Cheap "Magpul" PTS AFG2 on ebay.

[BaggyPants]

Had a genuine PTS CTR stock and a genuine MOE stock, also had a clone CTR stock. The clone CTR was *suitcase*. Shoddy cheap and soft plastic and it wouldn't lock onto the stock tube properly. Somebody asked about the difference between the PTS and Green Label and Beta magazines. The PTS magazine bodies are molded in one piece from nice nylon fibre material, so they won't split. The Green Label and Beta mags bodies are made from standard cheaper ABS from two pieces, and will split. Seen it done to a Beta mag on here, just after they were released.

 

The choice is there. Want to save a few bucks, buy cheap. Want stuff to last and have some kind of warranty to guarantee it, spend more. I'm not going to criticise someone for buying on a budget, but don't make me out to be in the wrong or somehow less intelligent for buying the genuine Magpul PTS stuff. It is my choice, based on my experiences.

 

On a similar note, I have a Gibson Les Paul Custom and an Epiphone Les Paul Standard copy. Both are guitars, both play nicely, but no one thinks I'm a stuck up *rickroll* for buying the real Gibson

[NonEx]

Yurgh...

 

Allow me to quote myself with some very accurate information in regards to at least, but not limited to, MAGPUL RS vs. MAGPUL PTS;

 

Hey guys,

 

I just got a WE M4 that I put MAGPUL stuff on, I got the MAGPUL PTS "editions". But in hindsight, seeing as the WE is (suposedly?) RS spec (from my measurements I came to the conclusion that it is military spec. for the stock, can anyone confirm?), would I have been/be able to put RS mil-spec MAGPUL furniture on it ?

 

I looked around and the pricing between PTS and RS MAGPUL furniture is either the same, or a few USD more for the RS version.

 

Now, what are they key differenses between PTS and RS editions ? Materials? Durability? Warranty/Support? Markings (PTS is obviously stamped) ? Packaging ? Or are they the same and the PTS line-up is simply for export/ITFAR (is that it ? US export rules) reasons ?

 

I am not only talking the stocks, grips and handguards, but basically all MAGPUL products.

 

 

Anyone know ?

 

However, and the main reason for my question, is that I was looking at Brownells.com on MAGPUL items and many of them have no restrictions under the "Restrictions" tab of the items, ie. no export "bans". Just a thought, if I can fit RS stuff on my airsoft for a few dollars more, then why shouldn't I ?

 

That last sentence came out a little wrong. I was just wondering if there was any major reason why people bought (or rather, why PTS is offered to airsofters) MAGPUL PTS instead of RS if the RS fits, or am I the only one who ended up doing this ? I just browsed eHobbyAsia and bought the parts presented to me, didn't really give it much thought until after the fact that they were PTS specific. And like I said the price differense is minimal. Oh well, now I know for my next MAGPUL project. Thanks.

 

For example, there is an RS kit with the MOE handguard, stock, grip, trigger guard and pistol grip for 110 USD, the airsoft PTS version combo of those cost 120 USD, and taking into consideration that the PTS is lower quality...

 

Mweh.

 

I guess I am a bit frustrated because I thought I _had_ to get the PTS gear for it to work with my gun. I would have prefered RS products.

Allright, thanks for the info guys. Upon reading some more about ITAR and Brownells policys for international orders I might not be so unhappy after all, it seems like a complicated matter so I now understand why there are PTS versions. It's not like I need the milspec real deal, my life is not on the line with my airsoft gear so. I was just curious as to why, and it's always nice to have RS items if possible. But I guess it comes down to like we stated in the beginning, ITAR (export regulations).

 

Thanks for the input.

 

Kraut wrote;

I guess the price difference is there because PTS is counting on non-US based airsofters wanting MP so bad they'll pay through the nose for lower-quality clones (now where'd they get that idea?).

 

 

I was kinda thinking that as well. But it would be interesting to know just how much of a differense there is in materials and quality between a PTS item and its real steel counte part, from what I have seen and heard it's not much, I mean, it's not like the PTS version is an ABS china clone of the RS. But still, there has to be some differense.

 

Allright guys sorry for the slight necro...

 

As I suffer from slight (not really slight) OCD I was really bothered by the fact that I had purchased MAGPUL PTS stuff (not then knowing it wasn't "the real deal"), and since I discovered that I actually can get a hold of the RS MAGPUL stuff, I have decided to purchase RS MAGPUL stuff to replace my MAGPUL PTS stuff.

 

MAGPUL items are NOT prohibited from export from the USA under ITAR. It's actually quiet the oposite. Because MAGPUL has paid an export fee and registered their company with DDTC in accordance with ITAR they (registered retailers) are allowed to export MAGPUL items.

