Renin Posted February 24, 2012 Report Share Posted February 24, 2012 Will do. Small update, Airsoft GI just released some images on Facebook of what they are calling their exclusive "Danger Werx VSR-10 High Engagement Hop Up Lever". Have a look: It's not listed for sale yet, but it's going to be a welcome addition to the small selection of M28 upgrades! Link to post Share on other sites
DRAGON64 Posted February 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 That is a good find, and a welcome addition to the slow growing list of mods for this rifle. Link to post Share on other sites
DRAGON64 Posted February 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2012 I would get both for starters. Then try and find a way to make a good hop-up unit fit the barrel. Link to post Share on other sites
243AI Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 I picked up an M28 a few weeks ago to see what all the fuss was about (likes and dislikes). Before taking it apart I ran it through the chrono to see what it would do. Using .20 Matrix bbs it shot 550-558 fps (18 shots) and 498-508 fps with King Arms .25 bbs (18 shots). Then I took it apart to see how bad the internals looked. The sears were sloppy so I shimmed it up and removed most of the slop. I also filed a slight concave into the the piston sear that will force the sear and piston to stay centered with each other better even with a little slop. I noticed there were scratches on the outside of the bolt tube and thought it was contacting the receiver when it was being charged because of the bolt being a little sloppy. On closer inspection I found out that it was actually caused from dirt (from the factory) on the rear teflon guide. I fixed the slop in the bolt by adding one layer of masking tape to the outside of the rear teflon bolt guide. For the front one I had to turn it into a split ring like the rear (you only need to remove about a 1/16") and it required 2 layers of tape. Now the bolt has basically no slop and only a slight increase in friction. This is all I have been able to do so far because I do not have a lot of time to work on it but will give updates as I have them. Link to post Share on other sites
Renin Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Interesting modifications to the piston sear. When you get the chance, you should upload a few pictures of your handywork for clarity. Link to post Share on other sites
1tonne Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Hi Dragon64. I just bought one of these guns because I was reading this thread. I got up to page 10 and thought that it looked pretty good, so I purchased it. Then I carried on reading and now I am wondering if I should just sell it whlie it is new. Should I sell and get a Jing Gong Bar10 (reliable and a lot of parts. I also have a TM VSR10) or stick with the M28? If I sell it now, I would still make my money back. Even though your Matrix piston broke, would you recomend it still if it had sorbo on the end? How did the piston and the sear match up? Cheers 1Tonne Link to post Share on other sites
Renin Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 I can't speak for Dragon64, but in my opinion it all depends on what kind of person you are. If you enjoy taking things apart and like to have ongoing projects, I'd say keep it. Upgrade parts are sure to come out sooner or later, and until then there's a lot of DIY improvements you can make that seem to have basically fixed the primary issues with the rifle. If you're good with a lathe or know someone who is, then you are going to be very happy with this gun. However, I fixed up my gun with simple household supplies and experimentation, and it's functioning so much better. No slam-firing, no misfeeding issues, no more loose components, and no more tears! Link to post Share on other sites
DRAGON64 Posted March 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Hi Dragon64. I just bought one of these guns because I was reading this thread. I got up to page 10 and thought that it looked pretty good, so I purchased it. Then I carried on reading and now I am wondering if I should just sell it whlie it is new. Should I sell and get a Jing Gong Bar10 (reliable and a lot of parts. I also have a TM VSR10) or stick with the M28? If I sell it now, I would still make my money back. Even though your Matrix piston broke, would you recomend it still if it had sorbo on the end? How did the piston and the sear match up? Cheers 1Tonne Hello 1tonne - The M28 is a good rifle, definitely one of the better looking rifles on the market. You will have problems with the sears, as they are loosely built (read as no tolerence) and made from pot metal. This will be your alrgest failure point with the platform. The next may be your magazine. Other than that, the lack of upgrades for the rifle make it a rather frustrating rifle to own. knowing what I know now, and provided you decide to keep the rifle, here is what I would do first: Upgrade the trigger group with a nice set of sears from AirsoftGI, or other vender who may sell a complete sear set... see the link for the set that I currently use in my M28: http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?cPath=362_364&products_id=5951 