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I have the Nova slide. The Detonator may have better paint for its price. Not sure.

 

10-8 vs 10-8

 

Posted on other page iirc, but from what I've seen compared mine to cav is - 

 

Detonator

+ Better Finish

+ Deeper engravings

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First impressions on the stock TM M&P feel/looks. (Without Nova slide) Feels much more solid and less toy like than the VFC. The VFC feels like they used super cheap plastic on the frame. TM frame is a bit shiney but not something that matters to me. Comparing slides the VFC is actually slightly thicker and wider. Magazines seat firmly. Trademarks look better on VFC though. (Again, not something that will make me dislike the gun)

 

Has the same issue the VFC has. Because airsoft slides are so light, sometimes when hitting the slide release my finger drags against the slide and it wont slam home fast. The M&P slide release is very low profile, so obviously not the companys fault. Though I prefer the method alot of real shooters recommend and "slingshot" the slide anyways.

 

I plan to run a grey Inforce APL light on it. I use that light on my real handguns and like it alot.

Edited by Mr Foxhound

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First impressions on the stock TM M&P feel/looks. (Without Nova slide) Feels much more solid and less toy like than the VFC. The VFC feels like they used super cheap plastic on the frame. TM frame is a bit shiney but not something that matters to me. Comparing slides the VFC is actually slightly thicker and wider. Magazines seat firmly. Trademarks look better on VFC though. (Again, not something that will make me dislike the gun)

 

Has the same issue the VFC has. Because airsoft slides are so light, sometimes when hitting the slide release my finger drags against the slide and it wont slam home fast. The M&P slide release is very low profile, so obviously not the companys fault. Though I prefer the method alot of real shooters recommend and "slingshot" the slide anyways.

 

I plan to run a grey Inforce APL light on it. I use that light on my real handguns and like it alot.

 

Think a 120-150% spring would help going home faster, but then you'd need to upgrade your slide.

 

Stock runs perfect though imho, wouldn't bother touching it unless you got the :"upgrade": bug... one suggestion would to use some removable glue (craft glue or blue loctite) to let the "clip" be more secure on the front post. (Just apply some glue in side and let it dry over night).

 

My first TM M&P had fall loose inside the slide, which made the front sights fly off somewhere.. the clip was still there when I removed it, so I upgrade to the UAC ones.

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So I've mainly been using my TM M&Ps for supplemental handgun training for my real steel shooting. My buddy is a grand master in USPSA (essentially US IPSC) and he uses an airsoft hicapa daily to supplement training for his RS 2011 pistol. He and I will still hit the live fire range together 2-3 times a week for a couple practice sessions and a competition but I've been needing extra work on one handed shooting (both left and right) and during USPSA I use my RS M&Ps ... so I decided to use my TM M&Ps. I've used my airsoft M&Ps for several consecutive days now, and it's definitely helped my RS shooting. However, it occurred to me that I should probably test the gun's accuracy because even though it *seems* accurate, you never know.

 

Today I "benched" my four TM M&Ps. Basically I placed the M&P's weapon light rail into a weaver mount vice which itself is bolted to a table. Mags were gased up, and left to warm to room temperature (approximately 65° F). Mags were loaded with 17 rounds of KSC 0.3g "Perfect" BBs. Hop-ups were preset for these BBs such that they shoot relatively flat with a little bit of lift and effective out to 30 yards. An X was drawn onto a piece of letter/A4 paper and that X was used as a point of reference (as the sights weren't perfectly lined up) just to see approximately how it groups. Annoyingly, the polymer TM used for the frame is pretty flexible, so I had to lock my hands and arms in place and try to introduce as little human error as possible. Anyway, I tested each gun, firing 17 rounds, slow fire from the bench at 6 yards. The results are below:

 

kotac-MnP-TM-FDE-sm.jpg

^^^ TM M&P VTAC w/ TM Slide, stock internals, benched at 6 yards, 17 rounds slow fire, 0.3g KSC Perfect BBs. ^^^

 

kotac-MnP-Nova10-8-sm.jpg

^^^ TM M&P w/ Nova 10-8 Slide, stock internals, benched at 6 yards, 17 rounds slow fire, 0.3g KSC Perfect BBs. ^^^

 

kotac-MnP-Detonator10-8-sm.jpg

^^^ TM M&P w/ Detonator 10-8 Slide, stock internals, benched at 6 yards, 17 rounds slow fire, 0.3g KSC Perfect BBs. ^^^

 

kotac-MnP-Detonator9L-sm.jpg

^^^ TM M&P w/ Detonator 9L Slide, stock internals, benched at 6 yards, 17 rounds slow fire, 0.3g KSC Perfect BBs. ^^^

 

Like I mentioned, the X on the paper was just for a rough point of reference, I wasn't terribly concerned about hitting the X, more interested to see how each gun grouped. For airsoft plinking and gaming they're ok. But for handgun fundamentals their accuracy are a little lacking. My buddy was saying that for his training he requires an airsoft gun to shoot a consistent 1/2" grouping at 9 yards with zero fliers. That way if any BBs are shot outside what he's aiming at, he knows it's due to his human error, not the gun's. He then draws a 1.75" circle on a sheet of paper and practices a variety of drills with his airsoft at 9 yards, making sure to keep all hits within that 1.75" circle. So here's why I'm not terribly enthused about my TM M&Ps, they all shot okay but certainly not the 0.5" groupings I had hoped for. Plus there were a flier or two with all the guns which for me is a bigger concern. And this was at 6 yards too.

