Installation of Guarder 1911 Dummy Firing Pin Set

[Sturm]

Right, so you can discard any of your findings from those print-outs right away since you have no reference of what a mm is supposed to be. How do you know your print out is a 1:1 scale match for mms? You don't without a reference and by default printers do not output 1:1 unless you tune them to the right settings and verify afterwards. Was the source file Letter format or A4 format? And did you print to the same type of paper as the original document is? etc...

 

You also measured the length of the socket head screw incorrectly despite me linking to information on how to do it...

 

Digital calipers are like $15 USD and are very useful for a lot of things.

 

I would guesstimate your age to about 12 all things considered which makes me wonder what you are doing with an INO 1911 in the first place...

 

By what, the fact that I'm seemingly mentally challenged or the fact that I write like I am 12 (which is not the case, considering my active vocabulary and use of conventions is in the 99th percentile)?

 

Sometimes I wish the phrase was 'verba personas non' instead of persona non verba. My words are usually correct, but my actions often backfire. *fruitcage* me.

 

Anyways, I was aware of the possibility of the scaling being wrong. I printed using Adobe Reader, and made sure that the page was printed at its actual size, and not scaled to fit the page et alias.

 

With regards to the socket head screw, I thought I measured the length correctly? According to Boltdepot, all countersunk screws are measured from the top of the head until the end of the screw. That's exactly what I did with both of them. The 'measurements' I took were obviously pretty rudimentary, but I think it gives a rather basic idea of what both lengths are.

 

And, yeah, digital calipers are cheaper than I expected. I should have looked first. I think I'll pick a pair up.

 

 

I have received much hate on here lately, but am rather oblivious as to why. I make a lot of mistakes and sometimes think irrationally. I hope with time I will learn how all of this works better. When you first got into this hobby, did you oftentimes screw up? I hope it is just part of some kind of learning process, and not that I am severely mechanically flawed.

[DarkLite]

I have received much hate on here lately, but am rather oblivious as to why. I make a lot of mistakes and sometimes think irrationally. I hope with time I will learn how all of this works better. When you first got into this hobby, did you oftentimes screw up? I hope it is just part of some kind of learning process, and not that I am severely mechanically flawed.

 

You are getting a lot of flak because:

 

1) You ask for advice, then totally ignore the advice you are given

2) You seem to be utterly incapable of even the most basic mechanical work - case in point: You apparently cannot hold a screw up to a ruler

3) You are completely, incontrovertably unaware of facts 1) and 2)

[NonEx]

yeeeeh...

[Gunnman]

That and a lot of this is a 'learn yourself, trial and error' type of stuff. If you can't do that, then it's very hard to spell it out to you.

[Mitsu]

So have you bought a caliper yet? Or did you buy a new expensive gbbr instead?

[Sturm]

So have you bought a caliper yet?

Yep.

https://imgur.com/a/etqb7

 

So, the Guarder screw appears to be M3x0.5mmx8mm, and the Ino appears to be M3x0.5mmx15mm. Of course, I grabbed one of the cheaper 'China' digital calipers, so it is unlikely to be extremely accurate, but close enough. I just rounded the diameters and lengths I got. I assumed the thread pitch to be 0.5mm, since M3 machine screws seem to typically have such a value for thread pitch.

 

I'll need Phillips countersunk machine screws in that size (M3x0.5mmx15mm). That should not be difficult.

[Mitsu]

Good work, problem solved.

[NonEx]

Hrmmm... Not necessarily.

 

Socket head screws are measured in lenght below the screw head. In your application in the INO housing the head is flush with the back but that's not the "right" way. And you have to consider if the head size and seating depth of the socket head bolt is different than the countersunk Philips screw.

 

Does that make sense?

 

Look at the last pic of the screws there and you can kinda get what I mean. If you had a countersunk Philips head the same total lenght as the socked head screw, it would technically be "longer"... Hmmm..