This sear kit some with everything you need to rebuild your trigger group into a reliable performing unit. Next, and some may disagree, but down grade your spring to a 130 spring. I do not expect my sears or plastic piston to last forever on the strong spring that is supplied with the M28. What kind of performance can you expect from a lighter spring you might ask? See this video here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RdlMSg2AM4&feature=channel_video_title I don't know about you, but even with this lighter spring, the M28 can still reach out there and touch someone... This should build some reliability into the power system. Be sure to seal the bolt using simple teflon tape etc. next, I would replace the hop-up bucking with a bucking of your choice. Most any VSR bucking woulf work, I used this one from AirsoftGI: http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?cPath=362_364&products_id=7336 The stock barrel that comes with the M28 is quite satisfactory, but you can get a direct replacement from AirsoftGI, is is a 6.01 made by Masamune: http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?products_id=7577 If you have trouble with the factory magazines as I did, then get the metal magazine... personally, this platform should have come with two of these magazines as standard equipment. As for the Matrix piston... that video was not mine, and I have never installed that piston in my rifle... and never will. The ones I have read about have failed. Why? Because they do not fit, or work correctly. A Plastic piston is best for these 45 degree sears. The Matrix tries to pit a 90 degree type piston with a 45 degree sear... it works for a brief time, before ultimately failing. About the only item that may be of some use from the Matrix system, is the bolt cylinder. They seem to be made a little bit better than the factory cylinder. But I have not tried the new cylinder to confirm that theory. If you do not upgrade the sears, then at least down grade the spring. This should help with minimization of trigger sear wear and failure (slam fire). I hope this helps ease your fears a bit. many of my failures with the M28 have been easy fixes... they have cost me a little bit here and there, but my rifle is still going. I have not worked much with the M28 lately, as I found a G&G G96 on sale, and have become smitten with it's quality and performance... but that subject will have to go over to another thread, as it is not appropriate subject matter here... I digress. Let us know what you decide to do with your purchase. If you decide to keep the rifle, the post your progress here, and ask all the questions you need. Regards, D64 Link to post Share on other sites
1tonne Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Since there is no replecement Pistons, I will sell it. I wanted the gun to lend out to people so they can try out sniping and so I do not really want to have to work on the gun considering I am not going to be using it. By the way, I had a G&G L96 (Gas) and it sucked. Gas rifles are not great at sniping compared to spring. They are too inconsistant unless you have an HPA rig and even then it's not that great. My favorite current sniper is a fully laylaxed TM VSR10 (Sorry it's off topic, just want to save you the money) Link to post Share on other sites
DRAGON64 Posted March 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Since there is no replecement Pistons, I will sell it. I wanted the gun to lend out to people so they can try out sniping and so I do not really want to have to work on the gun considering I am not going to be using it. By the way, I had a G&G L96 (Gas) and it sucked. Gas rifles are not great at sniping compared to spring. They are too inconsistant unless you have an HPA rig and even then it's not that great. My favorite current sniper is a fully laylaxed TM VSR10 (Sorry it's off topic, just want to save you the money) Thank you for the well constructed response... Link to post Share on other sites
1tonne Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Me again. I sold my M28 and purchased a Jing Gong Bar-10. I have to say that the quality of the JG is way better than the M28. Over the years that I have been playing I have now purchased 7 different snipers (Tokyo Marui VSR-10, Echo1 M28, Well VSR-10, G&G L96gas (Not very accurate), Double Eagle M50A, a Well APS MB06A and now and a JG Bar-10) and I now believe that the Jing Gong is the best value for money sniper. The Tokyo Marui is the best quality but it is too expensive. Qualitywise for the Tokyo Marui I would rate it a 10/10. G&G L96gas 8.5/10. Jing Gong Bar10 is 8/10. Echo1 M28 6/10. Well VSR-10 5/10. Double Eagle M50A 4.5/10. Well APS MB06A 4/10. Just thought I would post this as a lot of people cannot make their mind up as to which has the better quality. Link to post Share on other sites
Renin Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 How does the out-of-the-box performance of the JG compare? How's the accuracy, range, and consistancy? Link to post Share on other sites
