Xaccers Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 "I don't know enough" is not an excuse not to vote, get out there and find out. The one person I know who once voted BNP did so because he didn't know what any of the parties were about, couldn't be bothered to find out, and so voted for the one with British in the name! So far with MPs, I've been lucky, the party I want running the country have fielded the best candidate in my constituencey. We have a spotty 12 year old LibDem councillor, who's record in the area is not something that impresses me. In council elections, LibDems normally win, to the extent that last time round in a different area they went door to door claiming that there is no way a Tory would win so if you didn't want Labour then you'd best vote LibDem. Tory candidates won. I'll be voting against him because what he's done has been frankly pathetic (ooo a street sign had it's ivy removed), and the LibDems have a reputation for over spending and wasting our money while failing to deliver (2003: "Hey council, our new school's ceiling needs repairing." 2006: "Oh look it's collapsed because you did bugger all about it and hired shoddy workmen in the first place"). Several heads rolled (one of them straight into the mayoral position) and due to pig headedness on the LibDems' part lead to MK Council being run by unelected executives. Link to post Share on other sites
Hedganian Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Independents, not party politics. Writing to your MP or councillor is pointless if they're in a party, because they'll just carry on doing what the party tells them. Independent candidates, councillors, MPs, etc will do what THEY think is best based on what YOU (the people in the area) tell them to do, rather than what the party tells them. The British electoral system was never intended to have candidates affiliated to parties, each one is meant to follow the wishes of their constituents. Why can't people figure this out? Link to post Share on other sites
Xaccers Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 I seem to recall there were several Labour party MPs who voted against the VCR bill due to their constituents writting to them. It's Whips that should be done away with, MPs shouldn't be blackmailed into voting against their constituents. Link to post Share on other sites
Hedganian Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Yeah, every now and again you'll get some who "rebel" and don't do what they're told. But they're the exception, not the rule. No party = no party whips and no party line to follow. Of course, MPs would still form "informal" groups, but they'd be far more fluid. Link to post Share on other sites
Xaccers Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Back room deals would be rife, there'd be hardly any point to bothering to vote because your single MP has diddly squat power in government unless they happen to be a minister. The advantage of party politics is that you have a fair idea that there will be MPs in other areas who are likely to vote in the same way as your own, therefore increasing he power of your own MP. Without Whips they would be free to represent their constituents should the cabinet produce a disagreable bill. Link to post Share on other sites
Hedganian Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Except for the fact that as soon as an MP gets to London, he or she finds an "opposing" MP and they agree that since their votes would always cancel each other out, that neither of them will bother to show up. Hence we're paying them for not bothering to do their job. Their votes mean as much, if not more, than ours do. But the majority of MPs don't bother to attend debates or vote on the issues. Just like the majority of the public don't bother to vote for the MPs in the first place. Link to post Share on other sites
danielsilva Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Somewhat of a rant, i watching some old clips on youtube and thought ... What happened to Jim Carrey ?! He was actually really funny whe he was in SNL, he had some epic sketches ... now he's ######. Link to post Share on other sites
FireKnife Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Aside from Ace Ventura, the Cable Guy and the Truman Show he is ###### Doesn't take Batman Forever to work that one out. 'FireKnife' Link to post Share on other sites
Xaccers Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Except for the fact that as soon as an MP gets to London, he or she finds an "opposing" MP and they agree that since their votes would always cancel each other out, that neither of them will bother to show up. the smart one does and gets the bills through/blocked Link to post Share on other sites
Hedganian Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Ah, but while they're all lying scumbags, they have to abide by their "gentleman's agreement" or it would be just anarchy... Link to post Share on other sites
Xaccers Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Ah, but while they're all lying scumbags, they have to abide by their "gentleman's agreement" or it would be just anarchy... Not if they kept their fingers crossed. Link to post Share on other sites
danielsilva Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 Aside from Ace Ventura, the Cable Guy and the Truman Show he is ###### I don't even like those movies .... He should have just stuck to making short sketches like when on SNL. He had some EPIC sketches ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8tfuBIutLI THIS. IS. EPIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIC. *kicks* Link to post Share on other sites
FireKnife Posted April 21, 2011 Report Share Posted April 21, 2011 See now that just doesn't really work for me, and his other films, aside from the Truman Show, don't either. Though he does have his moments they are fleeting and highly exaggerated. 'FireKnife' Link to post Share on other sites
Cannonfodder80 Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 Wrong. You should vote. Everyone should vote. People fought and died to allow others the freedom to have that vote, not using it is essentially the same as spitting on their sacrifices. Appologies for going back over this but do you then believe voting should be a legal requoremen?. IMO if you don't like any of the candidates then surely being forced to vote for a party/candidate you don't want goes against the freedom to make your own decisions and isn't very democratic My rant for today: my chavy neighbour having another ###### up argument with her boyfriend. At least the police wern't needed this time Link to post Share on other sites
Hedganian Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 No, I don't think it should be illegal not to vote. But I think that anyone who doesn't vote is a disrespectful piece of *suitcase* who really needs to take a look at themselves and the world around them and wonder why they're not using the only tiny bit of power they have at the same time as they invalidate the sacrifices of all the people who struggled to get them that bit of power. BTW, voting isn't about liking the candidates, it's about choosing the one you think will do the best job (or the one you think will do the least worst job, in most cases) While we're considering changing the election system, I think we should separate the Governmental and MP elections, to create a system more like the US where you can vote directly for who you want to be Prime Minister. See, while the best choice for my local MP might be a Tory bloke, I might not want the Cameron to run the country, so under the current system I either have to vote for someone to represent me who I don't think is the best choice, or accept that if I vote for the best guy in my area, I'm helping someone I don't want into power. And that's wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
