Attn: Marui DE Hardkick owner required.

[kronic]

Any chance of a picture of the under sid of the slide?

[Hissing_Sid]

Perhaps when you just cock the hammer, after inserting a magazine, the firing pin is yet to seat itself on the release valve. When the slide moves back it toggles the pin back, so when it moves forward again it seats perfectly on the release valve.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm pretty sure that IS what's happening but I'm just buggered if I ca see what bit is actually making it happen.

From playing with the gun with the slide off it seems that cocking the hammer with my thumb does exactly the same as cocking it by racking the slide.

 

Anyway, here's a pic of the top half.

 

 

You can see that the mechanism is VERY simple compared to something like a USP.

 

Basically, the trigger bar hooks around a sear (as it is in the pic) and fires the gun when it's pulled forward. The safety pushes a little bar downward which pushes the trigger bar down so it sits underneath the sear and can't touch it when the gun is on safe.

 

Other than that, the only doohickies are the two angles plates on the sides of the trigger bar. These just move against the inside of the slide to press the trigger-bar down so the trigger won't work while the slide is cycling. It's these bits you'd need to remove for full-auto-ness.

 

Beyond that, there's nothing else to the DE firing mechanism. It's something to do with the position of the striker, as ZIP3400 says, but I just can't see what makes it differentiate between the slide racking and the hammer cocking manually.

[Outlaw of Torn]

Just thought I would say something:

 

I can cock my marui Desert Eagle just by pulling the hammer back. I can then pull the trigger and the slide cycles, which loads the first round into the chamber. Second trigger pull actually fires a BB.

 

Thats really strange that they are different. Mine is a Marui Desert Eagle .50 Hardkick GBB, and I bought it in febuary (i think). The internal machanism is the sames as in the pics.

 

TORN

[Outlaw of Torn]

Here is a video I shot. I loaded the gun with three ICS .20 BBs, and I am using Cybergun APS3 Blowback Gas.

 

Click here to watch MVI_197669

 

I hope that helps

[azz]

And the gun was fully de-cocked as mentioned in sids' first post?

 

If so the plot thickens

[Outlaw of Torn]

Yep, the gun was fully de-cocked. That is really strange. Did the video work?

[gazchap]

Mine isn't a hardkick, but I'll give it a shot tonight and report back

[snowman]

Perhaps it's another intermittent thing, like the grip safety on Hi-Capas?

 

Cheers.

[directorcass]

I just tried mine (chrome Hard Kick, 1 year old). Mine fires from a fully decocked position with thumb cocking of the hammer. It does this with bb's in the mag and without bb's in the mag. It also fires with and without a bb chambered. I tried every way I could from a decocked position and it fired every time. So...

[Outlaw of Torn]

Maybe something changed about them at different times, when did you get yours, directorcass? Or maybe age has something to do with it?

 

TORN

[kronic]

You are cocking it with NO mag in, the inserting the mag aren't you?

[Outlaw of Torn]

No, I put the mag in, then thumb cock it. The mag is inserted when the gun is cocked. Not that it makes any difference.

[Jimxorb]

With my desert eagle you can either cock it or pull the hammer back with your thumb to cock it, it has a 2 stage hammer. I'll have to check what happens when u cock the gun before inserting the magazine.

[kronic]

No, I put the mag in, then thumb cock it.  The mag is inserted when the gun is cocked.  Not that it makes any difference.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

read orignial post wrong.. my bad

[directorcass]

I did both. From a decocked position I thumb cocked it with a mag, and without a mag. I did this also with and without bb's. Same result, every time the hammer dropped, the gun fired. I don't remember the exact month that I ordered my D.E. but I've had it about a year.

[El_Hombre]

I don't have the Eagle, but doesn't a separate internal and external hammer mean you can't just let the hammer down on a mag by holding it with your finger? If you tried I can just see it firing anyway and giving you a nice surprise on your finger.

