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27th June 2007


Steve Pearson

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yeah, tony did so much for the country- abolishing those pesky student grants, chronic and deliberate attempts to outsource the NHS, essentially continuing the thatcherite policies of privatise, privatise, privatise but with the added veneer of chucking money at show piece things so he can trawl out statistics to show just how much he's got done...

 

yeah. Take a trip down your average inner-city school or estate, and tell me where all these achievements are.

 

and don't even get me started on the foot and mouth disaster.

but hey, you're right. he was better than the tories. What does that say about THAT shower of bar stewards?

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a fair system of education and healthcare for as many people as possible.

 

There is no emoticon that can truly display the ridiculousness of this statement.

 

Thats why the hospital near me is laying of nurses when they are desperate for more (not to mention that the MRSA rate in NSRI is the highest in the country). Nurses are qualifying to find no jobs so are sodding off to Australia.

 

Average class sizes are bigger than ever thanks to a shortage of teachers. Stoke-on-Trent is averaging 33.

 

The ambulance service is fighting a desperate battle to prevent itself being regionalised. The men on the ground say that lives WILL be lost if regionalisation is brought in.

 

Hospital and food catering services are close to collapse.

 

You, Sir, are a buffoon.

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In The Sun it has a brief article for Jeremy Clarkson tomorrow saying that on the 1st July Great Britain officially becomes a facist state. Whats that about?

 

 

My question again - anybody know whats so significant about the 1st of July?

 

July the 1st is when the Smoking ban starts in England, bringing it into line with Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

 

Clarkson is a 40 a day man, you see...

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my point is that compared to 97 most people are better off, and i dont just mean financially i mean that more people have a higher standard of living in general ;)

 

there will allways be problems with any government its how they deal with them that matters, and in my opinioon labout has dealt with them on the whole a darn sight better than the tories would have ;)

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my point is that compared to 97 most people are better off, and i dont just mean financially i mean that more people have a higher standard of living in general  ;)

 

there will allways be problems with any government its how they deal with them that matters, and in my opinioon labout has dealt with them on the whole a darn sight better than the tories would have  ;)

 

By looting the nation, caving in to the EEC, allowing a record number of illegal immigrants (hey, I got no problem with immigration but there has to be jobs to come into...and there are too many coming in purely to benefit off our welfare system), privatising more public services (privatising public services NEVER works), lowering education standards, letting hospitals schools and emergency services run on pathetic budgets...

 

Yeh, theyve done a great job. We'd have been better off with the Natural Law party. Once you get over the yogic flying thing, they had a decent manifesto... :rolleyes:

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By looting the nation, caving in to the EEC, allowing a record number of illegal immigrants (hey, I got no problem with immigration but there has to be jobs to come into...and there are too many coming in purely to benefit off our welfare system), privatising more public services (privatising public services NEVER works), lowering education standards, letting hospitals schools and emergency services run on pathetic budgets...

 

Yeh, theyve done a great job.  We'd have been better off with the Natural Law party.  Once you get over the yogic flying thing, they had a decent manifesto... :rolleyes:

 

Take a look at the level of unemployment. It has continuously been lower than under the tories and ever decreasing despite the record numbers of legal and illegal immigrants, your point about there not being enough jobs for them to come into is absolute nonsense.

 

As for "letting hospitals schools and emergency services run on pathetic budgets," my mum is a teacher and she will tell you that the improvements in the education system over the last 10 years have been amazing. She will also be distraught if the tories get back into power as they will most tear the last 10 years of improvements to pieces.

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Take a look at the level of unemployment. It has continuously been lower than under the tories and ever decreasing despite the record numbers of legal and illegal immigrants, your point about there not being enough jobs for them to come into is absolute nonsense. 

 

As for "letting hospitals schools and emergency services run on pathetic budgets," my mum is a teacher and she will tell you that the improvements in the education system over the last 10 years have been amazing.  She will also be distraught if the tories get back into power as they will most tear the last 10 years of improvements to pieces.

QFT

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I guess you don't know that, when people are on all these wonderful back to work courses, they don't count as unemployed?

 

Oh, and your graph shows unemployment starting to drop five years before Labour got into power. So that opens up the possibilities that Labour are just continuing Tory policies (as is often said), or even that a drop in unemployment would have happened regardless of who was in power.

 

:zorro:

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I guess you don't know that, when people are on all these wonderful back to work courses, they don't count as unemployed?

 

Oh, and your graph shows unemployment starting to drop five years before Labour got into power. So that opens up the possibilities that Labour are just continuing Tory policies (as is often said), or even that a drop in unemployment would have happened regardless of who was in power.

 

:zorro:

 

Its true that unemployment was falling under the tories. However the point is that it has continued to fall despite increased immigration, legal or otherwise. If it had shown any sign of increasing, there would perhaps be justification for an arguement against immigration. If you read my post, you'll see that I never tried to claim anything about the effectiveness of labour vs anyone else in terms of maintaining full employment.