 

I think a 15mm countersunk Philips head might be too long in the end as it will sit further in than the socket head. If it does you can shorten it with a Dremmel and a cutting disc, which you now have, but I am not sure we want to go down that route with you

(If you do, wear goggles, hold the screw with pliers because it gets HOT, cut straight, and then bevel the edges of the cut so the bottom and threads are more smooth, bot honestly, don't do this... please )

 

What you do is this, take out the INO socket head screw, put the new fake firing pin plate in place, poke in the bottom protruding shaft on the calipers and put it in the screw hole and you can see how deep the hole is and then you know exactly what your limit is. (if your caliper bottom shaft is thin enough, otherwise put in a toothpick or whatever and measure the depth). You want the screw to be slightly shorter than the max depth of the hole so you don't bottom out the screw before it secures the firing pin plate.

 

I know, mind blown, right?

 

Also, as for the screws coming out as 2.7x and 2.8x, that is normal. Lower quality screws are more off than high quality ones. I actually had one that was so off spec it barely held on to the threads so I had to use plumbers tape to space it

 

Pro-tip, whenever you go to use the calipers, close it all the way, securely, but don't hold it under pressure, and press the Zero button. So you know that calipers closed = 0mm.

 

And the screw at the top is used if you take a measurement and you want to keep the calipers secured in that dimension, measure, lock it and then you can use it for reference elsewhere etc. without worrying about it changing settings.

[Sturm]

Hrmmm... Not necessarily.

 

Socket head screws are measured in lenght below the screw head. In your application in the INO housing the head is flush with the back but that's not the "right" way. And you have to consider if the head size and seating depth of the socket head bolt is different than the countersunk Philips screw.

 

Does that make sense?

 

Look at the last pic of the screws there and you can kinda get what I mean. If you had a countersunk Philips head the same total lenght as the socked head screw, it would technically be "longer"... Hmmm..

 

I think a 15mm countersunk Philips head might be too long in the end as it will sit further in than the socket head. If it does you can shorten it with a Dremmel and a cutting disc, which you now have, but I am not sure we want to go down that route with you

(If you do, wear goggles, hold the screw with pliers because it gets HOT, cut straight, and then bevel the edges of the cut so the bottom and threads are more smooth, bot honestly, don't do this... please )

 

What you do is this, take out the INO socket head screw, put the new fake firing pin plate in place, poke in the bottom protruding shaft on the calipers and put it in the screw hole and you can see how deep the hole is and then you know exactly what your limit is. (if your caliper bottom shaft is thin enough, otherwise put in a toothpick or whatever and measure the depth). You want the screw to be slightly shorter than the max depth of the hole so you don't bottom out the screw before it secures the firing pin plate.

 

I know, mind blown, right?

 

Also, as for the screws coming out as 2.7x and 2.8x, that is normal. Lower quality screws are more off than high quality ones. I actually had one that was so off spec it barely held on to the threads so I had to use plumbers tape to space it

 

Pro-tip, whenever you go to use the calipers, close it all the way, securely, but don't hold it under pressure, and press the Zero button. So you know that calipers closed = 0mm.

 

And the screw at the top is used if you take a measurement and you want to keep the calipers secured in that dimension, measure, lock it and then you can use it for reference elsewhere etc. without worrying about it changing settings.

I also bought some shorter screws, 12mm as well, so I think if 16mm (could not get 15mm) is too long, 12mm would be good.

[icolater]

Nice work!! Glad you got it sorted, mate.

[Sturm]

Yeah, so...bit of a problem (as usual).

 

The length and diameter of the screws I ordered (arrived today) is good, but the diameter of the head is too wide to fit inside the Guarder firing pin plate. What does this mean?

[Gunnman]

Would it be possible to ground the head down without interfering with the Allen hole?

[Sturm]

Would it be possible to ground the head down without interfering with the Allen hole?

Doubtful.

