ninja master of coffee Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 Even if this stays slightly above half a joule (considering it won't creep...which we don't really know yet), eye pro is rated for a single impact, not 150. This thing is literally 150 more dangerous than any gun out there. Sigh... Your eyepro, if rated, is rated for any number of impacts bellow the stated impact energy threshold. That's why you can use it for years or take a burst of AEG fire to the face and your eyepro, if not your face, suffer no ill consequences. This is not "150 times more dangerous", again, that isn't how mass impact works. I've been moscarted, it was a bit of surprise but basically felt like rain, to the point that if it had happened from behind during a rain storm, I actually might not have noticed. Being shot in the face by single high velocity BB is much, much more painful and causes considerably more damage. It's also probably important to note that these come out as a stream, rather than being expelled all at once like a normal moscart so the potential for a very close range (point blank) impact where the BBs are effectively clumped together like a single mass is actually lower. Would I mind someone deliberately being a douche with one? Sure, but I mind deliberate douche-baggery from someone weilding a JG AEP. Intentionally aiming for people's faces or shooting people after they have called hit is just bad sportsmanship. If this thing was doing high velocity I'd see the problem, but it isn't. Link to post Share on other sites
Dimitri MdP Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 Why are you ignoring Catgut's points about power levels? Why are you implying getting "overshot" with this is going to be equivalent to a normal RIF? My Makarov shoots 240 FPS. So I know how 240FPS feel like. It's not painful, it's not likely to leave a considerable mark, but it still stings at 15 meters. So I know nobody wants 150 hits with that. Being shot in the face by single high velocity BB is much, much more painful and causes considerably more damage. I know that one, once I got hit in the forehead so bad it cut through the skin really deep, it ended up producing a subcutaneous tissue infection that got me 3 weeks of a totally deformed face, including 2 days admitted to hospital. Not fun at all. Turn out it was caused by "just a pistol", but it was one of those long-barreled WE M92 gen 1 that shoot about 450FPS. Which is almost twice the allowed energy for a pistol pretty much everywhere in the world. So I certainly agree 1 single impact of such a stupid thing as an overpowered pistol is more dangerous than this 40mm (and that's why we have power limits and MEDs). Not even gonna try to argue that one. But it's also 150 times more dangerous and painful than my Makarov, and most field-legal guns out there. Seriously guys. A third of a second. That's the part you're missing. Would I mind someone deliberately being a douche with one? Sure That's the problem. There's simply no way to use this without being a douche. It's designed to be a douche tool. It's even marketed in the most douchy douche way ever. Just think about it. How on Earth are you going to "use it correctly" if it dumps the 150bbs in a third of a second? That's what a good player "short burst" lasts. On a regular gun, that can mean 6 to 8 shots. This thing shoots 20 times that in the same time span I'm sure if you ever get shot with this thing you'll instantly change your mind. Link to post Share on other sites
Kalashnikov_kid Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 I'd be happy to use this in an indirect fire role as form of long range shower shell. CQB use is complete penus! Just my opinion Link to post Share on other sites
CatgutViolin Posted March 20, 2018 Report Share Posted March 20, 2018 How on Earth are you going to "use it correctly" if it dumps the 150bbs in a third of a second? Surprisingly, the demo video actually demonstrates the 'correct' use when the player sweeps it across the guys in the tower. Aim at a distant target, pull the trigger, wave it around. They're not each getting plugged with 100+ BBs. Sure, they're getting hit with more than one so I guess you can call it overkill, but it's not like a regular moscart is any different in that regard. I'm also just going to throw out that unless they've edited the design since the video, the 'third of a second' rate of fire claim is nonsense. Check the timestamps and you can clearly see that it's taking nearly a full second to discharge. That makes it virtually identical in both rate of fire and muzzle velocity to a strafer, which has plenty of legitimate use. Link to post Share on other sites
tquilha Posted March 20, 2018 Report Share Posted March 20, 2018 From seeing the videos, this looks like a very silly invention. Also these videos pretty much made this an instant ban at every well-run site I know of. I guess it'll be a great hit (pardon the pun) with the HPA and ultra high ROF gang... Link to post Share on other sites
manchovie Posted March 21, 2018 Report Share Posted March 21, 2018 Can we please just agree on a few things? 1/3s may as well be instant. This product is directly analogous to existing 40mm grenades despite taking a tiny bit longer to shoot. 40 mike = moscart (but with better performance) 40 mike = medium range engagement and special use tool 40 mike is not a 150bb HPA burst gun 40 mike is not an overkill device (despite video) 40 mike is not a CQB tool This product was designed to provide more power without using dangerous high pressure gases. Ironically, this makes it arguably safer for regular field use. I've fired this thing and have to say that the medium range utility is what people will be saving it for. Ambushes, covering fire, multiple targets, brush, that's what the 40 Mike is for. The 10ft spread at 100ft is pretty devastating! Also, the sound is horrifying, like a tie fighter/walrus/pterodactyl thing, really loud. The video is problematic as it presents it as a CQB overkill device, which is doing it a disservice. Like selling a bowling ball as a foot smasher when really you're supposed to roll it to play a fun game . Airsoft is about fun! Given you play with non-horrible people, this product really has the potential of expanding the experience of an airsoft game! Of course it's scary if you picture the most horrible ways an *albatross* can use it but in the end this is 240fps and is best used at range in a year, this will all blow over and that SCRREEEEEEEEE will be a familiar and exciting sound on the field. I'm excited! Link to post Share on other sites