 

Edit: ^^^In order to decock it.

[Zip3400]

With most GBBs you can still lower the hammer, it just must be done slowly. The hammer spring doesn't have enough power to open the valve while just sitting there.

[Ghost_Rider]

With most GBBs you can still lower the hammer, it just must be done slowly. The hammer spring doesn't have enough power to open the valve while just sitting there.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Sorry dude, not neccesarily true.

 

On both the tm Hi-capa and the Deagle you cannot lower the hammer with a mag inserted without the gun discharging.

 

You do have to take the mag out, pull the trigger, and re-insert the mag to carry the gun de-cocked with a round chambered.

[gazchap]

Where's Gazchap, cos he could tall us if his... whatever it is DE does this.

Doesn't fire with Hissing Sid's test, or with yours.

 

Gotta rack the slide to get it to fire.

 

//edit: And 15rds max. in the mag.

[CZFan]

some guns have a little lever that the slide presses and closes and this enables the magazine valve to be hit when the hammer is dropped.

 

not sure about the one you are asking about but look for a little notch on the frame that you can push or something.. it's weird to explain.

 

also, you need to slide the slide back since in battery, there is a hollow so the lever never gets pressed.

[Zip3400]

Sorry dude, not neccesarily true.

 

On both the tm Hi-capa and the Deagle you cannot lower the hammer with a mag inserted without the gun discharging.

 

You do have to take the mag out, pull the trigger, and re-insert the mag to carry the gun de-cocked with a round chambered.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well, I didn't say ALL GBBs

 

Perhaps newer Marui GBBs are the exception.

[Krazy L]

on higher end airsoft guns (GBB anyway) the slide has to hit the sear before it can cock. try it with KSC USPc and you will get the same results.

[AliceHKfan]

I recently found a review on the KSC USP Compact that makes mention of TM Desert Eagle not working due to it not working with a "direct" hammer but a "rocker assembly".

 

Link of the KSC USPC review

 

I dunno if this helps at all....and sorry to kick a dead horse if already settled

[Catchv22]

I think I figured this out on the KSC USPc and maybe it has to do with the 'rocker assembly' in the above post and link. The link doesn't go into what the 'rocker assembly' is exactly. My theory is that it works on the same principle as the WA GBB hammer system, which gives it more kick than the previous KSC GBBs I've seen (M9/Glock). Basically, the firing pin is not retracted and will continue to release gas into the blowback process until the slide recoils. This is replicated on the WA hammer system with the 'annoying magazine valve latch' that keeps the flow valve open.

 

Take off the slide of your KSC USPc and then insert the magazine. Notice if your gun is fully decocked but not 'half cocked' the firing pin is angled upward. Manually cocking the hammer will keep the hammer angled upward as to not release the gas from the magazine and fire a shot. If you pull the trigger without racking the slide, actuating the bit that retracts the firing pin. The pin will always be above the flow valve and never fire. However if you rack the slide once, the nub is activated and the firing pin will retract into a ready position, aligned correctly with the flow valve.

 

Does this information apply to the Desert Eagle as well?

 

P.S. KWA USPc is a pretty nice little gun. Too bad I hate compacts.

[Cynan]

Cocking the hammer to the half-cocked posistion will not fire/cycle the gun with either a mag in, or inserted after it's cocked. If I cock the hammer fully then it will fire/cycle either way.

 

Checking the mechanism it dis working as Catchv22 describes, which is when the mag is inserted it pushes up the firing pin, which is attached to the hammer. Cocking the hammer fully though is enought to let the pin fall down and position itself behind the gas release value.

 

Maybe on the guns that don't fire when it's been fully cocked is just down to poor quality control of the firing pin assembley and some are in fact longer (or shorter) then they should be. For the guns that only fire when the slide is racked I'm expecting the slide to /force/ the firing pin down even though it's slightly too long for when the gun is just cocked.

 

Anyone want to go the distance and take masurements?