 

I mean, yeah, I could try (I have a whole bag of the screws lol), but it likely will not work out. I emailed Boltdepot and asked if I could mail them the Guarder screw and see what they think will be a match. Coincidentally, I actually live only half an hour away from them! Who would know!!

[NonEx]

Pictures please.

 

What allen hole? You bought countersunk Philips head screws, no?

 

Not sure if the size and profile of countersunk screw heads are regulated by any standard.

 

If it is the outside diameter of the screw that is too wide, what I have done when this happens to me, I mount the screw in an electric drill with the base in the chuck, and then rev it up and hold a file to the outer edge of the screw head to grind it down, gives good results.

 

If it is the actual tapered profile of the screw head, you can do the same but using a rounded file to work down the bevel shape to fit.

 

Or, you can use a Dremel rounded head sanding bit to increase the diameter and depth of the hole in the plate. But that runs you the risk of messing up the finish of course. You could paint over it I guess. But I have done that variant as well. Although if the firing pin plate is steel those bits are not very good, they just chip off  

[renegadecow]

See, if you just went to the hardware store to buy ONE screw that fits...

[Gunnman]

Error in my writing, NonEx.

[DarkLite]

[Sturm]

So, I have some more information.

 

I don't think a trip to a hardware store would have mattered. According to Boltdepot, the screw (I mailed it to them and they took a look at it) is possibly a custom size.

 

The diameter of the head is 4.75mm, and they only stock heads with 5.6mm for M3 screws.

 

The 'good' thing about this is that I now know the proper diameter of the Guarder screw head. However, I am going to probably need to find a custom shop somewhere that can produce custom screws for me. I'm sure they exist. Is a custom screw shop an actual 'thing?'

 

I'll need a screw of M3x0.5mmx15mm with a head diameter of 4.75mm.

[Gunnman]

Custom screw shops do exist. They're called machine shops, and most require blueprints and a large bulk order. Doing a production of one screw is expensive, believe it or not. I needed 4 proprietary grips screws for my Sheriff 92FS frame, and I was quoted like $70 plus shipping due to labor.

[Sturm]

Custom screw shops do exist. They're called machine shops, and most require blueprints and a large bulk order. Doing a production of one screw is expensive, believe it or not. I needed 4 proprietary grips screws for my Sheriff 92FS frame, and I was quoted like $70 plus shipping due to labor.

Four?

 

I didn't know most of those shops would do orders that small (and yes, I did some more research into them, and I know they 'exist.' I guess I always sort of knew. It is common sense).

 

The sort of good thing about my case is that the screws I need produced are pretty small. They will need to be fairly long (15mm or so), but are otherwise tiny. Grip screws can be fairly large, at least in comparison to what I need.

 

I contacted one nearby machine shop, and they said they only do slot or hex socket. I think slot would work. It does not matter what interface the head is as long as it is countersunk and has a diameter of 4.75mm. Socket hex, on the other hand...I wouldn't take it.

 

I'll probably send them the screw as a 'sample' (even though the 'sample' is the only such one I have, lol). Not a big deal. I'm stubborn as *fruitcage* so I'll most likely toss it in a plain envelope, emboss it with a stamp, and send it on its say. I'm not printing a shipping label for that *suitcase*.

[renegadecow]

Get your long screw, throw it in a drill chuck, and reduce head size with a file. Done in 5 minutes, tops.

[Gunnman]

Get your long screw, throw it in a drill chuck, and reduce head size with a file. Done in 5 minutes, tops.

THANK YOU!

[NonEx]

As I suggested on the previous page  

[DarkLite]

InB4 Sturm posts a new thread about how his drill is broken because he lost the chuck key and has to buy a brand new drill because there is literally nothing he can do to fix it

[Gunnman]

I'm detaching myself from this thread, it's causing me to have sleep paralysis and to drink. I will no longer check my notifications and denounce any mentions of this thread as long as it's active.

 

I'm calling my local mental health facility in the morning to talk about counseling.