WE MP5 GBB & MP5K GBB (APACHE SMG)

[The Chef]

Mag angle..

 

Never even noticed when using it to be honest.

I'm sure there are those out there who will be bothered by it, purely because they know it's there. Which is fine, their choice.

 

But I knew about it and when I've got one in my mitts, (and I've got gorilla hands too) it wasn't an issue.

 

 

The mag stop on empty thing... Yeah, that may become a pain, but I'll see when I skirmish it next weekend.

Wouldn't have been a problem if they made the lever about 3mm shorter so it was recessed inside the confines of the mag, and made the corresponding lever inside the mag-well 3mm longer so it still operated.
And then had some spring mechanism to make the lever automatically reset when new BB's were loaded.

But we'll see how well this works in practice. Time will tell I guess.
My only fear is that the switches get knocked when in the pouch, and I forget to check in the heat of battle. Leading to one dead Chef.

[bankz5152]

I say the next miserable sh*t that mentions mag curve gets a 24hr ban. Its crazy.

 

If you dont like it, dont comment, dont buy it. Theres a million other things in airsoft which are wrong.

 

KWA/TM MP7s not the right size but amazing guns. 100x better than the VFC. Same will go with this.

 

On my phone, my spelling will suck.

[Habakure]

So, the mag has a curve. The mag has a curve.

 

Still won't stop me getting a SE version (hopefully with sliding stock but no stock at all will do).

[hitmanNo2]

I'm sorry you can't see it as a genuine concern that an incorrect angle could potentially have a negative impact on it's operation in terms of grip and reloading.  Though from reports so far, that is obviously not the case.

 

It's like a car manufacturer offsetting a seatbelt location ever so slightly.  Sure, you can use it, but is it optimal?

[Habakure]

It would be a concern if it wasn't tested. This angled mag has been tested to see if it interfers with the operation of the forward grip. It doesn't. You would have a (good) point, if no-one had held the WE Apache (with it's more curved than real steel mag), but the fact is, people have held it and it doesn't interfer.

 

Seatbelt alignment isn't a good example for comparison. More the door handle is off but still works.

[bankz5152]

Yeah but it aint going to stop me buying one. I drive a Land Rover Defender its fraught with crazy issues from its conception, yet an amazing car.

 

Same will go for this I expect. Recent WE GBBRs have been very good and they really have stepped up their game. So what the mag off by 2 degrees I expect someone will release a mod/aftermarket part that will change this in the future. Performance thus far seems impressive.

 

After the abomination that was the VFC this is a breath of fresh air, i'd rather the mag be off by a couple degrees and be able to empty a mag, hit someone past 40ft and the internals not eat themselves after 150rounds. Yeah they should have made the mag correctly but there could be a very good reason as to why which may or may not become apparent. At the end of the day THIS IS HOW IT IS and NOTHING WILL CHANGE IT at least not yet. SO STOP BITCHING.

[hitmanNo2]

Well, theres testing and WE testing...Sure, now that it's been out in the wild for a bit no one has complained about it which is a relief.

 

I don't know.  If they put the seatbelt catch a bit too far forward so it was across your thigh somewhat it would be slightly niggling. Anyway, I would be interested to see a comparison between one of these and a correctly setup VFC.  Good luck to everyone getting one.

[Horsem4n]

well, if we complained about it enough, WE will change it. i mean, isn't that how they made the open bolt system to begin with? because we demanded it? i mean, mods are expensive, but its just the magazine mold.

[hitmanNo2]

No, no, no.  It has to be WE's idea to change something ha ha.

[Honzo]

Has anyone ordered the full size version yet ? Im not turned off by the mag as long as it performs like it should. However, from the previous review the mag seems to be not that great. Seems like all mp5 gas mags are inherent to high maintenance lol.

[Habakure]

Hitman, has a seat belt been bad to you, in the past?

 

Can't find any reviews of the full size yet. It's all about the SD version for me, as the K is lovely but nothing compares to the SD.

[NonEx]

So, the mag has a curve. The mag has a curve.

 

Still won't stop me getting a SE version (hopefully with sliding stock but no stock at all will do).

 

Wait what? SE version? Another model designation ?

 

The guys on the Taiwan communities mentioned the mag angle at a very early stage of the Apache threads. I am no expert but saying "well it's just a magazine mold", from what I know, molds are very expensive to make and produce, so it's not "just". And the external magazine mold has internal components which follow the same angle, so it would basically scrap everything about the magazine externals and internal chambers = mucho dinero $$$

 

And yeah, in almost every first hand post I have seen / read the magazines leak out of the box from the top valves. Hopefully just switching o-rings fix it, otherwise it's really bad :|

 

If you are not dying to get one of these I would probably lay low a bit longer.

 

That said, from my last couple of WE guns they seem to "lubricate" them with vaseline in the factory, cheap and makes sure things don't dry up during transport, but sure as hell not optimal as lube for operation of the guns. So people with cycling issues or whatever, I wonder if they detail stripped, cleaned and re-lubed the gun out of the box before testing.

 

I would think that will help a lot in optimal experience of this gun, as with any.

[The Chef]

I am being overly harsh about the mags to be fair.

 

I just like to be perfectly frank on my reviews and say what I think. If I think something is probably sh'eye't, then I say so rather than going all 'fanboi' about things.

 

2 were leaky, but then how many SOCOM mags have I had to change the seals on?? It's almost par for the course. Nothing either a decent bit of lube, an O Ring and a bit of TLC won't cure.

