chas Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Now that I think about it, maybe this should go in off-topic. Anyway, a spanish TV channel is now broadcasting a BBC docu about WWII reenactment. i havent watched it, but from what the host was saying, it seemd like the docu was trying to present how many hobbists were obsessed with the 3rd Reich and how their uniforms werent used "just in WWII recreation events".... Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I thought theis was relevant to you WWII airsoft enthusiasts. BTW: Telemadrid has an international channel, so look for it on your satelite. cheers! Link to post Share on other sites
Kraut Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 So, the media grossly misrepresents something and broadcasts it internationally, possibly to the downfall of a group of people they don't agree with? What else is new? And wasn't there something like this before about WW2 reenactors in Britain? Link to post Share on other sites
HaVoC Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 This was made about 2 years ago, about the War & Peace Show down in Kent every summer. It's a reenactment event, and the program alleges that a number of people there, involved in Third Reich reenactment, are actual real-life neo-Nazis. It doesn't really affect airsofters at all, and it didn't make a hugely big impression on me despite the fact I now probably go to W&P as often as I skirmish (if not more so). Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Outsiders can always misinterpret the intentions of hobbyist groups. Much like here in the US, sometimes people view gun enthusiasts as hillbillies getting together to cause trouble. Although I would be interested to see what evidence the docu presents and what the overall discussion is. Link to post Share on other sites
Jordan94 Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 seen it has quote from extreme right wing reanactors dressed in german uniform Link to post Share on other sites
chas Posted January 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Im not saying that the WWII, SS, etc. crowd doesnt have a few neonazis and probabily a lot of filo-nazis, people who have weird attraction to everything 3rd Reich, but the problem with this docu is that it seems (havent watched it) to blow things out of proportion and tries (again: havent watched it yet) create a wrong iamge of the whole reenactment scene. And (although its two years old) it could affect airsofters by assimilation: WWII reenactor = nazis, WWII reenactors included in airsoft, therefore: airsoft = nazis, paramilitary training, etc. Look at what happened with the VCRA. The public opinion can easily manipulated into believing they have to be protected against replicas, ids training with "almost real guns". Link to post Share on other sites
mikogel Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 It's stupid some media blow things out of proportion and then everyone jumps on these people's backs saying that they can't do what they enjoy, they don't think how responsible or good people they are we just get labelled i hate that it really annoys me. sorry for ranting a bit. Link to post Share on other sites
BaggyPants Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 I have friends who were included in that documentary. Two have successfully had several complaints upheld against the BBC for its coverage of the wedding and another had a complaint of breach of privacy upheld. The most amusing part is where another friend sat on a vehicle in Waffen SS kit states that he is jewish. The BBC left it looking like he was lying, when in fact he and his brother are both jewish and are also both members of the Second Battle Group reenactment group, who portray the 1st SS Division Liebstandarte Adolf Hitler. Hardly points to SBG being particulary nazi or racist, does it? Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 I have friends who were included in that documentary. Two have successfully had several complaints upheld against the BBC for its coverage of the wedding and another had a complaint of breach of privacy upheld. The most amusing part is where another friend sat on a vehicle in Waffen SS kit states that he is jewish. The BBC left it looking like he was lying, when in fact he and his brother are both jewish and are also both members of the Second Battle Group reenactment group, who portray the 1st SS Division Liebstandarte Adolf Hitler. Hardly points to SBG being particulary nazi or racist, does it? That is pretty interesting. I don't think such complaints would have been upheld here in the US. The media seems to go to some extremes over here. Link to post Share on other sites
Dom Hyde Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Ofcom: BBC was unfair to couple in 'Nazi' documentary "Ofcom has upheld in part a fairness and privacy complaint against a BBC documentary called Weekend Nazis, presented by John Sweeney, by a couple whose wedding at a military re-enactment show was aired." Press Gazette UK That'll be them, then, BaggyPants. Link to post Share on other sites
Dom Hyde Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Weekend Nazis: YouTube link Link to post Share on other sites
Senor Awesome Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 That man has some interesting logic. "If tolerance extends to them, then it should also extend to those who think it is not only tacky,but tasteless" Thats like me saying "You're free to read that book, but Im free to throw it in the fire if I dont like it." It just doesnt work that way. And when he is trying to film the policeman, who asks him to stop he says "Its a free country". How old is this guy? 6? In a free country, people are free to not be filmed if they dont want to be. Link to post Share on other sites
