Tigerhund79 Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Hello everyone! This is my first post here, and unfortunately it´s about a problem that I´ve got with a P226 that I just aquired 2nd hand. With a fully gassed up magazine, it only manages to get off two or three shots before the magazine is fully depleted of gas. The slide and frame fitment is superb, but the rearward stroke of the slide when firing is weak and the pistol makes a typical "almost empty of gas"-sound even on the first shot. The previous owner had only one magazine for it and according to the techs he had been in touch with said the issue probably resided with the magazine and then he sold it off to me, saying he hadn´t used the pistol in quite some time. When I got it, I tested the magazine that came with the pistol with my other P226 with a Prime slide and frame conversion kit and it was just as reliable as my other three TM magazines, meaning the problem is with the pistol and its internals, but since I´m not a GBB pistol tech, nor that experienced with GBB pistols yet, I dare not guess what the problem is. Therefore, I leave the guessing to you lot, since most of you are probably much more tech savvy and experienced than I am. Here are the specs for the pistol: Externally. PGC CNC Aluminium P226 Navy Conversion KitGunsModify Tri-Dot Green Tritium Night Sight SetGuarder Steel Grip ScrewRS Sig Sauer Decocking LeverRS Sig Sauer Grip PanelsRS Sig Sauer Decocking Lever SpringInternally. FireFly Hop Up Bucking (Hard Type)Guarder Enhanced Loading NozzleGuarder Steel Recoil Spring GuideMAG Replacement Spring SetPDI CNC POM Piston HeadRCC CNC Brass Cylider ValveShooters Design Stainless Steel Enhanced Recoil Spring 150%Shooters Design Stainless Steel Valve KnockerShooters Design Steel Take Down LeverTanio Koba Hop Twist Inner Barrel I appreciate any help you can give me. Cheers lads! Link to post Share on other sites
LJ.NL Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Hi & welcome I would replace the recoil spring with a original (weaker) one and see what that does to the performance. Also, the 'RCC Cylinder Valve', that's a sort of high-flow valve, right? Have you tried a original magazine without a high-flow valve? I have a TM G17 with a steel kit that did the same thing (weak slide movement) with a high-flow valve magazine in it, but it works fine with a standard valve/mag Link to post Share on other sites
Tigerhund79 Posted May 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 I followed your advice and tried an original recoil spring but that wasn´t it. RCC Cylinder Valve appears to be a floating valve in the BBU (I had to google it). I too have a Glock (TM G17) with a steel slide, albeit modified to take CO2 like a champ, and at first I had a similar problem with it. I took it to a tech and I believe he replaced the piston and then it started cycling properly. Any other ideas? Link to post Share on other sites
LJ.NL Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Ah it's a floating valve, ok I'd try to bring the whole BBU/nozzle section back to standard to see if the problem is in there. Or take it to that same tech again Link to post Share on other sites
Tigerhund79 Posted May 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Yeah, I´ll try to lift the BBU et al from my Prime P226 (which I believe is pretty much stock inside) and try it in the PGC and see how it runs Link to post Share on other sites
heroshark Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Could be a crack in the piston ,also is the hammer spring up graded? Link to post Share on other sites
Gunnman Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 Swollen piston head o-ring from excessive silcone oil might be the case too. Link to post Share on other sites
Tigerhund79 Posted May 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 No, there are no cracks in the nozzle. It was oiled up pretty good but it works with another nozzle. I gave it all a thorough inspection a few hours ago. I think it's the floating valve. Link to post Share on other sites
mimesis Posted May 11, 2016 Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 I wonder if the RCC came with its own spring, or if it's standard. When doing this type of troubleshooting, always best to go back to all-stock internals, and work from there. If you want to experiment with rocket valves, you might have a look at Poseidon Ice Pick. Link to post Share on other sites
Tigerhund79 Posted May 11, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2016 I´ve been curious about that after watching a video about that a while back. I´ll look into it. Link to post Share on other sites
BaBaBooey Posted May 12, 2016 Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 Check your valve knocker lock...do you know how to function check it? My guess is, all the internal upgrades threw the timing off and the knocker lock is no longer allowing the knocker to retract at the correct point of the blowback cycle. As a result, way too much gas is allowed to be released per shot. Link to post Share on other sites
Got Wood? Posted May 12, 2016 Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 Another one that gets overlooked, pull the nozzle back and forth manually. Does it ping back instantly, or rub on the piston lid? Link to post Share on other sites
Tigerhund79 Posted May 12, 2016 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2016 Oh yeah, the nozzle is fine. The pistol runs fine now with a stock nozzle and nozzle guts. Link to post Share on other sites
Tigerhund79 Posted August 14, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2016 The problem was with the nozzle internals that the previous owner had installed. I never bothered to troubleshoot it any further and installed a stock nozzle with stock internals from a donor P226 that I had and left it at that. I have skirmished it a few times and I´m pretty happy with the current setup. Link to post Share on other sites
NonEx Posted August 15, 2016 Report Share Posted August 15, 2016 Was about to post that it's probably the nozzle/piston head and then realized how old this thread was Thanks for the update. Sounds like a typical loose piston head fit or sticky nozzle problems. Link to post Share on other sites
Tigerhund79 Posted August 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2016 I would actually fix it if I knew how because the internals are pretty expensive high-end but I don't really know what to do to be honest. Link to post Share on other sites
NonEx Posted August 15, 2016 Report Share Posted August 15, 2016 My first thought is that the seal between the nozzle (the cylinder that moves back and forth) and the piston head (rubber inside the nozzle) doesn't have a tight enough fit. Meaning when gas goes in the nozzle it doesn't seal properly and you get a lot of gas leaking out around the sides, resulting in weak blowback and heavy gas usage. Getting a new piston head for it should help. Sometimes different brands of piston heads, even if they say for TM 226 will work differently in whatever nozzle it is so it's a bit of trial and error. The second thing that it could be along the same lines since replacing the blow back unit helped, is a sticky nozzle. Pretty much the opposite of what I describe above. Either the nozzle itself is binding in the blowback housing or the nozzle is too tight of a fit on the piston head. Very difficult to diagnose and/or help properly without having the stuff in front of you. If you have the blowback unit, nozzle and piston head outside of the gun you can kind of test fit and function by moving the nozzle back and forth in the blowback unit. Also having the nozzle forward on the piston head and covering the gas route rubber hole (bottom hole on nozzle) with your finger and blowing air in through the front tells you if there is a good seal or not Link to post Share on other sites
mimesis Posted August 15, 2016 Report Share Posted August 15, 2016 Don't neglect the rocket valve (aka floating valve) inside the nozzle. Link to post Share on other sites
Tigerhund79 Posted August 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2016 NonEx: Having the stuff in front of you could be arranged as we live in the same city, but I will have a closer look at the internals as you suggested. Link to post Share on other sites
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