1tonne Posted March 25, 2012 Report Share Posted March 25, 2012 Out of the box the standard Bar-10 is only about 420fps but you can cut off the airbreak to take it up to 480fps. Our club limit is 500fps and so it does not really need anything extra. Although I put in a zero trigger, a spring guide and a M170 spring to take it to 507fps (They will let me off the 7fps extra). It is just as accurate as my fully Laylaxed Tokyo Marui VSR-10. By the way, I ordered another sniper last night. A JG Bar-10 Gspec. The G-spec has a much better bolt handle. The standard VSR or Bar-10's bolt handle is at an awkward angle so that as you cock it your fingers may hit the scope. This makes me think that if someone is to purchase a Bar-10 they would be better of getting the G-Spec Model. Then cut the airbreak and put in a longer barrel that extends into the silencer to get more FPS. The barrel would have to be longer than the standard model (Standard model VSR-10 has a barrel of 430mm which produces up to 480fps with airsbreak cut off). If you purchase a barrel longer than 430mm, then this should give you extra FPS putting you up to 500-520fps (This is on the stock spring). The G-spec can take a barrel up to 510mm without going out the end of the silencer. Don't go any longer. When I get a longer barrel, I will let you know how I get on. (Will be about a months time as I have run the coffers dry) By the way, the VSR/Bar-10's cylinder can easily handle a longer barrel as the cyclinder is not ported very well. It has a lot of excess air. By putting in a longer barrel, this excess air will be used up makeing the gun quiter So Bar-10, minus airbreak, plus 510mm barrel = 500-520fps. So this upgrade is only the cost of a barrel. Link to post Share on other sites
Ranger4688 Posted March 26, 2012 Report Share Posted March 26, 2012 I am considering picking up the M28 tomorrow around noonish for $80 and it comes with 5 mags.. "not sure if they are metal or plastic but it was told to me that it misfeeds/misfires.. should I not get it? I have an old socom gear R700 laying around someplace but lost the hopup chamber. First thing I planned to do was change to a weaker spring asap! After reading this thread I am sorta afraid to get it now and just get something else,lmao.. but I love love love the way it looks!! I am pretty crafty and should be able to fix it up but dont wanna get out a loan on the house to get all the upgrades needed,lol.. **edit** I love the stock so much,that alone is "almost" worth the $80 not to mention I think hes leaving a scope on it. If worse come to worse I just jimmy the R700 to fit the M28 stock.. Link to post Share on other sites
Ranger4688 Posted March 27, 2012 Report Share Posted March 27, 2012 I am sorry for a double post everyone.. I got the m28 today and it shoots far as heck I must say! But the mags need to pushed up while cocking for it to feed otherwise its all dry fires.. I opened it up and inspected the magwell where the mag clicks into the slot. That dang slot is way way too big and causes the mag to sit in the lowest part of the slot.. "due to the mags spring on the top." I cant post pics till tomorrow cause I am on my phone cause the wife is on he super duper important facebook games,lol.. I have a solution in mind and will get on it in the morning and show all the pics for others to see. Also this thing came with a sweet hopup mod done as well.. so I will post pics of that too.. I saw your youtube vid, Dragon.. was a few days before I joined these forums and saw all them g darn dry fires you had.. almost made me not get this rifle,I felt the frustration for ya bro! I truly hope this idea I have works for you,and everyone else who has this issue. I will try to edit this post so I dont make too many posts in a row though. Link to post Share on other sites
Ranger4688 Posted March 28, 2012 Report Share Posted March 28, 2012 Ok guys and girls! the moment a few of us have been waiting for,lol.. This is how I solved my M28's misfeed issue. Here are the pics I took. As we can see this is the metal magwell from the m28. the slot is way to bit,nearlt double the size it should be so I used some good ole JB weld stick,mashed it into the slot and slowly started digging away the excess putty so cover only half the slot. Now the mags were NEVER the problem,it was the magwell.. Now that I have done this I have to push in my mag with a little force at first but nothing too tough,lol.. I took it outside for test shots and it fed EVERY SINGLE TIME! YAY!!! I still swapped out the spring to one from my old Socom Gear R700 and its a much easier bolt pull and still get amazing 200 ft shots hitting my neighbors tree.. Its sooooo dang windy up here so I cannot dial in my scope or judge precision shots but I can hit this tree "its as big around as a person or slightly larger" at 200ft 8 out of 10 shots! Link to post Share on other sites
DRAGON64 Posted June 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2012 Alright wake M28 fans... Would you be interested in obtaining a replacement piston for your M28 rifle? A custom piston? I do not have all of the details, as the plans are in infancy, but if you go to the Airsoft Sniper Forum, there is a thread started by "Cheese Man" who is asking for buyers of a new piston, so that he can have custom pistons made. Here is the link to the forum: http://www.airsoftsniperforum.com/index.php If you do not already have an account there, then get one! The forum is dedicated to Airsoft Snipers only. The thread in the Airsoft Sniper Forum resides in the Commerce section, under the For Sale sub forum. Here is a link if you are already a member: http://www.airsoftsniperforum.com/showthread.php?t=4271 Link to post Share on other sites
