KWC M93R2 Shot Counter Problem

[Zero_DgZ]

Well, George was using my M93R2 last night and after I shot him for about the 137th time he told me that the gun wasn't working right. Said he was pulling the trigger and it wouldn't fire - hammer wouldn't fall or anything.

 

So I took the thing home and messed with it and I determined that semi- and full auto modes worked just fine, but three shot burst mode was where the problem manifested. After firing the burst and sometimes a shot or two more, the gun ends the burst with the hammer cocked as it is supposed to, but pulling the trigger doesn't do anything. Playing with the slide and pulling the trigger a bunch eventually cures it.

 

Well, that's sort of weird.

 

So I took it apart and fiddled with simulating firing cycles and this is what I determined: The shot counter ratchet (that's what I'm calling it, it's the toothed gizmo that engages the trigger lever and has the two ratchet fingers engage it) is hopping off the little hook on the end of the trigger lever at the end of the firing cycle. Then, when I let go of the trigger, the lever pulls forward without the ratchet hooked to it and the gun won't fire until it gets bumped around enough with the trigger back for it to re-hook the ratchet.

 

I'll post pictures later, I have to go to work in about two minutes at the moment. Forr now, my questions.

 

First: What the eff? Neither the ratchet nor the lever look worn or damaged. What do you figure could be causing this?

 

Second: Anybody know a place to get replacement M93R2 parts? I guess a new trigger lever, a new ratchet, and maybe some new springs would be in order?

[Zero_DgZ]

Well, I finally got around to taking the pigging thing apart to try to see what's wrong with it.

 

Lots of giant photos will follow. Thou hath been warned.

 

 

 

This is the mechanism at rest, with the hammer down and the trigger forward.

 

 

 

With the hammer cocked and a round chambered. Not much difference.

 

 

 

This is after pulling the trigger and firing the first shot.

 

 

 

After allowing the slide to recoil, come forward, and bring the hammer down on the second shot...

 

 

 

Allowing the slide to recoil, come forward, and fire the third shot...

 

 

 

...And then the triger linkage jumps out of the ratchet. Grah! Why?

[Zero_DgZ]

So, I took it to bits. And I discovered that the ratchet itself is bent outwards, as displayed below:

 

 

 

So I bent it straight and it still does it. So I bent it concave the other way and it still does it. So I lubed the hell out of everything and it still bloody does it.

 

I don't get it. Should I chance bending the trigger linkage outwards more? I think it will interfere with the grips and the teardrop shaped selector doohickey if I do. I'm still stumped and looking for input, I guess.

 

If I can't figure it out, I'll sell this thing and both magazines for parts to the first party who wants it.

[directorcass]

I'll have to take mine apart and look, but it looks like all your stuff is there and in the right place. I would check the underside of the grip panel as this is what holds everything in place. The underside of the panel may be worn or chipped.

[Zero_DgZ]

The inside of the grip looks just fine. On close inspection, the little hook on the end of the trigger linkage may be worn, but I can't imagine how. Part of its black paint is rubbed off, at least, and some of the metal could have been taken with it, I guess.

[Zero_DgZ]

Well, no amount of fiddling I've done with the thing seems to cure the problem. I think I need a new trigger linkage.

 

I take it nobody knows where to get KSC/KWC parts? I found KSC's webpage, but it is in Japanese and I no speaka. Redwolf doesn't seem to have anything, WCG doesn't have anything, Shorty's doesn't have anything... And KSC doesn't have anyone who speaks English who will reply to my emails.

[Mr._Hitman]

Ok, i'm new to the site, but i may be able to help. I recently had to fix my KSC M93R II because the hammer jammed. Here's what i foud out:

 

1. PARTS: If anything liiks broken, jsut buy a replacement part off of the manufacturers, at this site:

http://www.uncompany.com

Search for M93R II

 

The parts that look like they're givin you trouble are these:

KSC M93R II Part No.604 (Counter Catch)

KSC M93R II Part No.601 (Ratched Shot Counter)

KSC M93R II Part No.596 (Eagle Head Hook, moves when u change the fire setting)

 

Now, to FIX the problem, rather than replacing it, i would recommend that you make SURE that the bronze collored screw (Directly above the Eagle Head Hook) is tight enough to make sure that it doesn't let the eagle head hook piece slip off the counter. Also, make sure the springs that hold these pieces in place are in the Stock cover correctly, and the pieces are lined up well when you put it back 2gether. Hold it down with a flathead screwdriver or something.

If the Eagle headed hook is not staying down no matter how hard you tighen the bronze screw (dont overtighten), then you've gotta disassemble the piece that it's on and tighen the pieces down so it can't "swing outward" and away from the gun.

 

Hope this helps! By the way, do you still have the manual? (mine didn't come with one.) If you do, and there's a diagram in it, that may help. I'd liek 2 see it, too. (i gotta get the shot selector and the safty swithes back on the catches they belong on.) Thanks!

[Zero_DgZ]

...He said, after I gave up and sold it. I do salute you for finally turning up those parts, though. I was slowly driving myself insane.

 

I guess I ought to forward this to the guy I sold the gun to.

[PlasticMag]

Thanks... I already am aware of it and have the parts inbound, as I've repaired this type of gun before.

 

It's a *badgeress* to do if you get it wrong, as I've found out, because the more you mess with it the more you need to replace (from experience - I ended up spending $175 to fix up the M93R II that I repaired because I botched it the first time). I've ordered the replacement parts because it looks like I've got about $65 in parts (with shipping) to fix up for now.