Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

blobface

GHK V2 AK CO2 Magazine (5.45 style)

Recommended Posts

GIM concept is slowly lifting its head to the level of beeing playable. Respect to GHK for putting some effort into the Co2 mags, which are far superior in any country with mild/cold climate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah the cartridge system is an expensive way to do it, if you want no compromise whatsoever, it pretty much means you should change out all the cartridge in between games on any mags that you've gone through, so even if it could fire 70 rounds, you don't want to go into a new game with what you think as a fresh mag but only be able to get 20-30 out. Being able to refill CO2 would be amazing, although the idea of having a green gas sized (or larger most likely) 700 psi fill tank at home to worry about puts me off a little, as anything going wrong would be a fair bit more explosive than green gas going wrong... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Someone on YouTube had the idea to replace the screw (where the fill valve is) with a fill valve that can handle CO2. Then you can fill it with adapted CO2.

 

Fill what with adapted CO2? If I'm reading what you say correctly, that sounds like one of the worst ideas I have ever heard. The 'sleeve' that the screw-cap closes (i.e., the sleeve that contains the CO2 capsule) is designed solely to hold the capsule, not to resist 800psi sub-zero liquid CO2. The capsule is the strong bit and removing it and trying to fill the magazine itself with liquid CO2 is a very bad idea.

 

You could replace the cap-piercing section of the magazine with an adapter that would allow you to attach a CO2 rig, effectively turning this from a GIM gun to a remote-line gun. Alternatively, if you were an expert on gas-cylinder design, you could also design a refillable, reusable capsule that screwed in in place of the existing 12g capsule and scewcap and had a fill-valve on the bottom, so you could refill it like a regular green gas magazine (which, incidentally, you would be to - that is, fill it with propane).

 

Being able to refill CO2 would be amazing, although the idea of having a green gas sized (or larger most likely) 700 psi fill tank at home to worry about puts me off a little, as anything going wrong would be a fair bit more explosive than green gas going wrong... 

 

You don't have much to fear from commercial CO2 tanks, apart from the difficulty of finding places to refill them for you and the cost of having them re-certified every few years. Paintballers and classic airsofters have used them in similar circumstances for long enough, after all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fill what with adapted CO2? If I'm reading what you say correctly, that sounds like one of the worst ideas I have ever heard. The 'sleeve' that the screw-cap closes (i.e., the sleeve that contains the CO2 capsule) is designed solely to hold the capsule, not to resist 800psi sub-zero liquid CO2. The capsule is the strong bit and removing it and trying to fill the magazine itself with liquid CO2 is a very bad idea.

 

You could replace the cap-piercing section of the magazine with an adapter that would allow you to attach a CO2 rig, effectively turning this from a GIM gun to a remote-line gun. Alternatively, if you were an expert on gas-cylinder design, you could also design a refillable, reusable capsule that screwed in in place of the existing 12g capsule and scewcap and had a fill-valve on the bottom, so you could refill it like a regular green gas magazine (which, incidentally, you would be to - that is, fill it with propane).

 

Bloke's called DEVILHUNTER on here, he left a CO2 capsule in the mag and added a fill valve. Seems to work pretty well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I take it back; that's absolute genius. For one horrible moment I thought you meant he'd drilled and tapped the capsule (extremely bad idea) but this is an absolutely genius modification. You get to buy your CO2 in bulk and in a refillable bottle, which is MUCH, MUCH cheaper, you don't have to throw away CO2 capsules, which is an environmental disaster, but you still get to shoot CO2 all the time. They make CO2 bottles even smaller than HPA ones, so you can carry one on the field for refills; it's an excellent system. The only downside is not knowing the eventual failure mode or time of the capsule (which wasn't designed to take the fill-discharge cycle more than once), which will eventually but inevitable die of metal fatigue. But if it's well-supported inside the magazine (and it seems like it is, if they're so hard to get out) it should be a long time before that happens; if you change them out every 100 fills or something like that and check for stress cracks you should be within a reasonable margin of safety.

 

BTW, using the S-Thunder 1-capsule refill thing is a bad idea; you will only get the capsule in the magazine to equal pressure with the one in the refiller, even though all the liquid would be in the magazine (hopefully) you'd still have less gas than if you were changing the capsule in the magazine like normal. Get a smaller CO2 bottle and carry that around if you need refills.

 

If you can make the same alteration to GHK's CO2 M4 magazines, that will be pretty much the best thing ever.

 

[EDIT]Oh, and blobface - you have your Travis Haley GHK AK, right? GET ON THIS.[/EDIT]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm, VERY interesting!

The video was posted in September though, I wonder if he ever got around to truly do it.

 

Also, it may just be me but it seems too simple to do it.

