gun control

[Danke]

I would have to say CCW is not macho posturing at all. The whole point of it is to keep the thing concealed so no know knows it's there.

 

The whole open carry movement is a different story. That appears to be generating a negative push back. Kind of like a pride parade with guns instead of glitter paint.

[Mazuran]

The whole open carry movement is a different story. That appears to be generating a negative push back. Kind of like a pride parade with guns instead of glitter paint.

 

Insert Freud comment here.

 

 

2)Of course human beings are violent - a gun allows this to be expressed very well! better then a car and better then a knife. Sandy Hook was more fatal then the Boston bombings. Mumbai, Brevik, and now in Kenya. I think the media does play its parts, as do SSRIs. But guns still play a very important role! Naturally all massive industries with political influence too. excellent!

 

Ok, I'm just going to rant about the bit I've put in bold. I'm assuming you need the antidepressants?

That is ######. Millions of people take SSRIs and aren't violent (that's around 6 million people in the UK), and millions of people are violent without taking SSRIs. There's not even any definitive evidence that SSRIs are any more effective than a placebo most of the time when treating depression, and over the last 40-50 years they've been used there's never been any indication that SSRIs make people more likely to be violent.

 

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In the end the internet gun control debate invariably ends up as some people claiming it's an inviolable right of theirs to own and use firearms, and everyone else ending up saying that "what if" scenarios and a vague reference to weapon ownership in a constitution isn't a good enough reason. It's a bit like trying to convince a vegan pope to beatify Bernard Matthews. 

 

For the record, I'm generally pro responsible ownership, but I have various problems with the arguments used by people to justify it (see previous).

 

EDIT:

Re: the carrying of weapons and going hero mode in a hostage-type situation - I thought the general advice was to not do that? Surely that just risks turning it into a massacre?

[hitmanNo2]

A hostage situation yes.  Leave it to the professionals.  But if someone is strolling around taking pot shots at bystanders, it is quite obvious who the bad guy is.  So if you're confident in your abilities and are aware of what's in front and behind of your target, your involvement could very well save lives.

[Skarclaw]

ssris can increase suicidal thoughts - more then double a placebo. Taking into account other things like problems when people come off them when they shouldn't and its not something to mixed with firearms imho. Even these smoking cessation drugs have been linked with murder suicides  - you shouldn't take them if you have a history of depression! sad case of this near me a few years back. anyhoo

[Jagdraben]

Jag: I was under the assumption more people were killed by cars then they were guns. It is more likely that you will be involved in a car accident then a violent encounter. Of course wearing a seatbelt is unlikely to kill anybody. CCW smacks of macho posturing, imo.

 

I doubt the hijackers would of used box cutters if they could get a gun through customs. I'm a great fan of the have it and not need it philosophy. But once again this does not apply to me shooting someone. I am aware of the 1920s bombing but it begs the question as to why kids use guns instead of bombs: Because they are effective, easily obtainable and do not require nearly as much skill to use as an improvised explosive takes to construct. Regardless, just because large amounts of people have been killed without the use of guns does not mean that guns are still very lethal!

 

More people are killed by cars than by guns, at least in the US. That number, on account of being people killed does not include the numbers of people who were in accidents or were the victims of violence but were not killed as a result of it. And, yes, wearing a seatbelt can, in fact, kill somebody. As can airbags. Not likely. But I'm not likely to be in an accident, in either case and if I am, my life is more likely to be saved by wearing a seatbelt or having airbags than it is to be taken. Ditto carrying a concealed weapon.

 

And, again, as previously mentioned, concealed carry is all about being concealed. And, as a rule, the people who carry concealed are much less likely to be involved in any sort of violent crime (as vic or perp) than people who do not carry or have permits.

 

The hijackers definitely could have gotten guns through security. Even today there are stories in the paper of people who got on the plane and realized they still had their firearms on their person or in a carry on bag and subsequently turned them over to authorities. 

[Mazuran]

ssris can increase suicidal thoughts - more then double a placebo. Taking into account other things like problems when people come off them when they shouldn't and its not something to mixed with firearms imho. Even these smoking cessation drugs have been linked with murder suicides  - you shouldn't take them if you have a history of depression! sad case of this near me a few years back. anyhoo

 

Oh dear. This sounds like something out of the Daily Mail or the Daily Express.

There's been a fair few studies suggesting a link like this in children and adolescents - but so far, there's no conclusive link, none of the major RCTs or meta-analysis studies have been conclusive on this in adults (which is generally the deciding factor), and most SSRIs aren't even licensed for children and adolescents anyway. 

It's also very hard to separate coincidental events and cause and effect with this - antidepressants are used by people with depression, who are already several times more likely than the general population to have suicidal thoughts. 

If there was more evidence that SSRIs caused suicide and violence, they'd have been banned by now. Whereas there's plenty of examples of alcohol fuelling violence and suicide, but remains available for general consumption. 

Perhaps people should be looking more at how someone reached the condition they're in without anyone noticing or offering help, rather than just laying the blame on medications. 

[NeoVeNoM]

Perhaps people should be looking more at how someone reached the condition they're in without anyone noticing or offering help, rather than just laying the blame on medications. 

 

Indeed. It's better to prevail than to cure. Unfortunately, there is more money to be made in the latter.

[Cannonfodder80]

The hijackers definitely could have gotten guns through security. Even today there are stories in the paper of people who got on the plane and realized they still had their firearms on their person or in a carry on bag and subsequently turned them over to authorities.

This I can easily see happening. Back in January 2002 I had a uni field trip to Cyprus and when unpacking the day after flying back I realised I had accidentally left a geology hammer in my carry on bag. Despite the bag being x rayed twice before boarding I was not stopped. While it wasn't a firearm it would still be easy to kill someone with it and is larger than your average hand gun