 

The mags are nice and solid and well made, and the function of the bolt stop is flawless (thus far), it's just I can see a potential issue right from the start. It may be me being the eternal pessimist, but I've long since learnt that if there is going to be a problem, then an airsofter will find it.

You can 'turn off' the bolt stop function with the uppermost lever, but that sort of defeats the object in my mind. Besides, it can still be knocked with sufficient pressure to overcome the lock out feature. And if you drag it up the inside of a tight pouch and catch the lip as your draw it free, I'd hazard a guess that that would be sufficient enough to do it.

The curve issue... yes, I'm sure if enough people cried at WE's gates they may think to change it. But only if it hit sales. It's not a drama...  Really, it isn't. Unless you want it to be.

My mate had a VFC version when they first came out, and this one has lasted longer and performed better than that already.

 

 

The things I would address (in my humble opinion) would be...

1: Functionality of the bolt stop feature on the mags (if it indeed proves to be a problem).

2: Increase Rate of Fire (the Kurz is meant to be mental!)

3: Address any related 'cool down' on the mags. (always going to be an issue with high RoF gas guns).

 

If that's all I've got to moan about, then I think that's not a bad start.

[bankz5152]

Bolt stop does worry me some what, expecially if in a hot situation where you may knock that little tab and be unable to fire! I expect someone like Angry Gun will look at this. ROF someone will be along soon with a lightweight bolt and 'speed buffer' like they did with the G39/SCAR and from what ive seen they work well.

 

Of course there will be the RATech models soon enough aswell and CO2 mags.

[Tinkerton]

The angle of the magazine is slightly off-spec.

 

We are all aware.

 

The whining about it stops now.

[hitmanNo2]

Hitman, has a seat belt been bad to you, in the past?

 

Ha ha.  No.  It's just something I thought of that would be somewhat annoying.  Then again I do find the stock seatbelt setup on 360s a bit annoying heh.

 

Also, I don't think anyone was whining about the angle, merely expressing concerns which we now know are OK.  I think when you drop $300+ on a gun you definitely want to make sure any design flaw, albeit minor will not interfere with your enjoyment of said gun.  But that's just my opinion.

[Habakure]

Yeah SE; silent enemy. It's the uber silent bad guy gun of choice. Damn iPhone will be the death of me. I can understand the complaints about poor lube or lack of lube, as that's poor customer service. Strip and lube is always a good idea with a GBB, as it's an opportunity to get to grips with your, recently acquired, GBB.

[Reppyboyo]

Bolt stop will be a bit of a problem as it appears to be the same as the AK design.

When I had my AK I had to remember to check the lever was down with every reload, otherwise I would get the pre-mature dead mans click.
It was really annoying, especially in heat of the moment environments.
Not sure why they didnt use a spring for that?

[bankz5152]

Hmm wonder if a spring could be rigged up to use

 

On my phone, my spelling will suck.

[The Chef]

To be fair, this one was pretty well lubed inside. But using vaseline is never good on O rings (if that is what they use). The petroleum tends to break them down over time.

 

 

No doubt I shall be taking one of the mags apart at some point and I'll have a nose inside to see whether a small spring can be retrofitted.

[1st Commando]

You sniped that one from under me Chef

[NonEx]

OK, let me rephrase; vaseline like lubricant. Very thick and gunky.

[LordElpus]

You sniped that one from under me Chef

I assume that was Felix's mp5k?

[The Chef]

Hey 1st.

It's what I'm good at! And yes, it was Felix's.

 

 

It wasn't minging in that usual Chinese grease they normally lag them in on the inside. Was just sufficiently lubed. 

Like I said, I am mostly impressed with the construction of this. It really does appear well made and feels very nice.

 

I've got a couple of long mags on the way from the lands of the rising sun.

 

 

 

I was always dubious about GBBR's after my very failed foray with the 1st WE M4 they released years ago. It was tripe and couldn't hit the floor if you dropped it. The WA/AGM versions weren't much better. Then the VFC MP5 was a bit of a dog to start with...
It wasn't until Kenny got his later gen WE stuff that my faith was slightly restored.

 

Gas guns are and always will be a bit of a labour of love. Mag's need attention, they will always be inconsistent compared to an AEG or Spring and power will fluctuate all the time with varying temperature, thus changing hop settings all the time. You'll have to carry a big bottle of gas everywhere with you. Limited mag capacity and generally heavier mags.

 

But they do have benefits over AEG's and springs, realistic operation and stripping, so added immersion. Reduced noise and operational movement (in the cases of my silenced LTR and SOCOM) thus making them better for concealment.

 

So they have their place, but you have to accept the above points and that they are NEVER going to be on the same plane as an AEG. If you can get this in your head and come to terms with that you WILL have to adopt a very different style of 'softing', then they can be very rewarding and you will have a blast.

 

Try taking just a pistol out for a few games and you'll see what I mean.

 

 

 

I am dubious about this little mag catch bolt stop function doohickey. We'll just have to see if it proves to be an issue, and if it can be overcome.
But it fires, manages to get beyond 10m and has some semblance of consistency. Which is worlds better than the original WE M4 I had.

[bankz5152]

I havnt used an AEG properly in a game in 3 years, the one I do have (P90) runs at 37rps and I use locaps/mids. Still manage to be better than everyone else with AEGs. Except for Woodland where everyone is just a spray ans pray merchant. At the end of the day you only need one maybe two rounds to 'kill' someone not 10 500 round highcaps.

 

On my phone, my spelling will suck.