BFG Questions

[renegadecow]

Yeah, I'm having consistency problems when the striker/piston comes flying out and gets dirty plus I have a gaping hole on the side of the cylinder for dirt to get into. Easy enough to open up and clean though but I imagine a good dunk in mud would render it inert not to mention getting the primer wet and useless. Been looking at wind up timers on Ebay since last night maybe for a version 2.

[Pepperisit12]

I considered a wind up option before, would be quite easy to just twist the top and lock with pin/spoon. However I do not think that the clockwork would last with repeated throws.

[hotelkilo]

the original dynatex instructions specifically warned against using the grenade around water or mud, probably to keep debris out of the mech. thats hard to do when you think about deploying the grenades in a woodland setting, they are going to get a bit muddy/wet with use.

 

the design of the dynatex bfg makes it pretty hard to get dirt (or even water) into the internal mech unless you are particularly harsh on your kit (or deliberately taking the ), and even when the grenades do get a little dirty/slower they are fairly simple to service.

 

a guy that used to come airsofting years ago was quite happy to chuck his bfgs with (12g inside) into water about 1m deep with pretty spectacular results iirc. i guess the ingress of water whilst submerged is very slow and there is still enough air in the main body for the mech to work, when i asked him if water was getting into the grenades he just shrugged and said something like 'not so far'. havent seen him for years so i have no idea if his grenades ever suffered any long term damage bc of his actions.

[renegadecow]

Mmm, what if I stuff it in a sandwich bag? Also, couldn't wait until the weekend and tried a live fire test in my bathroom. Good thing I was wearing ear pro.

[Isamu]

LoL! pics or didnt happen!

 

An iluminated clerck tried to make a demonstration of a VTG in the shop and HOLY FRUITCAGE! I got deaf for the home way back walk. Didnt buy it, I was soooo (beep) off

[renegadecow]

There's a bit of a scorch mark on my tiles if that counts. Otherwise I only have one small primer left and three large ones which I don't have a case to make a cover of.

[hitmanNo2]

I wouldn't have thought primers would be that powerful.

[renegadecow]

Quite a bit actually. For example they're used in cowboy action shooting loading "rice" rounds which is a primer and the case filled with uncooked rice and sealed with a bit of wax. They're used to pop balloons for competition but easily break skin and can still take an eye out. But that's through a barrel so energy is focused. In the open they're just loud.

[Pepperisit12]

Shotgun primers in my ohshi leave scorch marks on my old patio tiles.

 

Also where are you going to be using this RC? I doubt that the insurance companies that back the big airsoft sites will be happy with homebrew blank firing devices. (I'm not questioning your build quility - but they will!)

[renegadecow]

LOL! We don't dabble with insurance in the third world where the average day game fee is $3. Realistically though they put out about as much dB as Thunder B's which are arguably more dangerous than primers due to the case actually rupturing as part of its mechanism. But all the same, that's why I'll be throwing this thing around for the next few weeks and explore weak points before I start making any significant number of copies.

[Pepperisit12]

aww man I wana play games where I could make my own gear... however "Third world" isnt selling it much haha

[renegadecow]

I only say that to sound cool/tough. All it really means is having slow internet, horrible public transportation, rampant government corruption and the odd chance of getting some disease from a mosquito.

[Pepperisit12]

to be honest... UK has slow internet (mines less that 1gig in a brand new housing estate in a normal size town), public transports quite nice (But way overpriced). Not sure I'd trade the other stuff for $3 game days though...

 

I'll stop hijacking your thread now. Once you have a decent reliable system get someone to produce it in the uk and we can work insurances out our end!

[renegadecow]

Shotgun primer test vid:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwuBcvsb4Gk

[gisburn20]

Shotgun primers! Very nice, I'll take 5!

[paranoiddroid]

I read somewhere that bfgs were heavily restricted by the atf in the USA for some bizarre reason not entirely sure why but things like DD and AOW were thrown around.

 

No real evidence other than some people speaking to the bathe and some interpretations of the law making them zip guns. Idk if ts right it sounds off as blank firers are legal in the us.

 

http://americanmilsim.com/forum/index.php?/topic/901-blank-firing-grenades/

[Skarclaw]

I read somewhere that bags were heavily restricted by the at in the USA for some bizarre reason not entirely sure why but things like DO and AOL were thrown around.

 

I'm afraid I don't understand any of this, by bags you mean bfg right? at? DO? AOL? 

[renegadecow]

BFGs, ATF, DD, AOW.

