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Stubby Car15

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Hi guys, was looking into rebuilding the below. The PTS Legacy Car15. But have hit a road block with the handguard and stock. The stock appears to just be cut short. But the handguard I cannot find. Does such a thing exist? Or have PTS completely fabricated it?

 

8dcbfa30bc9cc855120604b5d842210c.jpg

 

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2 hours ago, Got Wood? said:

 

Hi guys, was looking into rebuilding the below. The PTS Legacy Car15. But have hit a road block with the handguard and stock. The stock appears to just be cut short. But the handguard I cannot find. Does such a thing exist? Or have PTS completely fabricated it?

 

8dcbfa30bc9cc855120604b5d842210c.jpg

 

 

Looks like it was based off the N23, a custom built mini CAR15

 

I found this:

Quote

 

Handguards were the trickiest part of the equation. For scale, realize that normal CAR handguards would reach nearly to the end of the muzzle. But we did find a solution.

Starting with a repro set of “skinny” CAR handguards, we first tossed the heatshields and cut the plastic to length. The end pieces that go into the handguard cap were cut off of the stubs. Then it simply became mating the two pieces together; first we used quick-dry super glue for initial fitting, and then JB Steel Stick on the inside and outside.

 

From here:

 

https://www.recoilweb.com/the-pdw-that-never-was-car-15-model-n-23-131167.html

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That’s exactly what I was after, thank you Alexander!

Shame it’s a bodge build. The likely good of my creating that and being happy with the quality of my work is very slim!

An alternative exists, the Olympic Arms K23B, but the hand guard isn’t as attractive

76b2c89f4802a83718a8dd26f4a26924.jpg

c8dc948aba234e17f878f5d5f57d14b3.jpg

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Sorry, link repost.

Nice project BTW, the handguard can be reguled after cutting by using fiberglass plus epoxy/polyester resin (I fused M14 and AR stock into M14SE2 with great results). At the stock tube, you will need lathe work. 

Edited by Murdoc

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Stock tube could be cut down with a hacksaw its only thin.  Doesn't even have to be tidy as its hidden under the stock, so hack away. lol.  CUtting down a stock tidly is the bigger problem, but its do able. 

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Agreed.

 

I’ll slowly build this. Should be fairly easy apart from the handguard. I’ll have to settle for an A3 upper though. A1 uppers are hard to get a hold of (on a budget) nowadays.

 

Shopping list:

 

Skinny hand guards (Brownells)

Buffer tube (eBay)

7” outer barrel (eBay)

Shorter inner barrel (eBay)

Car stock (eBay)

 

Hacksaw the buffer tube, and the stock. I have a dreamer so I can tidy up the rough edges left over after sawing the stock. Buffer tube will be hidden so not worried on that.

 

Just the hand guards to worry about. At £25 a set it’s expensive to get wrong a few times. Might see if LCS are prepared to take that job on...

 

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As an update:

7” Barrel ordered
LCS Engineering will do the work on the handguard for £40. Pretty reasonable!
JG M16a1 on order for the receiver etc (already has the correct cylinder for the barrel I’m told)
Slim ares AEG grip form the spares bin for a nicer touch

Only part I’m not 100% right now is the stock and buffer tube. I’ve picked one up to cut down, but I’m not sure on how solid it’s going to be. With the stock cut down, it’s as long as a lipo stick battery, which means it can’t be used fully collapsed, and also when the stock is extended fully (with cut down tube) there is very minimal surface contact between the tube and the stock, which leads me to believe it will wobble like hell at full extension.

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Fiberglass inside makes it rock solide. 

M14 plus, M16 buttstock, plus fiberglass, plus polyesther resin: https://airsoftbuilds.com/weapon.php?id=1616

M14 buttstock, plus PUR-foam, plus fiberglass, plus polyesther resin: https://airsoftbuilds.com/weapon.php?id=1492

This builds are nearly 7-8 years old, no problem.

I said lathe, because it's not simply shorter stock tube (OK, not so important):

C1BqBEe.jpg

Edited by Murdoc

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It comes from a Madbull Patriot kit.  Mines the long foregrip which was shortened, which was what I had at the time.   The Short  foregrip version would be more authentic.