amateurstuntman Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 You've said this a lot but not voting is a choice and apathy is sending a message. Why should the vote of a person to whom politics is the most important thing in the world (or somebody with your beliefs) count the same as somebody who doesn't give a ######. By not voting you are sending the message that you think it is futile because they are all cookie cutter *Ubarflock*, you are also avoiding polluting the vote with your ill-informed and ignorant vote. If you don't care about voting then your vote is going to be basically random or based on your favourite colour, you might be cancelling out the vote of somebody who really passionately cares about the voting system. Yes, people made sacrifices to get us where we are but where we are isn't just who do we vote for. It is a culture where we can choose to vote for a candidate or not to vote at all. That is real freedom. Link to post Share on other sites
Hedganian Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 The man makes a good point. The freedom to choose is the only real freedom anyone has. Use that freedom - make up your own mind. Personally, I think that if the people making those sacrifices could see where we've ended up so far, they'd be pretty unhappy with the whole thing. Link to post Share on other sites
Cannonfodder80 Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 True, but I believe that some people not voting would be a long way down their list of what is wrong with society today Link to post Share on other sites
Hedganian Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 It's part of the same thing. These people don't care about society; about doing well, having a good job, working hard, achieving anything worthwhile, etc, etc... So they're not going to vote for anything other than the X-Factor or whatever mindless drivel they follow at the time. Large issues don't mean anything to them, they're only bothered about the next dole payment, next bottle of booze, pack of fags or illegal drug purchase. Link to post Share on other sites
ED-SKaR Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 Billy Connelly joke there. Always good to credit quotes. Sorry to delve back several pages but i missed this last time, The quote is a LOT older than Connelly. Link to post Share on other sites
FireKnife Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 It's part of the same thing. These people don't care about society; about doing well, having a good job, working hard, achieving anything worthwhile, etc, etc... Too bad this statement makes up at least 75% of the British community. If only it was the other way round things might be a bit better in the UK. 'FireKnife' Link to post Share on other sites
amateurstuntman Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 It's part of the same thing. These people don't care about society; about doing well, having a good job, working hard, achieving anything worthwhile, etc, etc... Hmmm I don't usually vote, as I have stated I am apathetic because in a very real way the system of government in the county I live in and the particular clowns in charge of that government have no impact on my day to day life whatsoever. I have achieved many things that I consider worthwhile, I work hard, I have a good job and I have got a very good standard of living. I am doing 4 of the 5 things in your list but I don't care about society, sorry but society is made of people and I don't like people. There will always be somewhere for me to go if I decide that the people who are running the country are starting to mess things up for me. Not leaving a country that isn't working for you is laziness and inertia. Those people who died to protect our way of life would get on with me I think, enough of them were my friends before they died anyway. That I didn't is luck, pure and simple. Link to post Share on other sites
Habakure Posted April 23, 2011 Report Share Posted April 23, 2011 It's part of the same thing. These people don't care about society; about doing well, having a good job, working hard, achieving anything worthwhile, etc, etc... So they're not going to vote for anything other than the X-Factor or whatever mindless drivel they follow at the time. Large issues don't mean anything to them, they're only bothered about the next dole payment, next bottle of booze, pack of fags or illegal drug purchase. Actually, they do vote (These poeple you speak of). I find that it doesn't matter about social back ground when it comes to voting. Also, its a very closed minded view to have, if you think people on the dole, who take drugs, don't vote. Do you know these people yourself or just assuming they are all unemployed? I'm unemployed, don't get anything from the government (even though I could, I choose not too. Its called contribution based job seekers), don't take drugs and could choose to never drink again (Lets say if my doctor said so). I just like to have a drink now and again (Right now, thats twice a month). Do I watch x-factor, no friggin' way. Do I smoke? I do not and the wierd thing is, both my parents did, whilst I was growing up. Yes, I have never voted. Why? To be honest, that is my business (It would take a few few pages of arnies to make my point, much easier to do it over a pint). Oh, one more thing. I do consider myself as thick, as two short planks. Now, back to my usual, non-serious, posting style. My dog golden paws can now pee, whilst cocking his leg. Victory! An you said to get another dog hedganian, shame on you. Link to post Share on other sites
FireKnife Posted April 25, 2011 Report Share Posted April 25, 2011 My dog golden paws can now pee, whilst cocking his leg. Victory! I bet he still has other issues though Not as bad as my cat that sleeps in his toilet box when he is bored and ends up covered in dissolving cat litter. 'FireKnife' Link to post Share on other sites
Tinkerton Posted April 25, 2011 Report Share Posted April 25, 2011 Personally i'll be voting yes to AV. why? because we've had FPTP for as long as i can remember, and surely its time to give something else a try? there's no law in place that means we have to stick with AV for any length of time, and if after 5/10 years we find out its not working, we can always get FPTP/another system back in place. Also for all the people saying that not voting is a worthwhile option, you're deluded. If you dont want to vote for anyone/any party, don't *not* vote. go in a vote, but spoil it. draw cartoons or profanities on your ballot paper, at least that way you've USED your vote. Link to post Share on other sites
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