Just started to look into it now and it does seem that the ATF view them as firearms as they could be made to load live ammunition. Primer grenades seem to be OK, but it seems people in the US just don't risk it in case the ATF decide those can be made to fire live ammunition as well. Kinda silly given you can legally make a zip gun in your backyard.

[paranoiddroid]

Poxy bloody autocorrect. Yeah sorry basically the atfe consider some of the designs as firearms and because they are neither pistol (intended to be fired with one hand no stock) rifle (designed to be fired with two hands have stock and 16 inch barrel) shotgun (2 hands 18 inch barrel stock fires shot cartridges) and they aren't a Firearm ( a catch all for pgo shotguns ar15 pistols with oal of over 26" with a vertical grip, pgo shotguns over 26" with sub 18 barrel) so they cant be title one weapons

 

 

So they must be title 2 and therefore subject to the gca and nfa.

 

They aren't machine guns (no limits on barrelled length or calibre or stock or whatever just have to be capable of full auto or select fire)

 

they aren't a SBR (rifle less than 16 inch barrel) or SBS (shotgun sub 18inch)

 

So They are either Destructive devices (but they fail that as they dont contain over x amount of explosive material though it may be 1/4 oz) (although any weapon over half inch bore size that doesn't have a 'sporting purpose' is considered by the batfe as a DD) so the street sweeper and striker shotguns are DD's the saiga 12 isn't because it is imported in a sporting configuration.

 

A 20mm rifle is a DD. Mortars recoilless rifles rocket launchers and rpgs are Dd's even if firing inert practice rounds, chalk rounds or buckshot/fletchete.

 

An explosive round with over 1/4 oz of boom material would need a separate tax stamp. Weirdly a 37mm m203 is a title ine weapon and you can launch smoke and flares with it but whack a 40mm barrelled on it or shoot an 'antipersonel' round (practice solid chalk cs buckshot whatever) it becomes a DD

 

Then a BFG is most likely going to be considered an AOW (any other weapon, used as a catch all for pistols with vfgs. Disguised guns like pen guns etc, pgo short barrelled shotguns that have never had a stock and a few other oddities. Basically sub 26" therefore easily concealed and not a title one firearm and/or a disguised gun. So the hk briefcase etc.)

 

And unfortunately the AT have decided that if it is 'readily convertable' then it is illegal and what is convertable is basically what ever the at decide it is. One of the things used in court was the standard of 8 hours in a moderately equiped machine shop making a gun readily convertable to full auto.... so a bfg using aby sort of primer in standard pistol round case will probably be considered a title two weapon leading to serious jail time.

[renegadecow]

Maybe I should redesign it to take Thunder Snaps for US consumers.

[amateurstuntman]

If you gave me 8 hours in a moderately equipped machine shop I could make a gun from scratch and then glue it to literally anything.

Therefore literally anything for sale in the entire USA is an illegal firearm.

[scorch]

If you gave me 8 hours in a moderately equipped machine shop I could make a gun from scratch and then glue it to literally anything.

Therefore literally anything for sale in the entire USA is an illegal firearm.

Glad I wasn't the only one thinking that.

[renegadecow]

8 hours and you can make an auto loader. There are vids out there showing you how to make a 12 gauge zip gun made from sch40 pipe and a nail taking all of 5 minutes to turn into a fully functional firearm. And the ATF are worried about a glorified noise maker.

[paranoiddroid]

The atf are 'special' I mean their conduct in one case stated that changing the bcg to fully m16 parts, modifying the guys gimmick 3 position selector so it would actually interact at point 3. Using specially selected soft primered ammo and a linger than normal firing pin to Conice a guy who lent a gun to a friend and it slam fired due to worn internals oh and the GBB m4 they said was easily convertible because you can swap the upper for a real one, drill new holes for the bcg with a drill press, install a real bcg and then fire a live round from a real magazine. But if you can do that then you can build a mac 11 on your own...

 

The problem is there isn't a definition for easily convertible other than whay the atfe say it is and there's no oversight in their "testing" they if you are in court with a device will say they managed to get it to fire in a prohibited manner but they won't explain how they did so nor give that information to the defence team nor will they allow independant firearms experts to watch the testing.

 

Your best bet in terms of the design is to find some way to mount the 209 primer or a cap from a cap gun without using a case or anything large enough they could fit a live round in there ore if you do make sure that it is set up in such a way only a blank could fit and that any attempts to increase this space will destroy the mech.

[renegadecow]

The cover I made that takes 209 primers doesn't make use of a scavenged hull actually as the cups they come in hold the pressure well enough on their own. But as you say, all it takes is the ATF to fabricate a new cover that can chamber a round and say it was as easy as changing out the cover.