ninja master of coffee Posted March 21, 2018 Report Share Posted March 21, 2018 Cheers for the actual use input! I think one of the other things to remember is that like all canister style devices in airsoft, it fires a ton of rounds, then has to be reloaded. I think the worse cases of overkill I have seen are by b*llends with AEGs and box/drum magazines. People who think they're actually Animal Mother form Full Metal Jacket and not someone playing a game with expensive toy guns in the woods, and just let rip into enemy players with literally no regard for how much they're hurting them (pro-tip, if you have a high speed set up, a 3000 round drum magazine, and your AEG is putting out 350fps, a lack of trigger discipline is going to win precisely zero friends). Plus, you know, the people who give HPA set ups a bad name "yeah but it's doing 350 fps" "but with a .43..." "yeah, what's the problem? It's in limits." "look... just, no, please go away and read some science." Link to post Share on other sites
DarkLite Posted March 22, 2018 Report Share Posted March 22, 2018 A video interview with a bit more context and less ridiculous "HURR DURR OVERKILL SUM NOOBS LOLOLOL GETREKT" marketing.I can definitely see the benefit of these in outdoor games but they shouldn't be allowed in CQB, just as I would also say existing Co2 moscarts are unsafe for CQB. Link to post Share on other sites
Horsem4n Posted March 22, 2018 Report Share Posted March 22, 2018 wonder what the milsim rules in the US will be for these? i can see a return of the grenade launcher to the standard unit. imagine a set of these in a GLM or a china lake? Link to post Share on other sites
Dimitri MdP Posted March 23, 2018 Report Share Posted March 23, 2018 Just when I thought this couldn't get any more stupid, they decided to test it in a room full of people with no eye pro. Seriously. What the *fruitcage* is wrong with these guys??? Link to post Share on other sites
Got Wood? Posted March 23, 2018 Report Share Posted March 23, 2018 A couple do. But notice they frantically reach for it when they realise he’s going to fire it in the press room. Most awkward show I’ve seen in a while Link to post Share on other sites
ninja master of coffee Posted March 26, 2018 Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 Well, that's obviously really dumb, first rule of airsoft, make sure everyone has eye pro before you fire anything. Link to post Share on other sites
DrAlexanderTobacco Posted March 26, 2018 Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 Yeah no arguments there, what a *suitcase* idea! Link to post Share on other sites
druid799 Posted March 26, 2018 Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 bit rich of you complaining about my hyper-machismo when you're talking about swinging fists. If you get upset by something in airsoft find a marshall or *fruitcage*off edit and yea i might as well say it: people need to man up!!! Did i say shoot me ? No I did not , I’m sure I’ll call you all the twats going under the sun but for me I’ll just walk away thinking what a knobhead you are . Did I say if some one shot one of my boys with this ? Yes I did and I stand by it , my boys are young teens who will take genuine hits like anyone , BUT you won’t accidentally shoot someone with one of these you will be making a conscious decision to do so and I stand by my comment that it may be low FPS but that many hits on such a small area in such a short period of time could do damage . So yes if you shoot either of my boys , or any other kid on the field with it there is a very good chance your getting a slap from any father trying to have a fun day scurmish with his kids .Finally I usually find the ones shouting “man up !” the most are usually the biggest whinny asses on the field when THEY get lit up . But there you go that the game .for you . Link to post Share on other sites
Skarclaw Posted March 27, 2018 Report Share Posted March 27, 2018 ive been skirmishing since i was 13 - fortunately my dad didnt escort me around (dropped me and my fellow tweens off at GZ and lft us to it) nor did he act like a hard man twat. think you need to find a hobby like... boxing? take a breather and read your post again - embarrasing stuff! every indoor site ive been to is semi auto only so this is a really academic conversation i think. i'm done!! Link to post Share on other sites
druid799 Posted March 27, 2018 Report Share Posted March 27, 2018 Toys , cot .enuff said . Link to post Share on other sites
blobface Posted March 27, 2018 Report Share Posted March 27, 2018 I think those of us in the UK can pretty much relax about this whole debate, I personally think it has use with a sensible MED, but it's all academics, these are likely going to be covered by exactly zero insurer, and most sites that has rules catered to the lowest common denominator will just preemptively ban it, not unlike TAG rounds, so I doubt this will be something we have to face in practice in games bar the rare events where people are treated like grown ups. Link to post Share on other sites
Gigueand Posted March 27, 2018 Report Share Posted March 27, 2018 To be honest, my understanding of these is that they shove out enough BBs with enough power so that at an actual usable range a cloud of BBs is generated. My experience with airsoft 40mms has been that shower shells produce a nice "cloud" on being fired, but the range is usually really poor. These new AI grenades solve that problem. Obviously and inevitably some jerk-*albatross* will probably trigger one of these into someone's face at 10'. Link to post Share on other sites
Skarclaw Posted March 27, 2018 Report Share Posted March 27, 2018 Toys , cot .enuff said . toy is the key word here.. playing with toy guns and you're threatening to punch people ahahaha Link to post Share on other sites
druid799 Posted March 27, 2018 Report Share Posted March 27, 2018 Hold my beer I’ve got a bit ! Link to post Share on other sites
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