 

Another thing that might have skewed the results are the BBs. These KSC 0.3g "Perfect" BBs are far from perfect. I've had them about three years stored in a dry and cool watertight container. But while examining them, I noticed these BBs have a lot of flash still on them and other surface inconsistencies. So that certainly doesn't help. I guess next I'll have to buy a new bag of 0.3g BBs (I was thinking maybe KWA, G&G or Biovals all of which are available locally) and then retest to see how they compare. If the results are about the same another thing I can do is change the inner barrel. Truthfully, I think it just might be the limitations of the gun. The M&P has a lot more play in the parts than a hicapa.

 

At this point, with my end use for the guns, I'm a lot less concerned about looks as I am about precision accuracy and overall performance. I'll report back when I get more data which will probably be next week (at a LEO vehicle class the next two days).

Edited by uscmCorps

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If you're expecting that level of performance from something that shoots round balls through the air then you're wasting your time.

 

Also, your choice of BB, even the replacement options, leaves a lot to be desired. If you want consistency and accuracy, mad bull match. Not KWA ones!

 

On top of that, you're not even changing the components that have a decent affect on accuracy and consistency!

 

Tight bore barrel and the hop unit and rubber are your first port of call. Not the slide

Edited by Got Wood?

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I don't think at that distance expecting that level of accuracy from round plastic balls is unrealistic. What my friend does with his TM stock hicapa is a testament to what you can get out of a BB. It's a question of whether or not the platform I'm using can be tuned to achieve it. Yes I have metal slides on three out of the four guns. Mainly because I originally bought it for gaming and wanting them to somewhat resemble my real guns, but my goals have shifted. I have a few tightbores on hand. So I'll give them a try. But when it comes to the newest crop of TM pistols I've had really decent performance out of the stock rubber.

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As for your BB choice I think you're pretty much on point with G&G. I made the switch from Madbull Match grade to G&G and I was surprised how much of an improvement you got. Even better was the fact that the G&G BBs cost so much less.

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For better accuracy would be: The stock groupings look good though =].

 

- Inner - hyperlink (there's also 6.01 by PDI)

- Bucking -- hyperlink

- BB's

 

I think you'll want to try these, http://madbull.com/catalog/en/products/b-b-bb-bullets/madbull-0-3g-precision-bbs-x4000.html

 

Over here we used double polished for IPSC - from BBASTARDS.

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Traditionally I've used 0.3g BBs for handgun fundamental practice. But it seems that 0.28's are popular with a lot of people. For precision practice shooting I think I'll stick with 0.3g BBs. Thanks!

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Ive also used ksc .3g bbs for a while, a couple years back the consistency in quality started to go downward and seems to not have gone back up. I saw alot of nubs and flash on alot of the bbs. It was especially noticable in the accuracy as initailly i thought the gun was the culprit until i used the bbs in multiple guns and types.

 

I also swapped over to the bb bastards and never looked back.

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I saw alot of nubs and flash on alot of the bbs.

This is exactly what my experience has been with it. When you switched over to BBastard, did you stick with the 0.3's?

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This evening I did a little more testing. Compared the KSC "Perfect" 0.3g BBs to some other bags I had on hand: G&G Bio 0.25g White BBs, and Bioval 0.27g Clear BBs. The results for these two other BB types were night and day compared to the KSC's:

 

kotac-MnP-Detonator9L-sm-01.jpg

 

Both G&G and Bioval grouped quite tightly. Perhaps the G&G 0.25g Bio BB's had a little tighter dot shaped group. The Bioval 0.27g Clear BB's were slightly more horizontally spread but they still grouped on the whole quite flat. Some deviation in the groupings could still be attributed to me, as the guns were only fixed in place via the weapon light rail and there was a degree of flex in the frame (which I tried my best to minimize). More importantly, the current setups with either G&G 0.25g White Bio's and Bioval 0.27g Clears did not result in any random fliers after repeated testing. That alone was a huge relief.

 

I also tried upgrading the inner barrels to brand new Nineball 6.03mm tightbore barrels. The groupings actually worsened compared to the stock TM inner barrel. This is obviously based solely on limited testing at 10 yards and closer, so YMMV. But that was a little surprising (and disappointing to see). The groups not only grew in size (at least doubled), but I saw a lot more random fliers with up to 3" of deviation. I have not tried a different rubber yet. I switched back to the stock TM inner barrel and the groups went back to sub-1" groups at 6 yards.

 

Anyway, as is, both BB brands/types benched very satisfactorily with the stock internals, and although were still not quite the 0.5" group I had hoped to achieve, the results were good enough for what I intended to use the guns for (handgun fundamentals). I then used the TM M&P 9L at 9 yards, freestyle (standing, w/ both hands), shooting slow fire at a pair of 2" dots, 17 rounds per dot:

 

kotac-MnP-Detonator9L-sm-02.jpg

 

For now I'm quite pleased with what the guns and BB ammo are capable of. My at home practice is back on track! I'm still going to check out the BBastard BBs though. If only to see how they compare with what I've currently got. The objective being to make the guns shoot as true as possible so I can fine tune my own shooting without wondering if it's the gun/ammo or me messing up. Thanks for the feedback so far gents!

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This might of been covered months ago but can't seem to find an answer.

Does anybody make a plug for the hole in which the safety used to be? Removing my safety soon and wondering if plugs have been made.

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I have some prototype plugs. They're okay. The fit needs tweaking a little but they work. No idea when they will, if ever, come to market. Hopefully someone else makes them. I don't believe the RS plugs would fit.

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