creepingfear Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 Does anyone have any more info about this here Botac Grenade as advertised on AW? I've tried having a good look on t'web and cannot find owt - http://www.airsoftwarehouse.co.uk/acatalog/Pyro_s.html I've even looked on the Botac website and couldn't find anything on there either. Does anyone have one of these and if so, what are they like? Link to post Share on other sites
mr eagle Posted October 15, 2008 Report Share Posted October 15, 2008 Looks interesting but would be cheaper running MK5's which is a pity as i could have been tempted Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Looks very nice but a bit pointless as its 10x more expensive than running 9mms in a BFG, and the actual grenade isn't much cheaper itself. It does look ace though, nice looking grenades are always tempting to me *resists temptation to order one* EDIT : Electric top for remote detonation? If they put that on their site i'm sold! Link to post Share on other sites
The Thief Lord Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Bah I despise you guys over in the UK. Pyro's and everything, we are in desperate need of those here, not the homemade abominations people pass as grenades that seriously make me fear for my life. But I guess we've gotta deal with Co2 ones for now, until we start seeing some BFG's. Link to post Share on other sites
creepingfear Posted October 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Just noticed after having another look it says pre-order, so I'm guessing nobody has one yet. The more I look at it, the more tempted I become. Granted though it does work out a tad expensive and when AW finally close their showroom doors, where would we get extra inserts from? Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Granted though it does work out a tad expensive and when AW finally close their showroom doors, where would we get extra inserts from? Thats my biggest concern too, and it may limit how many people buy it. If they do sell the remote det adaptor for it then i'll buy one and a tonne of the primers and use it as remote only, it should be a lot easier and safer than a home made system with flash maroons so for that it has its merits, otherwise i'll stick with my BFG. Looking at the primers though they do appear to have a percussion cap on them, possible to modify one to work with readily available blanks maybe? Link to post Share on other sites
creepingfear Posted October 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Based on an email I got, apparently it will be around the 15th of November when they are available and once AW closes, replacement inserts/primers will be sold by their sister company Botac. Link to post Share on other sites
pforcerecon Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 what are the chances do you guys think of us being able to get those over here? or would we need that explosives import license thing? Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Based on an email I got, apparently it will be around the 15th of November when they are available and once AW closes, replacement inserts/primers will be sold by their sister company Botac. Thats good to hear, if they get the remote dets out at a reasonable price too then i'll be after one or two Was there any mention on the DB level they give off? EDIT : what are the chances do you guys think of us being able to get those over here? or would we need that explosives import license thing? Its appears to use percussion cap primers much like the BFGs we have so i'd say yes you would need that $6000 odd licence to import them, you'd be looking at $120+ for the grenade and $6 - $8 per primer i'd imagine. Why has someone over there not got the licence and imported a huge amount of BFGs yet? Blanks are readily available over there and i bet people would snap them up even if they were $300 would they not? Link to post Share on other sites
creepingfear Posted October 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 what are the chances do you guys think of us being able to get those over here? or would we need that explosives import license thing? I would've imagined (I could be wrong though) that the grenade on it's own without any pyrotechnic charge would be OK to import into the states as it's just an inanimate object and then finding an internal source of primers, unless the States have Laws on things of a grenade shape in general, thus preventing import full stop. Rob15: No mention of any DB levels in email. How loud is a primer cap anyway? Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 No idea, on that one, hopefully not too loud though BFGs are classed as destructive devices in america so i'm guessing these will be the same. Link to post Share on other sites
creepingfear Posted October 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 http://www.botac.co.uk/ appears to be the website that will continue selling the grenades once AW closes. Link to post Share on other sites