 

As for back to work schemes, the number of people seeking work but not eligble for benefit, the people that you describe, has also fallen. If i can find a nice graph ill post it here later ;)

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Nothing to do with the Blair lot fiddling the statistics then, eh?

 

Remember, you're only classed as unemployed if you HAVEN'T got a job and are claiming dole.

 

It isn't uncommon for the red tape brigade to shuffle people on to other benefits so as to take them off the unemployed books.

 

If you were to tally up everyone that hasn't got a job, whether they're on the dole and or claiming other benefits that aren't used to calculate unemployment, you're talking millions. It's a giant State engineered CON.

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Besides just because someone else was ###### dosent automatically mean you were great because you werent quite as ###### a the last lot were and i wish people would stop using that excuse for blair, he has had ten very long years to sort problems out and all hes done is introduce more.

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Nothing to do with the Blair lot fiddling the statistics then, eh?

 

Remember, you're only classed as unemployed if you HAVEN'T got a job and are claiming dole.

 

It isn't uncommon for the red tape brigade to shuffle people on to other benefits so as to take them off the unemployed books.

 

If you were to tally up everyone that hasn't got a job, whether they're on the dole and or claiming other benefits that aren't used to calculate unemployment, you're talking millions. It's a giant State engineered CON.

 

someone fetch my tin foil hat

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What worries me most now is that people of this country will look to more radical forms of government.

 

At the minute theres a lot of anti-immigrant feeling, a need for nationalism, a need to get this country's industry kick started again etc.

 

I don't want to sound daft, but if you look back over history, those factors haven't made for the best of European governments...

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Nothing to do with the Blair lot fiddling the statistics then, eh?

 

Remember, you're only classed as unemployed if you HAVEN'T got a job and are claiming dole.

 

It isn't uncommon for the red tape brigade to shuffle people on to other benefits so as to take them off the unemployed books.

 

If you were to tally up everyone that hasn't got a job, whether they're on the dole and or claiming other benefits that aren't used to calculate unemployment, you're talking millions. It's a giant State engineered CON.

 

As I've said above, this isn't the case. Here is a graph of percentage employment. Percentage of people with jobs has gone up. But I'm sure theres another conspiracy theory to explain this :rolleyes:

 

What worries me most now is that people of this country will look to more radical forms of government.

 

At the minute theres a lot of anti-immigrant feeling, a need for nationalism, a need to get this country's industry kick started again etc.

 

I don't want to sound daft, but if you look back over history, those factors haven't made for the best of European governments...

 

Historically times of economic hardship are what gives rise to extreme politics. With all parties moving more and more towards the political centre, and decade without any severe economic downturns, its safe to say political moderacy will continue to dominate for the time being.

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What worries me most now is that people of this country will look to more radical forms of government.

 

At the minute theres a lot of anti-immigrant feeling, a need for nationalism, a need to get this country's industry kick started again etc.

 

I don't want to sound daft, but if you look back over history, those factors haven't made for the best of European governments...

thats exactly the problem, if the BNP could get people who dont vote to vote for them then we could end up with a devoutly racist government very soon...

they have allready got seats on local councils and a suprising amount of support.

 

anyone else notice the similarities between Nick Griffin and Hitler??

noth sent to prison, used it as a publicity stunt etc...

 

the thing is though in history for an extremist government to get in there needs to be some form of trigger, a large terrorist attack in the Uk or an ecenomic reccesion might do it, scary ;)

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thats exactly the problem, if the BNP could get people who dont vote to vote for them then we could end up with a devoutly racist government very soon...

they have allready got seats on local councils and a suprising amount of support.

 

anyone else notice the similarities between Nick Griffin  and Hitler??

noth sent to prison, used it as a publicity stunt etc...

 

the thing is though in history for an extremist government to get in there needs to be some form of trigger, a large terrorist attack in the Uk or an ecenomic reccesion might do it, scary ;)

 

There is not alot of chance of the BNP getting in, please don't make statements like that, think how weak the lib dems are, and compare them to BNP.

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There is not alot of chance of the BNP getting in, please don't make statements like that, think how weak the lib dems are, and compare them to BNP.

before the depression, they were very weak:

march 1928 12 seats

after the depression they wernt:

july 1932 230 seats

 

ali ;)

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before the depression, they were very weak:

march    1928    12      seats

after the depression they wernt:

july        1932    230    seats

 

ali  ;)

 

 

Yeah but we live in a different time now, have you got statistics for seats gained during the recesses in the 70's? I'm willing to bet they are not as high as those.

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Yeah but we live in a different time now, have you got statistics for seats gained during the recesses in the 70's? I'm willing to bet they are not as high as those.

becouse it wasnt as "big" a recession, dont presume that becouse it happend 70 years ago it cant happen now, that mistakes been made countless times allready ;)

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