 

I also found a Swedish online retailer that sell RS MAGPUL stuff (slightly more expensive than import from USA).

 

The parts in question do not require a firearms or import license to purchase and import into the country of Sweden, so I figured I would attempt to import the items directly.

 

So, I looked around at Brownells, e-mailed them regarding international orders, and here's the deal for those who are interested;

 

All international orders over 100 USD of value (containing DDTC regulated items) require an EXPORT license registered in the name of the purchaser. You send in documentation to Brownells who then process it with the DDTC. They require a letter of intent, a cover letter, information regarding fire arms weapons license and/or import license and a purchase order. The cost for this is 250 USD or 3% of the total order value, whichever comes first.

 

As mentioned the manufacturer of the items you wish to purchase must be registered with the DDTC and have paid the 2500 USD registration fee for this. If they have not, the item will be cancelled from your order (personal experience).

 

 

Anyways. I went the easy way and placed several sub 100 USD orders and that has been working fine, and the items are starting to roll in.

 

First impressions are, RS MAGPUL furniture is noticably different. I haven't done a full side by side comparison, but I will be doing that later, checking materials, weight and fit and finish etc. But they seem alot more robust, heavier and better finish etc.

 

I will post back once all items have arrived and I have made a full comparison.

 

 

Bur preliminary I would say, because of the prices being virtually the same (+/- a few USD), if you can, get the RS items.

 

Yep, indeed. The RS parts are IMO fairly priced considering quality, warranty, the fact that they are mil spec, marketing, packaging, instructions, web site, presentation and performance etc. But the PTS stuff is bleak in comparison...

 

 

That is incorrect;

 

 

ITAR does not in itself mean an item is prohibited from export, it simply means it falls under certain regulations. Brownells specify on their orders "Regulated items" (gun parts) vs "Non-regulated items".

 

MAGPUL webiste regarding international order;

DO YOU SHIP INTERNATIONALLY?

We do NOT ship internationally and all orders must have both billing and shipping addresses located within the 50 United States or District of Columbia. The only exception to this is for shipments to APO/FPO addresses, with important restrictions as noted below:

 

PLEASE NOTE: Many of the items on this Web site are subject to the International Traffic in Arms Regulations (ITAR, 22 CFR Parts 120-130), the Arms Export Control Act (22 USC 2778), or the Export Administration Act of 1979 (as amended, 22 USC App. 2401 et. seq.) and EXPORT IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED without authorization or a license for each order as issued by the U.S. Department of State's Directorate of Defense Trade Controls.

 

While we proudly support the Members of the US Military deployed around the world and believe that it is a great privilege to service their needs, we must fully comply with all United States export control laws and regulations. Under these laws and regulations any shipment to an APO/FPO that is physically located outside of the 50 United States must be considered an Export, regardless of your military service status, rank, etc.

If you would like to order any Magpul product(s) to be exported to an APO/FPO please contact one of our Customer Service Representatives to discuss your options.

For further information regarding the applicable laws, regulations, and policies please contact:

 

U.S. Department of State

Directorate of Defense Trade Controls

Compliance & Registration Division

2401 E Street NW, SA-1, Room H1200

Washington, DC 20522-0112

 

DDTC Response Team

Tel.: (202) 663-1282

Website:

http://www.pmddtc.state.gov/response_team/index.html

Email:

DDTCResponseTeam@state.gov

 

Access to the official ITAR can be found here:

http://www.pmddtc.state.gov/regulations_laws/itar.html

 

 

 

So MAGPUL themselves do not ship internationally probably because of the extra hassle involved in handling and verifying the DDTC export license registrations etc.

 

So you can purchase them (RS MAGPUL parts) if the US retailer ships internationally, if the order is below 100 USD and does not containt any parts requiring a fire arms license, or if the order is above 100 USD (and does not containt any parts requiring a fire arms license) you will be required to apply for an export license via the DDTC as I described above.

 

The purpose of the registration for an export license is simply to verify the validity of the purchase/export and keeping track of who buys what and to where.

 

Please refer to Brownells International Sales information page for more information regarding their specific requirements; http://www.brownells.com/aspx/general/i ... sales.aspx

 

I also initially thought that the PTS stuff were the B grade RS MAGPUL items with re-branding but upon reviewing the parts I have recieved so far I am starting to doubt that theory.

 

MAGPUL PTS is a _company_ located in Hong Kong. They work under license from MAGPUL. I believe they share molds etc. but they most likely produce the products in HK, hence why PTS does not proudly brandish the "Made in the USA" mantra like the RS stuff does. Also, production cost in HK vs. USA would differ dramatically thus making the profit from the heavy mark up of the PTS stuff even more lucurative. The question is how much of the mark up that goes to MAGPUL in licensing fees etc. from PTS.