pforcerecon Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 I'm not exactly sure, but as far as I know there isn't any law stating in regards to the looks or resemblence of a grenade looking device not be allowed importation, although in the case of the escort grenade when it first came out, I later found out at AEX they had to stop selling them because they looked too much like the real thing. But I'm sure someone out here has to have the availability or have the license in general that they can then import these nifty lil things..otherwise I just might sell myself to help fund a license now. Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Taken from the HFM Pyrotechnics website regarding the Dynatech Blank Firing Grenade "This item comes under the AECA classification of grenades and can only be exported to the USA if the importer has a FORM 6 importation license from the U.S. Department of Justice" If i remember rightly the Form 6 licence is for destructive devices so its not the appearance thats the issue, more the function, my guess is this Botac grenade will be in the same boat as it appears to use a similar system to the BFG. EDIT "Manufactured in the UK, the Botac Training Grenade was originally developed for the military and law enforcement, replicating the weight and design of a real frag. The model displayed here has been developed with the Airsoft market in mind. It incorporates the same design and materials as the military model but produces 120 decibels as appose to 180." Taken from a video on youtube > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP2M_Peuwsk 120Db is a tad loud, might be ok for outdoor use though maybe? Further EDIT As it appears to hit the percussion cap immediatly use of normal blanks definatly won't be possible and they've at least put the lever on a hinge to prevent it getting lost Link to post Share on other sites
Deano3006 Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 shame you have to buy those parts every time i want a cheap re-useable one like a dynatec Link to post Share on other sites
creepingfear Posted October 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Taken from the HFM Pyrotechnics website regarding the Dynatech Blank Firing Grenade "This item comes under the AECA classification of grenades and can only be exported to the USA if the importer has a FORM 6 importation license from the U.S. Department of Justice" If i remember rightly the Form 6 licence is for destructive devices so its not the appearance thats the issue, more the function, my guess is this Botac grenade will be in the same boat as it appears to use a similar system to the BFG. EDIT "Manufactured in the UK, the Botac Training Grenade was originally developed for the military and law enforcement, replicating the weight and design of a real frag. The model displayed here has been developed with the Airsoft market in mind. It incorporates the same design and materials as the military model but produces 120 decibels as appose to 180." Taken from a video on youtube > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP2M_Peuwsk 120Db is a tad loud, might be ok for outdoor use though maybe? Further EDIT As it appears to hit the percussion cap immediatly use of normal blanks definatly won't be possible and they've at least put the lever on a hinge to prevent it getting lost Nice one Rob15! I gave up looking for more info on it and never thought of looking on Youtube. Seeing the Botac Grenade function certainly makes me drool even. That's it, I'm sold! Nasty little burn mark though at the end of the video. Taken from a video on youtube > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TP2M_Peuwsk Is Niiiiiice! :D :D Link to post Share on other sites
Rob15 Posted October 16, 2008 Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 That's it, I'm sold! Nasty little burn mark though at the end of the video. Well to be fair, if you let off a BFG, Mk5, Thermobaric or smoke grenade they'll all leave burn marks on something i've found, you just use them in the hope that they don't go off and burn someone instead of the ground :S They're also available for pre-order here http://airsofthavoc.co.uk/store/index.php?...products_id=112 Same price as Airsoft Warehouse, i'd be tempted to get it from there though as they should be going for some time past AW's closure. Hopefully these will be successfull enough for Botac to produce slightly quieter and even better, cheaper primers for them Fingers crossed! Link to post Share on other sites
creepingfear Posted October 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2008 Looks like there's going to be quite a few selling these things fairly soon then. Does anyone actually know who Botac is? What other stuff do they sell? Link to post Share on other sites
