My eye! Sweet Jesus, Ouch!

[hitmanNo2]

I think what would be interesting is to organize driving course type days where you gradually get drunk and complete the same course (closed and supervised etc) whilst being monitored and evaluated, seeing your compromised reaction times etc.

Of course I don't intend for the 'look, I've had 5 beers and I'm fine' brigade to use it as justification of their actions.  I just think it would be fascinating.

[shmook]

25 minutes ago, Hedganian said:

That seems reasonable.

What people seem to forget is that different people are affected by alcohol more than others, but the same limit applies to everyone.

One person could be under the legal limit but totally unfit to be in control of anything more dangerous than a dinky car. Another could be over the limit but still in control of themselves.

It's well established that even a small amount of alcohol will impair a driver's reactions, and too many people are dangerous enough while stone-cold sober.

Admittedly, I'm not looking at it from a 'how hard this would be to enforce' standpoint, I accept that.

It just seems wrong to me that someone could blow "just under" the limit and be allowed to proceed - when in reality they're not safe to be behind the wheel.

That's the law though... A limit must be set. Even for the same person, the same amount of alcohol can affect them differently from one day to the next. Food, fatigue etc means it can hit diffently, but a uniform limit must be applied. I don't know how it can be policed differently tbh. 

I also read today that a test has been developed to measure tiredness, which can be just as bad as alcohol. You should have seen the frothing in the comments section of the daily fail... 

Hitman, wasn't that done on TV a few years ago? I think it was, anyway 😃

[Hedganian]

Mythbusters did it, but it wasn't their most scientific test ever...

I realise there has to be a legal limit - what I'm saying is that in my opinion it's too high.

[shmook]

I think it was done in the UK too. 

As for the limit, I honestly don't know. Cleverer people than me still deem it to be fair. 

To divert the subject a bit, drug driving is far more prevalent now too. Testing is expensive though, so convictions are far lower than pissy drive. A drug wipe test costs the force around £20, and it's single use. That will come down in time, as all things do, but the amount of drug driving that goes on is truly shocking. 

[Hedganian]

Anyone convicted should lose their car. That might make them think twice.

[shmook]

Wholly agree with that. There isn't enough of a deterrent at the moment, as thousands of people still do it. 

[sandstorm]

Unfortunately, it'd not really stop them. Rich folks and their lawyers could abuse every loophole until it oinked like a pig. Or just use leased or company owned cars. And poor people would just use 'stolen' cars. And then the lawyers would get the law tossed because confiscating 'stolen' vehicles would off insurance companies. The biggest problem is the public perception that drunk driving is somehow 'minor misdemeanor'. If the public image was to change so that drunk driving makes you a complete social pariah, it'd quickly go down a lot. But public opinion is hard to change, when it's not felt personally. Then it turns into pound of flesh for each once lost.

[shmook]

Leases could be re-worded so you are still liable to pay, even though the car is seized. 'Poor' people wouldn't use stolen cars just to drive back from the pub drunk, they would do what scrotes do now and buy a pool car or just get a cheap shed of a vehicle and run it untaxed and uninsured until it got seized and buy another. 

Drink drive is more frowned upon now than it ever was. Even in my 20 odd years of driving, I've noticed this, but I agree that it is still seen as socially acceptable and that's the biggest struggle to change, as you said. 

I think the public would back new powers like these, and I think it would stop a good amount of drink drive. 

[DrAlexanderTobacco]

Can't wait for fully autonomous cars tbh, even if that's maybe a good 10-20 years away. Imagine going down for bevs and stumbling back into your car, mumbling "Hooooooooome" and throwing up everywhere as it whizzes back. 

[Hedganian]

Pretty sure that would still be "drunk in charge of a vehicle" at least...

[hitmanNo2]

I think by the time of properly autonomous cars, the laws will be updated to reflect the minimal input of a Human needed.  I mean, these cars will probably end up not even having steering wheels.  I reckon you'll be able to get smashed and have it drive you home no problem.     Via the local kebab van of course.

[DrAlexanderTobacco]

Yeah exactly - "Bleep bloop internal sensors have detected alcohol in your breath sir, activating taxi mode" - it's a long way off but will be good once it's here.

[shmook]

Until you wake up in it hungover, having slept horribly in a car seat and covered in puke. 

'drunk mode' should also include deploying one of those Boston dynamics robot dogs to drag you in to your house too! 

[hitmanNo2]

Maybe in peasant spec.  Get one with seats that fully recline. Just imagine being able to have your car drive to Italy or somewhere overnight, whilst you have a sleep.  Wake up nice and refreshed.

As for the puke.  You'll probably be able to press a button on your phone and it'll drive itself to a valet whilst you're at work and come back nice and clean.

[shmook]

It would have to stop to charge every 250 miles so would take a while to get to Italy! 

[hitmanNo2]

I would hope by then we are not still hung up on silly electric cars and something superior like hydrogen power has been fully developed.  Even now they have decent range and 5 mins to refill.

If that or another alternative power source hasn't been sorted, I would hope for hot swap-able batteries or conductive road surfaces or something.  All automated of course.

[Hedganian]

Nothing silly about electric cars - just look at how far the range, charging time and performance has increased even in the last decade.

Hydrogen cars would be fine - it's all well and good to use hydrogen to fuel a vehicle but you have to consider where the hydrogen comes from. To create hydrogen fuel from water requires more energy than you release by burning the hydrogen in air, so you need to get that energy from somewhere.

It's no different to electric cars or petrol for that matter, in that sense, you still need to have a power infrastructure to support it. Once the fossils fuels are gone, hydrogen cars and nuclear power stations are going to be the way forward.

[Hardcore1-6]

2 hours ago, hitmanNo2 said:

Just imagine being able to have your car drive to Italy or somewhere overnight, whilst you have a sleep.  Wake up nice and refreshed.

Have you heard about trains and planes?

[sandstorm]

Currently, the cost-efficient way to produce hydrogen at industrial scale starts from crude oil. To be honest, I am scared of the end of fossil fuels, and the chaos it will cause. So much of chemical industry is based on cheap oil, that when oil prices start rising, it'll get ugly and messy fast.

[DrAlexanderTobacco]

Geologists have massively cooled off on the concept of peak oil tbh - The initial scare in the 70s was mostly down to rigs using the same extraction techniques they'd been using for the last century in the same rough locations - Since then there's been a massive boom in oil exploration initiatives, ways to extract etc. Price fluctuations for the next few decades will mostly be down to OPEC controlling supply. 

 

At the same time investment into renewables is proceeding very nicely so hopefully they'll cancel each other out over time.

[hitmanNo2]

1 hour ago, Hardcore1-6 said:

Have you heard about trains and planes?

Have you heard of Stelvio Pass or  Route Napoleon or Transfagarasan?

I'd much rather do those in my own car than a rental.

[Tw1tch]

From my understanding Big Oil have already done an awful lot of research into developing fossil fuel alternatives, they just want to exploit the fossil fuels first.

[scorch]

2 hours ago, hitmanNo2 said:

Have you heard of Stelvio Pass or  Route Napoleon or Transfagarasan?

I'd much rather do those in my own car than a rental.

Bike. Those roads are for bikes.

[amateurstuntman]

Yeah, I'd love to cycle up one of those.

 

[hitmanNo2]

Horses for courses.  I'd enjoy them more in a car.