 

 

For the full conversation and not just my one man show see here : http://gasguns.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=7612&start=10

 

Random dude asks;

What do you think of the RS Magpul parts compared to PTS?

Worth the extra money?

 

 

Considering that they are priced almost exactly the same, RS being a couple of % more in some cases, def. RS. I had a thread going on about that in the general section, see here : derp

 

Source: http://gasguns.info/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=7653&start=50

 

 

Clones, *fruitcage* that *suitcase* no way they are made in a MAGPUL factory, I seriously doubt even PTS is, see theory above.

 

Herp derp to you sirs!

[phatboi21]

i'll stick with i'm playing airsoft on a budget... if i was in the mood for magpul parts (i only have 10x9mm magpulls for my MP5 which are genuine as i got them cheap as hell as overstock!)

 

if a mag costs £20 and another costs £10 i'm obviously going to buy the £10 ones as i can get more of them (i'm a mid-cap user) simple as that. nothing to do with brand names at all.

[NonEx]

Good thinking mate, quantity over quality on a budget... herp derp ?

 

I usually try to go down the middle and look at price /performance/quality or choose a known and tried path/product so I know what I get. If you buy $5 china clones then you don't know what you're getting, but that's fine if that's what you want to do with your money.

 

I rather buy one quality product at $50 than 10 China clone POS at $5 a piece...

[amblin83]

Besides, it's not like anything can go wrong with it. Its a chunk of plastic with a screw through it, it's not like it can break or fail on you or anything.

 

lol, it can smell very bad because of the recycled plastics.I brought one several weeks ago, very nicely built, the fitting is good, and material is acceptable. BUT be careful, i've seen several other clones that's using the same 'magpul' cardboard box, but inside it's stinking plastic and poor quality. Definitely not from the same factory.

[WhiteHawksan]

calm down non-ex, grab a horlics.

 

Some china stuff is rubbish, some of it is very good. Do your research and play your money how you so see fit. Not all chinese stuff is POS. Not all 'Real Steel' stuff is any good either.

[amblin83]

Indeed.

 

Just be careful and do the research. Ask the seller for the picture of the ACTUAL product he's going to send you. NOT the carefully posed studio shots.

 

The big problem with chinese clones is that the quality can vary by HUGE margins. If one thing becomes popular, everybody makes it and they all use the same packging. some r very good exact clones, some r simply POS.

[supervepr]

How many would buy a $13 Tapco (good stuff from experience) mag that functions just as well as a $20 Magpul version? Point being, its not like your only options are Magpul or complete garbage:-)

[ollie_ty]

BTW, I bought one of these AFG2s. Its very loose, it could do with some electrical tape to grip the rail or something. The Clone AFG1s are great though.

[WhiteHawksan]

I had an AFG V2, was perfect, not a bad thing to say about it.

 

I had a MagPul PTS AFG V2, same difference, except one was cheaper.

 

One of my friends got ACM MBUS, they were rubbish, flashmarks and poor casting meant they were for nothing more than show as they couldn't really be used or zero'd.

[NonEx]

You have to ask yourself if you find MAGPUL PTS that is noticably cheaper than RS or PTS stuff elsewhere if it actually is legitimate PTS or a clone of PTS. All sources I have looked around at in regards to PTS vs. RS they were all within a few USD of eachother or priced the same.

[amblin83]

The PTS is based in hongkong, manufactured in Mainland China, and of course it's of a MUCH higher build quality and Q/C standard than 'non-licensed' knock-offs. And, most importantly, they worked closely with DuPont to select a special polymer that closely resembles the look, feel and weight of the RS Magpul polymer and indeed it's among very high-grade extra durable polymers. BUT, this dosen't make it the real-deal, technically it's still a 'clone', a replica of the real thing.

 

All RS Magpuls gun parts r made in the US of A with a sssseeeeekkkkkkrrrreeeeettttt polymer blend , so secret that the guys at Magpul would guard it 100% in-house.

-----

 

There shall be no conflict between mid-low budget players and big budget all-RS component 'connoisseurs'. We're all in the world of Airsoft, and many of us simply don't have the luxury and lawful permit to own a real firearm. So it's really chicken vs. egg salad. Same recipe but different ingredients, be happy.

 

EDIT. About chinese copies, all the non-branded knock-offs just made the selection of good replica parts awlful lot more risky and difficult, but on the other hand, cheap replicas made airsoft a LOT more accessible for new players and low budget members of the hobbit. Everything had its downsides, so does airsoft replicas. If one thing becomes exclusivly the luxury of 'elitists', it's just a few steps away from dying out.