Is all you have to do really just replace that valve with another kind of valve and then you're good to go?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, according to the YouTube comments the MadBull valves wouldn't pass liquid, so he needed to replace them with KJW valves. My guess is he hasn't gotten around to that yet. There are other problems noted in that newer regulators screwed in to gas bottles are also designed to prevent the passage of liquid; again, you need to just replace the parts. I don't see why it shouldn't work and apparently the user on GGi made it work:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You need to charge the mags with liquid CO2 in the same way that you have to charge green gas mags with liquid. Liquid CO2 is what's in the 12g capsules.

 

BTW, using the S-Thunder 1-capsule refill thing is a bad idea; you will only get the capsule in the magazine to equal pressure with the one in the refiller, even though all the liquid would be in the magazine (hopefully) you'd still have less gas than if you were changing the capsule in the magazine like normal. Get a smaller CO2 bottle and carry that around if you need refills.

 

When filling a gas container from another you can only ever make the two pressures the same. Same as filling with propane. If you used one 12g to fill the mag it would just empty all the liquid into the mag then stop.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see you guys are calling me :D

 

I use this method with my GHK mags for about 3 years without any problem when using the KJW valves. But I was trying also to work with this in pistol mags (with a CO2 adapted output valve of course), but I couldn't get liquid in.

 

I was with a KJW valve on my hands when I realize that they have a VERY small hole on the side of the body. This hole let the air go out when you are filling the mag so more liquid can come in. So I bought several 0.3mm drill bits to test if I could modify the valve. Since I have no toolholder small enough to hold this bits, I had to drill holding it with my fingers.

 

0_3mm_drill.png

 

I have tested my mag and I could make a lot of shots more than before, so it worked perfect. This are the bits I bought, pretty cheap:

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321332870685?var=510237294575&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

 

So if you can't get the KJW valves or, like my pistol mag they are not compatible, you can try this even if you are not using CO2 but you have problems filling the gas.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Woa, Devilhunter always impresses me with his witchcraft, please show us a video of your CO2 AK mags' procedures and detail of the mod! 

 

If I understand correctly, you use:

 

- GHK CO2 Mag

- Leave cartridge inside gun

- Replace plug screw with KJW inlet valve (or any other with a 0.3mm hole drilled in that position)

- Then you are able to use CO2 tanks with an adapter to fill liquid CO2 into the mag (or more correctly, back into the empty CO2 cartridge) 

 

Have I understood that correctly? Which adapter did you use for the CO2 tank? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IIRC, CO2 is a gas that underogoes sublimination, hence dry ice. I dont quite understand DEVILHUNTER's concept in terms of construction, but a valve not passing liquid shouldnt been an issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CO2 sublimes from a solid to a gas. That doesn't mean it doesn't have a liquid phase. The valve still needs to be capable of passing liquid from the CO2 cylinder into the magazine (more properly, into the capsule) in order to refill it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IIRC, CO2 is a gas that underogoes sublimination, hence dry ice.

 

According to Wikipedia, CO2 is a liquid at 822 psi in 20º c. Which is probably the environment inside a standard capsule.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CO2 sublimes from a solid to a gas. That doesn't mean it doesn't have a liquid phase. The valve still needs to be capable of passing liquid from the CO2 cylinder into the magazine (more properly, into the capsule) in order to refill it.

 

Out of interest, you say CO2 doesn't have a liquid phase (it does), but that liquid needs to pass from the CO2 cylinder - what do you think that liquid is??

 

Liquid CO2 forms at pressures greater than 5.1 bar (~54 psi), which is barely anything for CO2, which normally has vapour pressure of around 800 psi. CO2 storage tanks like the 12g cartridges, paintball bottles, big bulk cylinders all contain liquid CO2.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You are correct, blobface, is that simple. I don't know if the new version mags will have this hole and this system works, maybe just tapping a new hole.

 

But you don't fill the cartridge this way, you fill the whole mag, so you get more grams of CO2 and get more shots per charge than with a 12g cartridge.

 

I was making the video but my spoken english is too bad, and all you need to do is change the fill valve with a KJW one, left the empty cartridge in and fill with the CO2 adapter without the pressure regulator, very simple.

 

To buy the KJW valves you can contact them directly, they are pretty chep (1.5 USD aprox).

 

I have the S-thunder adapter, but if you have the madbull one it must work also, just take out the pressure regulator.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Cylinder-Adaptor-nozzle-S-Thunder-ACC-X006/dp/B003QUFYRK/ref=sr_1_16?s=paintball&ie=UTF8&qid=1399889567&sr=1-16

 

Blobface, Stuey and PureSilver are right, CO2 do have a liquid phase, but you must be at a high pressure to get it. It's all about the triple point:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triple_point

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use and the use of session cookies.