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Wingmann

VFC MP7 AEG looks closer and closer

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I don't think the price is that bad. I see this as something that competes with a TM Recoil loadout wise. A GBB MP7 + enough mags is not cheap either.

Also i think motor and electronics are outside the gearbox but not shown in the video.

 

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We'll see how good or bad the retail prices go.
Also, remember that the EVO magazines are super expensive. If these are cheap you easily close the gap when buying 5-6 extra.

About the number of stops in the stock (if they are not there, which I think I've seen before), not a problem. Cutting new notches is a very simple task.

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Not sure if the comparison to EVO is fair :) The EVO is a "full size" AEG internally and not an AEP.

The EVO mags are 16gbp per midcap. That's not really that expensive. They should be more though lol.

500rnds with EVO:  106gbp
500rnds with M4 AEG (PTS mag): 90gbp
500 rnds with M4 AEG (MAG midcap): 30gbp
500rnds with M4 NGRS: 143gbp
2250rnds in 5 x g&g 450rnd highcap: 90gbp
500rnds with TM MP7 GBB: 437,5gbp

Prices do vary, and EVO is not the cheapest, but i think only GBB really stands out.
I mean yeah 15 mags like i have for my EVO is not free, but that is a lot of firepower really :flamethrower:

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When I bought them with the very first batch of EVOs they were 22€ each. I've never seen them in sale, and they have kept the high price. That's exactly the same I paid for the M4 1st gen PMAGs I still use. I broke one of the EVO mags the first week. PMAGs keep going after nine years of abuse.
The very excellent Guarder AK mags (155rd) were 8€ each, and I've bought ten for 40€ not very long ago. There's hardly anything in the ASG mags that justify their price, and quality is not a redeemer either.

If these VFC MP7 mags are something to talk about, they should go for 10-12€ each at the most, and be as well made as Guarder mags.

Then again, we'll see what the real prices on everything around this "AEG" go.

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On ‎2‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 8:24 PM, Wingmann said:

No more expensive than Tm recoil mags (which also have the bolt lock)

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2 hours ago, 1st Commando said:

No more expensive than Tm recoil mags (which also have the bolt lock)

No more expensive than EVO mags either. That doesn't make them reasonably priced, however.

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The EVO mag is a bit cheaper, but... we're talking about $30 a mag here, which is likely to be a little lower if sourced from Taiwan, it's on the high end of AEG mag prices but I wouldn't call it "Way too expensive" IMO, "way too expensive" would be the GBB priced GBLS DAS magazine at over $50 each. 

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Bear in mind you can buy perfectly functional age mags for £5 a piece.

We are all forgetting how much things probably should cost, and accepting paying out the *albatross* for stuff now

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3 hours ago, Got Wood? said:

Bear in mind you can buy perfectly functional age mags for £5 a piece.

We are all forgetting how much things probably should cost, and accepting paying out the *albatross* for stuff now

My thoughts exactly.

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No, but st the end of the day it’s just springs and levers in there. It’s hardly PTW tech with optical sensors. Apart from the initial R&D, which really should just be blueprints and design drawings, and a couple of proof of concept demo pieces, there’s nothing which should drive the price up by a factor of 6 compared to another Pmag clone.

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I agree, 30 bucks for a mag is terrible, are they made of high grade alluminum? steel? no, they are just ABS mags, as Got Wood said, the R&D process can't skyrocket a mag price to six times the price of a regular magazine (and that's not only for the MP7 but for the PTW, DAS, EVO, ARP9...)

I see this situation similar to the printers, the printer is "cheap" (well, this MP7 is not cheap either) and they get their money using overpriced consumables, in this case, mags, so if people wants to skirmish the gun properly, they will need at least 5 more mags for a total of 6 (at least that's my personal minimum) making you spend 150 dollars more

People will buy it, but I doubt it will be a "hit"

 

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12 hours ago, Isamu said:

I agree, 30 bucks for a mag is terrible, are they made of high grade alluminum? steel? no, they are just ABS mags, as Got Wood said, the R&D process can't skyrocket a mag price to six times the price of a regular magazine (and that's not only for the MP7 but for the PTW, DAS, EVO, ARP9...)

The R&D process can 'skyrocket' the price of a magazine if said magazine is only compatible with a single AEG and has a much lower potential market.

In principle it's fairly simple, if an injection mould to make a regular M4 plastic magazine costs the same as the VFC MP7 magazine (extra parts for the bolt stop may require an additional mould) and you can sell 10x more M4 magazines then the R&D cost per magazine is far lower, we also have no idea how many revisions they've made in the design and prototyping stage whereas a lot of the cheap magazines around are effectivly just clones.

Before I got into making airsoft products I used to think there was a tonne of money in it and lots of things were overpriced, now I'm in it I know why a lot of products (but not all) cost what they do and wonder how some manufacturers/retailers keep going, some of course don't.

I'm sure VFC have a much better understanding of their costs and the sales potential for the MP7 than any of us, maybe the magazines are priced a bit on the high side but they obviously think the market this MP7 is aimed at will stand the cost and it's not like they're a low end manufacturer anyway.

I'm also fairly sure I've paid that kind of price for a good quality magazine in the past for a more generic AEG.

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But this is exactly what I’m on about. The potential market and your feature base of product does not dictate the cost of R&D. The cost of getting to that product does.

 

If, after that you aim to reclaim those costs in selling the product, you play a risky game, depending on where you place that price point.

 

If, however, you aim to shift as many units as possible, by pricing it at a cost that is too good to pass up, then if your product is good enough you should invariably succeed.

 

Like I said, it’s schematics, drawings and a few demo units at best. It’s not lasers, electronics, chemicals, precious metals or elements etc. It’s not even that much of a new design. I’m betting it was simply a case of adding a bolt stop feature to TM’s old MP7 magazine. They may even have copied it from any GBB design. In which case, there’s no R&D and only the manufacture to consider.

 

I’m not trying to have a pop, but if you take a step back and look, why are we all accepting that each magazine should cost £30? That’s more than a military tested and approved pouch that holds it, more than a lithium battery that makes it function, heck, if you bought 5 that’s very nearly half the cost of the weapon it’s going in, a far more complicated product to design and produce.

 

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The is about supply and demand.

Is there a supply of licensed, built by a reputable manufacturer, authentic looking and modelled  AEG MP7's to the market? No.

Is there a demand for a licensed, built by a reputable manufacturer, authentic looking and modelled  AEG MP7's in the market? Yes, quite a big yes in fact.

Therefore, they're probably making massive margins but they are in a position to do so. 

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There is no barrel suck in any AEG, the BB has long left the barrel before the sector gear can swing around and re-engage the piston after release. Even on ridiculously long barrel with a slow moving BB. You can't build a gun with a rate of fire high enough with a PSG-1 length barrel though, you'd need to use a DSG which means a 300mm barrel max, and then you'd need something around 150rps to even start pulling the piston back before the BB has left it.

Having seen the guts of this now, I can see where the money goes. They appear to have engineered everything from scratch, except maybe the piston head!

I'm not super keen on it, but I'll pick one up because that investment needs recouping, and if VFC get to keep plugging away making us toys, maybe we will get a metal body full size UZI. One can dream. I suspect I'll gut this and put a Polarstar in it though, but don't worry I'll share the files for sure.

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