mimesis Posted June 19, 2012 Report Share Posted June 19, 2012 New precision inner barrel and bucking. Might be better than what ASGI was offering. http://www.falcon-tw.com.tw/products.asp Link to post Share on other sites
Ranger4688 Posted July 26, 2012 Report Share Posted July 26, 2012 Since them pistons were never made, I have a buddy who who is making them. If your interested in an M28 piston, pm me. I will have my prototype piston in a day or two. Link to post Share on other sites
Petieyque Posted September 23, 2012 Report Share Posted September 23, 2012 Hi. I have been helping my son and his friends fix their guns. My son traded his working l96 for a M28 that slam fired. After inspecting the cheap plastic piston I ordered a VSR orange piston from Airsoft GI, and it's a little bigger in diameter and shorter than the M28. First you need to trim the spring guide till the piston fits over the guide next you get a wood dowel and rap paper around it til it fit so tight in the back side of the piston and it sticks out a few inches.. Now you need a belt sander and a drill, take the piston and stick the dowel in the drill.. With piston rotating (low rpm). Start shaving the white Teflon. Rings on the piston until they are under 22mm and the piston slides smooth in the cylinder.,(be patient and take alot of measurements).. Now take the trigger box apart and shim both sears using AEG gear shims till you have very little or no side to side movement. Hope this helps my kid is happy with it. Link to post Share on other sites
mimesis Posted September 23, 2012 Report Share Posted September 23, 2012 Speed Airsoft announced some parts for M28, but unfortunately they're external or tool. http://www.speedairsoft.com/ProductImages.php Still, they do make a V.2 spring guide and piston head, so I suppose there's an outside chance they might do some inners. Link to post Share on other sites
DRAGON64 Posted September 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 24, 2012 Hi. I have been helping my son and his friends fix their guns. My son traded his working l96 for a M28 that slam fired. After inspecting the cheap plastic piston I ordered a VSR orange piston from Airsoft GI, and it's a little bigger in diameter and shorter than the M28. First you need to trim the spring guide till the piston fits over the guide next you get a wood dowel and rap paper around it til it fit so tight in the back side of the piston and it sticks out a few inches.. Now you need a belt sander and a drill, take the piston and stick the dowel in the drill.. With piston rotating (low rpm). Start shaving the white Teflon. Rings on the piston until they are under 22mm and the piston slides smooth in the cylinder.,(be patient and take alot of measurements).. Now take the trigger box apart and shim both sears using AEG gear shims till you have very little or no side to side movement. Hope this helps my kid is happy with it. Excellent work getting the piston to work in the rifle, this seems to be the quest that many are trying to strive for... thanks for sharing your mods with us. Speed Airsoft announced some parts for M28, but unfortunately they're external or tool. http://www.speedairsoft.com/ProductImages.php Still, they do make a V.2 spring guide and piston head, so I suppose there's an outside chance they might do some inners. Nice find mimesis, I did not know that anyone was making suctom parts for the M28. I wish they made a complete cylinder set for the M28, and not just the billet handle... I with you hoping on an outside chance they will mfg internals. Link to post Share on other sites
Ranger4688 Posted September 24, 2012 Report Share Posted September 24, 2012 My M28 pistons are about to be ready guys.. Going to check out my new machinists prototype today at 6pm. I will have pics etc... Link to post Share on other sites
DRAGON64 Posted September 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 24, 2012 My M28 pistons are about to be ready guys.. Going to check out my new machinists prototype today at 6pm. I will have pics etc... Looking forward to your updates Ranger; my M28 is a dusty rifle needing a new upgrade to test out. Link to post Share on other sites
mimesis Posted October 4, 2012 Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 Hallelujah!! Ask, and ye shall receive. According to the news page on Arnie's today, October 4, this sear group is made by SPEED and designed to fit the M28. It's so new it's not on their website yet, Can a pistol, cylinder, cylinder head, spring guide set be far behind???? Remember, they've already made a special tool for getting the nozzle off the cylinder. http://www.speedairsoft.com/ProductImages.php?view=thumbnailList&category=14 Link to post Share on other sites
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