Vogelsang Posted October 17, 2008 Report Share Posted October 17, 2008 Looks like there's going to be quite a few selling these things fairly soon then. Does anyone actually know who Botac is? What other stuff do they sell? Creepingfear - maybe your paranoia will subside now - YOU could have trialed this baby - but you didn't answer my PM positively...... remember? Eh? How can dialogue be beneficial to me? I'm not really sure what you're after. To answer your questions. The Botac Unit uses a disposable insert. This insert causes the grenade to function like a real grenade - Those brought up on a diet of action movies and who have never thrown a real grenade will never have heard the primer "Snap" which initiates a delay fuse...... maybe it's just not moviegenic to have the little crack...... That aside, twqst the pin to unlock it, remove pin. Throw grenade, lever is sprung off, striker hits primer, primer lights fuse, fuse burns and then sound unit initiates going BANG! The Botac Grenade will continue to be sold after AW closes. Pyrotechnics ARE available in the US from Ricochet North America - Ricochet North America LLC 5720 W 79th St Indianapolis Indiana 46278 United States http://www.ricochetdirect.com/ Link to post Share on other sites
cracking day Posted October 17, 2008 Report Share Posted October 17, 2008 http://www.lexpev.nl/grenades/europe/unitedkingdom/l111.html All ideas are copied. Link to post Share on other sites
Vogelsang Posted October 17, 2008 Report Share Posted October 17, 2008 http://www.lexpev.nl/grenades/europe/unitedkingdom/l111.html All ideas are copied. Ah! The RUAG! Want to buy some? RUAGS are proper big boys toys aren't they? Bit loud for airsoft though. And heavy. So yeah - no one said the Botac was an original - it is however built "down" to airsoft level..... and - despite people's deep breaths - to a price. The Botac is just ONE of a family of devices for professional, military and police training. Versions have been made for airsoft use. And as the RUAG unit is a proprietary device the Botac sound unit differs subtley. Had I made the demo video I would have laid the unit on the ground. The resulting liftoff makes it look as though the grenade body disintegrates...... when in fact it remains intact and is heavy enough not to leap around when used normally. Good vision of how it takes apart for cleaning though. There are those out there who will never be satisfied - The Botac will fill one gap in the market and satisfy a section of the community. As the old saying goes - You pays yer money... Yer makes yer choice. Link to post Share on other sites
Catman Posted October 17, 2008 Report Share Posted October 17, 2008 I'm really tempted by this grenade - I wonder who makes the pyro refills? I think if the pyro bits were cheaper this would do very well but going off those prices (£2.85) I get TLSFX/Spectrum* ball grenades for £2.50, and I don't have to go looking for them after they been used. I'm certainly drawn to it because of it's realistic operation but really those prices need to come down for me to buy into it. *though Spectrum are a bunch of utterly useless ****ers to deal with Link to post Share on other sites
Clot Posted October 17, 2008 Report Share Posted October 17, 2008 I said this on airsofters. Looks mega frosty, but the priiiiiiice of the fuses! I dont use much pyro just now, but when I do. its 1.50 a pop mk5's. If these fuses were 1-1.50 max, id have bought it by now. Seems to have the same probs as that thumper thing, too expensive to use per bang! Link to post Share on other sites
creepingfear Posted October 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2008 Creepingfear - maybe your paranoia will subside now - YOU could have trialed this baby - but you didn't answer my PM positively...... remember? Eh? How can dialogue be beneficial to me? I'm not really sure what you're after. *cogs and gears begin to whir inside brain to access memory protocols* Ah that'll be my PM'd response to that PM you originally sent me (as quoted below). What do you expect when sending someone a PM like that out of the blue and sounding like something out of a cloak and daggers novel? The idea of PM's is to be able to write something in a more private setting ect. Vogelsang TLSFX/Spectrum, Mar 7 2008, 04:25 AM Been reading your posts to Mister Mulvahill...... (Spectrum) Drop me a line would you...... I don't think you're one of "TLSFX Little helpers" - but striking up a dialogue with me might be beneficial to you. wink.gif Kind regards Vogelsang Still, thats by the by. What you've got there certainly looks impressive *doffs cap*. It's about bloody time we had a grenade that does what it says on the tin. So is Botac something you've established yourself or is it just the construction/testing of the grenade that you've done. If Botac is yours full stop, what other stuff do you make/sell? Oh, lastly. Any chance of there being a Mk9 version? Added: There are those out there who will never be satisfied - The Botac will fill one gap in the market and satisfy a section of the community. As the old saying goes - You pays yer money... Yer makes yer choice. Oh I think the Botac will be satisfying my bloodlust! Link to post Share on other sites
Catman Posted October 17, 2008 Report Share Posted October 17, 2008 Oh lol if it's Spectrum then there's virtually no chance of getting the fuse-refills. Sure they'll be the best pyros on the market but what use is that when they're next to unobtainable? I gave up trying to deal with Spectrum, I can only conclude they have absolutely no desire whatsoever to make sales. Now the club-orders for £800-1000 every few months go to TLSFX, they have people that respond to emails and answer the phone. P***ed off? Yes, I am. Link to post Share on other sites
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