 

Then as you pointed out, is the problem with the pitch.  Madbulls work on RS pitch, while ICS is on original Marui Pitch which is thicker by a mm overall for both ID/OD.  Takes a bit of effort to deepen the grooves with dremel and cutting disc.

 

The barrel is actually custom made also to achieve the effect.  Its great having a lathe at home.

 

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Yup.

Purchased a JG M16a1 for the spare Vietnam parts and the receiver. 7 inch barrel turned up but the lug grooves for the front sight are way too shallow so need to widen them.

Rear of receiver needs cutting to feed wiring into stock tube.

Needs deans fitting, fuse removing

Handguards need sending off to LCS engineering

Ares slim grip fitted. I believe I got a duff motor in that the shaft is a lot longer than all my other motors, and fully inserting the motor and base plate is so tight the motor cannot turn. Removing the pinion gear led to a rounded out screw so that’ll be fun. Is there a knack to changing these?

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Having a spare pinion is a must particularly if the grub screw is worn.  I have a modified pinion remover that works on D-shaped motor shafts as well as round motor shafts, but if all else fails you may have to cut the pinion out with a dremel.

I find that different manufacturers use different pinion gear and bevel gear sizing and teeth shape.  Having a mismatch results in a grinding noises in the gear.

 

I often modify motor shaft lengths to fit.   Some guns like the JP FAMAS or SIG 55x have custom motor lengths and if you want to put a good Lonex or SHS into the rifle you will need is a dremel and a cutting disc, and an old sock.

 

- Remove Pinion gear from motor, best method is to blow torch the grub screw and then unscrew.

- Measure the shaft to the appropriate length and mark.

- Stick the motor in the sock with only the shaft sticking out.  This is to prevent the iron filings sticking to the motor when cutting.

- Cut the shaft down to appropriate length with dremel

- Reshape/re-cut the D cut out on the shaft to fit the pinion (if the pinion is D-shaped)

- Mount the Pinion, grub screw and locktite

 

That should work.

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Correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t G&P recently release a pre-built version of this exact gun?

 

EDIT

I thought you were unaware of the airsoft version’s existence. Apologies, reading is hard.

 

Link: https://www.evike.com/products/94870/

Edited by ardrummer292

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Still needs a little bit of work on the stock tube, putty, sand and paint on the handguards, and a shorter flash hider, but I am really happpy with the result.

G&P XM-177

ACM 8.5" barrel

ACM stock, stock tube, front sight assembly and gas tube

G&P OEM handguards (in case I ruined the whole thing. Plus, I want to be able to turn it back into the original XM-177 whenever I want).

W749i5l.jpg

daMo8bs.jpg

Edited by chas
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Are you aware of the Colt 607? This was the original short CAR-15, but the earlier Colt 604/5 used the name, too. It looks like PTS just tried to do their best to recreate it with readily available parts.

If you're instead trying to completely imitate PTS's recreation, you're only a bit off. The flash hider is an A1 flash hider, but if my eyes are right, you've got a KAC M4QD flash hider. Also, and here's the real travesty on PTS's part...

...The slip-ring is tapered.

I hope this helped.

 

 

[IMG]

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13 hours ago, Got Wood? said:

Excellent stuff. How do you find the stability of the stock with it all cut short?

Also, worried I went for too short a barrel now. Mines 7”

Thanks.

https://www.recoilweb.com/the-pdw-that-never-was-car-15-model-n-23-131167.html

The "real" one uses a 7.5" barrel. I seemed to short for me, so I went with an 8.5". Looks better, IMO.

Since stock slides over the tube like a sleeve, no problem. Unless it's really loose to begin with, you should find no difference.

Edited by chas

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13 hours ago, DeadChristmas69 said:

 

[IMG]

You can already buy this as a full gun from Marui, G&P and even Golden Eagle/JG. Although with a regular side grip.

The gun you posted is a real gun. The N23 is a fantasy gun and I was aiming for that specifically.

Edited by chas

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I couldn’t find the shorter model posted above for sale from JG.

Didn’t fancy spending £2-300 on the G&P just to tear it apart anyway.

Chas, I may leave my stock at full size for a while. I’m not sure any of the batteries I have will actually fit with the stock all the way in anyway. My worry on solidity isn’t so much the wobble around the tolerances between stock and tube, more the surface area for the stock to hold on to if a significant portion is taken off the tube, leading to a bit of back and forth rocking at full extension.

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