game at all, and yet it has potential to improve it. Everything in life is weighed up as risk over gain...if there is no risk, and potential gain, then there is absolutely no reason not to try it. It does not need enforcing, just educating, for example (during safety brief):

"Anyone using grenades? Here are the rules. Anyone using KillRags? Here are the rules"

 

It's simple, self explanatory...and more important, effective.

[Cannonfodder80]

I don't think there will be any way of stopping dead players getting shot untill technology allows teleportation. However I don't think dead tags are a bad thing as anything that acts as an extra marker can only help. The only potential issue I can see is sites would have to pay for these, along with replacements for lost ones.

[gisburn20]

Hmm, never given these much thought.

 

Seems like a good idea though, I will pick up some red cloth next time I pass hobbycraft I need some 50mm velcro from there anyway.

 

A couple of metres of cloth is cheap enough, if it makes people think twice about shooting me and the boy on our way to the spawn it'll be worth it.

 

Maybe it will catch on if enough Arnies members try it out.

 

I dont think it should be down to sites to provide dead rags, just anyone who wants to bring one could use it as an additional thing.

 

Jim

[adrianm]

 

I dont think it should be down to sites to provide dead rags, just anyone who wants to bring one could use it as an additional thing.

 

Jim

 

this - ppl should just get their own.

[FireKnife]

Maybe it will catch on if enough Arnies members try it out.

 

*sigh* If only there was enough of us for that to be true

 

But while it would be a good idea it will fail at the sunday walk ons and could succed at the bigger, proper weekend games, will just have to try it there and see how it goes.

 

'FireKnife'

[SteevoLS]

Just a thought to expand on the above quote:

 

Airsoft is always cycling out new players for the old. If the new guys notice older players using dead rags, then they will just assume it's the norm. That cycle will repeat itself, and eventually you have everyone carrying dead rags (assuming that you can get the local venues on board as well).

[FireKnife]

Getting sites on board would be an issue, another thing to explain, another thing that may cost and many of them wouldn't be bothered.

 

'FireKnife'

[Jibbity]

As has been mentioned already, dead people will still get shot occasionally. As an experienced player, I like that it shortens the time to identify non-threats by taking out all of the ambiguity.

[Lightbulb]

I think that its less about dead men not getting shot accidentally its more about clearly identifying dead people, or rather live people. Sometimes its not clear if people are alive or not. I often don't want to shoot someone (and give away my position) only to find they are dead. People are meant to have their hands up but they just plain don't.

 

There have been a number of times on large sites where people have been walking up a path. I have assumed they are alive only for them to say "ffs I'm dead", I have also had, and heard others have, the opposite: people thinking they are really clever walking up to people openly as if they are dead then shooting them (worst one I heard of was someone doing this then dropping a grenade).

 

Its not 'cheating' since if they don't have their hand up you should assume they are alive, but it is gamesmanship which is almost as bad.

 

Most people don't shoot people without their hands up if they are just walking along a path with their gun down, I believe taking advantage of this is wrong - and would be impossible with dead rags.

[FireKnife]

It is annoying when this happens but you will always get the one person that doesn't identify if they are out or in, I for one always make sure to eject my magazine and walk off hands held high, taking the flattest route possible so i don't have to climb, putting my hands down and make me look like i am in the game.

 

If only people did show they are clearly hit, but then again if only people turned up with guns that always shot below site limits, if only people took all their hits. It really is down to the same things, you will get those that are unsure and those that flaunt the rules, best we can do is explain it to them and if they don't take it on board or do cheat then off they go.

 

'FireKnife'

[Mike_West]

Iv noticed from watching alot of airsoft vids on youtube that it seems fairly common for players in the US and some mainland Europe countries to carry about a largeish square or bright red cloth that they put over their head when they are dead.

Yeah, we use it here and it works (some folks even decided to get rid of deadrags and use hi-vis vests instead, but IMHO rags are more sensible and easier to carry). You may ask some Polish airsofters who moved to the UK.

[Counting Count]

While the idea and principle is sound as well as flawed a good use would be during large area games commonly played in the afternoon at some sites.

 

I've inadvertantly fired upon people who reckon cause they are out of the line of fire where they took there hit from, (generally during a 50 pace count 50 regen wide roaming scenario ) they can *rickroll* on with there replicas and act as alive (and had the mouthfull of abuse when I had no indication of status) a rag would be useful and save players like myself from unwanted abuse and or contacts.

 

I dont think however, without multiple sites making it mandatory the use becoming common place (also its just something else for a hire to lose and or half hinch)

 

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[Cannonfodder80]

I've inadvertantly fired upon people who reckon cause they are out of the line of fire where they took there hit from, (generally during a 50 pace count 50 regen wide roaming scenario ) they can *rickroll* on with there replicas and act as alive (and had the mouthfull of abuse when I had no indication of status) a rag would be useful and save players like myself from unwanted abuse and or contacts.

 

IMO it's the hit player's responsibility to ensure it's clear they are out (through either calls of dead man walking, a hand in the air or deadrags, whatever works for you) so they only have themselves to blame for getting lit up if dicking about

[Imperator]

I play for about 6 years and a halfand, here in Portugal, right since the first big game I went to back in the day, the red rag (bright orange is also accepted) was obligatory. Moreover, at night, red lightsticks or a flashlight with a red filter are demanded for the same purpose. The arm in the air is a complementory mesure to the use of the red rag.

If you need to move about, to go to the respawn, or get yourself out of the way, "dead man walking" is yelled while always retaining the red rag.

It's a basic requirement in any 50+ players game, and if by any chance you forget it, usually the organization has a few to spare or someone cuts theirs in half, if it's big enough.

 

It's an essencial part of kit here in Portugal if you attend any nationally organized game, whether it has 50 participantes, or 500.

[Jack Pott]

I used to play at a site that had yellow elasticated socks to put over your barrel when you were dead. I dont know if they still do it but it worked well. Some people took them home with them, but sensible players bought them back the next week.

[AMC1096]

Someone created a tactical dead rag. It is basically a 12" by 12" red rag with a pull sting on the end so you can pull your red rag out faster. And you can tie to around stuff, or use the velcro to stick it onto your vest or sleeves. They sell it for $12.99.

 

This is proof that airsofters will buy almost anything.

[ShadowBolt]

I used it in the local cqb field the other day and it definitely helped me get through the corriders and walk through the open areas back to spawn without getting lit up by my own team most of the time. If you have a red rag at home just bring it with you on game days and use it to get out of those tricky areas its a bright color that everyone associates with being dead and chances are good you won't get shot too often.

[Imperator]

 

This is proof that airsofters will buy almost anything.

 

 

That, in fact, is an universal truth!

 

 

I use a red bandana that I got from a beer brand promoting event (my favorite beer brand ), a few years back, at the local pub. A friend and teammate of mine uses a Santa's hood. Some peopple I see using a very bright, very common, orange dusting cloth... I've even seen a guy using a pair of red boxer shorts!...

[Jibbity]

... I've even seen a guy using a pair of red boxer shorts!...

 

That is quality head gear there!

[Imperator]

Here it is: