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Real AK Furniture on WE AK PMC


Sturm

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Can this be done without difficulty? Would a real AKM stock fit without any issues on the WE AK PMC? What about the upper and lower handguards, and the buffer tube? I know that real AK pistol grips (at least the Soviet bakelite ones) have difficulty fitting, and need quite a bit of modding. What about the rest of the furniture? I do have AKM furniture on my PMC, but it was designed around it (W&S wood conversion kit). In particular, the stock for that set does not have a trapdoor in the back, and it kind of ###### me off. Can I install real wood furniture? Would LCT stuff be an option, or is it from completely different dimensions?

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Hand guards fit with little problem. The stock requires more work.

 

The part that goes inside the rear of the receiver is too large on real stocks and must be trimmed to fit. Not hard, just takes some careful work if you want to do it right. I used chisels and files on a wood stock, and saws and files on a Magpul MOE stock.

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Hand guards fit with little problem. The stock requires more work.

 

The part that goes inside the rear of the receiver is too large on real stocks and must be trimmed to fit. Not hard, just takes some careful work if you want to do it right. I used chisels and files on a wood stock, and saws and files on a Magpul MOE stock.

What about the gas tube? Can a real one fit, or does it require a lot of modding?
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For the stock, just have to carve some grooves to clear the rivets. Extremely easy mod. 

Handguards might require some minor modding.  The pistol grip is a drop in afaik. Same for the gas tube. 


So yeah, you can use pretty much any real steel external part you'd like to, with the exception of the top cover, as WE's body is slightly larger than real spec.
The easiest route for the conversion is just grab the W&S kit, as it comes pre-moded to be a perfect drop in fit.
 

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For the stock, just have to carve some grooves to clear the rivets. Extremely easy mod.

 

Handguards might require some minor modding. The pistol grip is a drop in afaik. Same for the gas tube.

 

 

So yeah, you can use pretty much any real steel external part you'd like to, with the exception of the top cover, as WE's body is slightly larger than real spec.

The easiest route for the conversion is just grab the W&S kit, as it comes pre-moded to be a perfect drop in fit.

 

I already have a W&S kit installed. I got another one on the way as well.

 

The one thing I dislike about it is how the stock buttplate does not have the trapdoor. This means it is basically an East German (before nylon furniture was adopted by the DDR) or Bulgarian type stock, and obviously I am aiming for a Soviet look. The handguards are fine. However, the lower handguard does not have the hole at the base of it. Did all Soviet Tula/Izhmash production lower handguards have that hole drilled into the bottom of the lower handguard (I am not referring to the cleaning rod hole)?

 

Real pistol grips certainly need some modding. The problem with most real ones (do not know about Chinese Type 56 pistol grips or original AK47 wood grips) is that the portion of bakelite at the front of the pistol grip is too high, and cannot clear the back of the trigger guard. Because of this, I am wondering if an LCT pistol grip would fit without any mods.

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Basically there are enough variation in AK wood furniture it will require work of some sort regardless.

 

For example: 

- I removed the WE PMC stock and put straight onto an NHM90 no mods.  

- Then I took the NHM90 stock and put onto WE PMC, no luck.

- Then I took a Romanian AIMS stock and tried to put onto WE AK, no luck.

- Then I took the AIMS stock to fit onto NHM 90, also had no luck.

- Then I took the AIMS stock to fit onto Ishmazh, also had no luck.

 

Some may argue that the NHM90 is not an AK, but if it looks like an AK and throws M43 rounds like an AK and "sometimes" takes AK mags, then it is an AK.

 

Real gas tubes do fit, top covers will not.

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Basically there are enough variation in AK wood furniture it will require work of some sort regardless.

 

For example:

- I removed the WE PMC stock and put straight onto an NHM90 no mods.

- Then I took the NHM90 stock and put onto WE PMC, no luck.

- Then I took a Romanian AIMS stock and tried to put onto WE AK, no luck.

- Then I took the AIMS stock to fit onto NHM 90, also had no luck.

- Then I took the AIMS stock to fit onto Ishmazh, also had no luck.

 

Some may argue that the NHM90 is not an AK, but if it looks like an AK and throws M43 rounds like an AK and "sometimes" takes AK mags, then it is an AK.

 

Real gas tubes do fit, top covers will not.

Will real gas tubes fit without any modifications though, or does it require dremelling and filing all kinds of off?

 

Did Soviet AKM buttplates always have the trapdoor mechanism? That is my main concern, since I am all about realism (at least as close as I could get).

 

Could the AIMS stock fit with modifications? I do not care for Romanian furniture, but I am just wondering. There really does not appear to be much in terms of Soviet AK furniture on the market. Do you know any decent sites that stocks good Soviet surplus furniture? I do not want Bulgarian, Romanian, or Polish *suitcase*. Not even DDR stuff. I want Soviet.

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I fitted the Norinco gas tube onto a WE, does require a little dremelling, but all in all its really minor work to trim 2mm of material. 

 

An LCT gas tube will fit a Norinco with no added work.

 

Basically fitting anything from one to the next will require some work, and identifying the least amount to trim is probably the most challenging thing.

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I fitted the Norinco gas tube onto a WE, does require a little dremelling, but all in all its really minor work to trim 2mm of material.

 

An LCT gas tube will fit a Norinco with no added work.

 

Basically fitting anything from one to the next will require some work, and identifying the least amount to trim is probably the most challenging thing.

Too bad I do not have a dremel.

 

Besides that, do you know if Soviet buttplates were ever missing the trapdoor? From what I can tell, they were always present. Were they? Secondly, most Soviet production AKMs seem to have had a hole underneath the lower handguard. What is the purpose of this? Did all or most Soviet lower handguards have this characteristic?

 

Also, I might buy an LCT pistol grip. Do you know if they'll fit the WE AKs without modifications?

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Put this on your stock.

http://www.desertfoxoutfitters.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=253

 

Hole under handguard is to allow water egress.

 

Dremels are only $50 now. Unless you're really proficient with hand tools, a Dremel is almost indispensable in this hobby if you want to go mixing parts up. Even real AKs have some differences in tolerances between makes and may require some fitting.

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LCT grip is definitely a bad idea. They are fat, they are ugly, and without the motor inside to give them some sort of structural reinforcement they feel flimsy, brittle and squishy, in a really bad way. And require the very same modification to properly fit the trigger guard.

Modding the real thing to fit it's the way to go.

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Put this on your stock.

http://www.desertfoxoutfitters.com/commerce/product_info.php?products_id=253

 

Hole under handguard is to allow water egress.

 

Dremels are only $50 now. Unless you're really proficient with hand tools, a Dremel is almost indispensable in this hobby if you want to go mixing parts up. Even real AKs have some differences in tolerances between makes and may require some fitting.

The problem there is that the W&S stocks do not have the cutout in the rear of the stock, so I wouldn't be able to install a trapdoor set any ways. If I remove the buttplate, it is solid. There is no cutout to accept the trapdoor mechanism.

 

I should probably get a dremel sometime. Are the cheap ones bad? Are they easy to use? About the handguard hole, did all Soviet lower handguards have it?

 

Don't GHK AKs use LCT externals? Wouldn't that mean that the pistol grip is LCT as well?

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GHK grips are GBB grips which, like the RS grips are thin and narrow and solid

 

LCT grips are AEG grips and designed to take a motor, is hollow.

 

If you really want to use it you can  to fill it up with something to make it solid and drill a hole to allow the bolt to secure the grip onto the receiver.

 

Otherwise you can get GHK/RA tech wood kits.  They will fit the RS/WE with some mods.  The wood stock and foregrip is great, but the pistol grip is horrible.

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GHK grips are GBB grips which, like the RS grips are thin and narrow and solid

 

LCT grips are AEG grips and designed to take a motor, is hollow.

 

If you really want to use it you can to fill it up with something to make it solid and drill a hole to allow the bolt to secure the grip onto the receiver.

 

Otherwise you can get GHK/RA tech wood kits. They will fit the RS/WE with some mods. The wood stock and foregrip is great, but the pistol grip is horrible.

Where could I get GHK pistol grips then? I do not believe Samoon has any listed.

 

Where could I get GHK wood kits? I thought they were made by LCT? Are the RA Tech wood kits made from solid wood or laminated wood? The former would not be an accurate option.

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How much fitment would it require on a WE? I'm not interested in the grip. The stock has a trapdoor, correct? Also, is the furniture coated with shellac? It looks like it, from the high gloss, but I cannot tell for sure.

 

W&S supplies a steel gas tube with the conversion kit. Do you think it would fit right on the RA Tech upper handguard?

 

Also, LCT (afaik) makes the GHK AK furniture. Does that mean the GHK furniture is AEG spec? Is it identical to the furniture found on LCT AEGs? Or is the GHK furniture similar in spec to real steel (and thus WE AKs)?

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It will require work.  Everything requires work. 

 

RA-tech kit is lacquered.  It has no trapdoor.

 

It looks to me the RA -tech kit + LCT gas tube is basically the W&S kit anyways.

 

LCT makes AEGs and AEG parts, designed around mechboxes and motors.  GHK parrts are for GBB and is based loosely on the RS.  There are parts between manufacturers which will roughly be compatible, like foregrips, front and rear sights, etc.  But for stocks and pistol grips, no.

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It will require work. Everything requires work.

 

RA-tech kit is lacquered. It has no trapdoor.

 

It looks to me the RA -tech kit + LCT gas tube is basically the W&S kit anyways.

 

LCT makes AEGs and AEG parts, designed around mechboxes and motors. GHK parrts are for GBB and is based loosely on the RS. There are parts between manufacturers which will roughly be compatible, like foregrips, front and rear sights, etc. But for stocks and pistol grips, no.

So, LCT makes GBB versions of their wood furniture for GHK? Where could I get the GHK furniture? I searched all over Samoon. I also sent them an email. Do you personally know where to get the GHK furniture? I've read many sources that state the GHK AK furniture is made by LCT. I no longer think the stuff is AEG spec, considering the cut outs on the LCT furniture are definitely different than the GHK ones, but I believe LCT still manufactures GHK's wooden furniture.

 

I do not think the W&S set is related to the RA Tech kit. The W&S stock has the sling mount on the bottom of the stock, not on the side as the RA Tech stock appears to have. Other than that, yes, they look strikingly similar. The W&S kit also comes with a proper AKM fire selector, to replace that 'tacticool' default selector.

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Slow down. 

 

It doesn't matter who makes what. 

It matters how it may/may not fit. 

The trick is to figure out which one fits.

 

for example:

 

rag-ghk-012_1_mark.jpg

 

 

Versus

 

kit-ee024.jpg

 

 

Top example is a GBBR one, and is similar to the W&S version.

Note the end of the stock is a protruding square piece of wood.  It is designed for the 1 pronged stamped AK non folding trunnion.  With modifications that will fit a WE or a real steel with the 1 pronged trunnion. 

 

Bottom example is an AEG one, note a shortened stock end, most likely for the LCT/VFC stamped steel receivers without the folding stock trunion.

 

Both foregrips here will fit both stamped steel AEG and GBBR, but not the pistol grip.

 

Here is another example:

 

 

gp363-l.jpg

 

This version is designed for the marui styled AK AEG bodies, which features a hollow stock, and the wooden stock is designed for 2 tabbed stock trunnion.  The foregrips will also not fit the stamped steel receivers.

 

So don't confuse between the 3.

 

----------------------------------------------------

 

An FYI there are different stock trunnions.

 

The original AK47 had a 2 prong non folding trunnion, which is replicated on the Marui AK47 AEG.

The AKM typically had a 1 prong non folding trunnion which is designed to attach to a wooden stock in example 1.  There are steel folding stocks such as the AIMS which will attach to this trunnion, as well as aluminium VTLOR sliding stocks.

The AK74 and later AKS74U, AK101 etc, will have folding trunnions.

 

----------------------------------

 

Another option:  Since you are in the US, you can get real steel AKM wooden stocks and make them fit the WE if necessary.

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The problem there is that the W&S stocks do not have the cutout in the rear of the stock, so I wouldn't be able to install a trapdoor set any ways. If I remove the buttplate, it is solid. There is no cutout to accept the trapdoor mechanism.

I should probably get a dremel sometime. Are the cheap ones bad? Are they easy to use? About the handguard hole, did all Soviet lower handguards have it?

It's only wood. Cut a relief into the stock so the trapdoor hinge fits if you don't want to gut out a proper compartment cavity.

$50 gets you a Dremel 3000. Anything cheaper and you're venturing into cheap Chinese knockoffs and your mileage may vary.

They (like all power tools) require skill to use properly but since you'll be hollowing out unseen parts you'll be fine.

AFAIK all Russian handguards have them. But ones by other former USSR countries can come with no drain hole. If you really want to then drill a hole under your handguard. Drilling holes and cutting reliefs on furniture that's already on your gun will be easier and cheaper than getting whole new furniture which may require modifying to fit, not that that's all that much difficult either.

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It's only wood. Cut a relief into the stock so the trapdoor hinge fits if you don't want to gut out a proper compartment cavity.

$50 gets you a Dremel 3000. Anything cheaper and you're venturing into cheap Chinese knockoffs and your mileage may vary.

They (like all power tools) require skill to use properly but since you'll be hollowing out unseen parts you'll be fine.

AFAIK all Russian handguards have them. But ones by other former USSR countries can come with no drain hole. If you really want to then drill a hole under your handguard. Drilling holes and cutting reliefs on furniture that's already on your gun will be easier and cheaper than getting whole new furniture which may require modifying to fit, not that that's all that much difficult either.

Do you know who OEMs the GHK furniture? I've read LCT quite a few times. Can you confirm this? Could Samoon be able to get me some of it?

 

I'll try and pick up a dremel. 50$? That's it? Seems almost too trivial. Surely there is more to it? Will I have to spend another 100$ on bits and such to make it usable for anything?

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No idea on GHK but from what I can tell LCT makes most of it. The parts that obviously won't fit GBBs, GHK makes either themselves or outsourced by another factory.

 

There's a Dremel 100 and 200 but are really more for fine engraving work. The basic Dremel 3000 starts at around $50 with a few attachments but also range up to around $100 with either more or different attachments. I just got one with a flex shaft included for about $75. Read more into the other attachments/packages first as you may end up with tools you'll never really use and you can always buy them separately if needed.

If you really just want to get a rotary tool to get this done on the cheap, Black & Decker's RTX is getting plenty of good reviews though not as much torque/features as a Dremel 3000.

https://www.amazon.com/Black-Decker-RTX-B-3-Speed-Rotary/dp/B000MUSLCC/ref=sr_1_21?ie=UTF8&qid=1484023697&sr=8-21&keywords=dremel+3000

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GHK butt stocks are LCT . 

 

GHK butt stocks require modding to fit WE the same way real ones do (takes two minutes with a file )

 

GHK/LCT foregrips fit WE with a little trimming (a minutes worth)

 

GHK pistol grip will require modding for WE the same way a real one does 

 

I've fitted these and more to WE and can confirm it takes very little work 

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Seriously, I think you're overestimating the work needed to fit everything. 

Real stocks / GHK stocks takes less than 2 minutes with a file, the mod it's so simple, it's retarded. 
Real grips / GHK grips takes less than 1 minute with a file
Handguards takes 0 to 3 or 4 minutes, depending on the particular manufacturer.

esx4.jpg

It's reall, really easy, you can't mess that up. And it would be even easier with a dremmel, which personally I think every man should have. 

 

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