Chimpy Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Thats like me saying "You're free to read that book, but Im free to throw it in the fire if I dont like it. It just doesnt work that way. Yes it does. Everyone should be free to read or burn any books they own as they see fit. And when he is trying to film the policeman, who asks him to stop he says "Its a free country". How old is this guy? 6? In a free country, people are free to not be filmed if they dont want to be. Not in public they aren't. Rather obviously being out in public denotes being seen by the public and if you are willing to consent to that then you are willing to be filmed by the public. Public servants pursuing their public service should not be able to prevent their being filmed for very obvious reasons. Your POV rather reminds me of the more repressive regimes such as the USSR. Link to post Share on other sites
Senor Awesome Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Yes it does. Everyone should be free to read or burn any books they own as they see fit. Not in public they aren't. Rather obviously being out in public denotes being seen by the public and if you are willing to consent to that then you are willing to be filmed by the public. Public servants pursuing their public service should not be able to prevent their being filmed for very obvious reasons. Your POV rather reminds me of the more repressive regimes such as the USSR. You misunderstood me on both counts: 1) The analogy only works if it is your book I am burning. Im fairly sure I am not allowed to go burn some of your books because I dont like them. 2) While that is true, he seems to be getting very hypocritical here. He seemingly wants people to give up the rights they currently have, and then has the guts to tell someone he can do what he wants, as it is a free country. Link to post Share on other sites
Chimpy Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 You misunderstood me on both counts: 1) The analogy only works if it is your book I am burning. Im fairly sure I am not allowed to go burn some of your books because I dont like them. 2) While that is true, he seems to be getting very hypocritical here. He seemingly wants people to give up the rights they currently have, and then has the guts to tell someone he can do what he wants, as it is a free country. That's not me misunderstanding you that's you leaving critical bits out of your original post! Mind you its been a while since I watched the program! Link to post Share on other sites
Delfi Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Yes it does. Everyone should be free to read or burn any books they own as they see fit. Farenheit 451? I can't believe you're advocating that! D Link to post Share on other sites
Chimpy Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Farenheit 451? I can't believe you're advocating that! D There is a difference between a person burning their own property and the government organising 'firemen' to burn their citizens property. The key part of the phrase was "any books they own". Link to post Share on other sites
Gigueand Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 I gotta say, I understood his book burning post just fine... Having watched a bit of the documentary (thanks for the youtube link), I found it fairly ridiculous. Clearly the film editors went out of their way to not show allied reenactors. I also was a bit stunned that they would bring in a German scholar to comment on the whole affair. Probably not the right person to bring in if you want a balanced appraisal of the show as a whole, which obviously they do not. I was a bit concerned by the wedding invitation as well as some of the memorabilia being sold. I mean, honestly, who buys a Hitler coffee cup or SS t-shirt? Some of that stuff is pretty far out there. Link to post Share on other sites
Chimpy Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Oh yeah the documentary is ridiculous. Obviously they didn't find what they wanted and went out of their way to try and invent it's existence. They were also rightly slammed by the authorities for the misrepresentation as well. Mind you I still feel very uneasy with someone dressing up as a member of the SS regardless. Too many negative connotations. Link to post Share on other sites
Involved6 Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 Epic controversial journalism fail. This is just another case of the media making something out of nothing, so they can bookend advertisements. Link to post Share on other sites
-Angel- Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 While there were clearly half a dozen right wing sympathisers there, his attempts to smear every re-enactor with the same brush were pathetic. How can you consider yourself a serious journalist without doing any research before hand? or cherry picking the very worst parts of it? oh, and "why don't people portray the killing of prisoners or the holocaust"... because its massively distasteful you *beep*. Link to post Share on other sites
Delfi Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 There is a difference between a person burning their own property and the government organising 'firemen' to burn their citizens property. The key part of the phrase was "any books they own". A book is a book ... I'd argue that there is no difference in ownership as the knowledge contained within is owned by the public. I always understood that to be the deeper (and ironic) meaning behind the book that Bradbury wrote. D Link to post Share on other sites
askeytheman Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 oh, and "why don't people portray the killing of prisoners or the holocaust"... because its massively distasteful you *beep*. Seconded. I thought that the reporter was extremely biased, and I did notice that some shots of the re-enactors didn't show him- it could easily have been one man with the camera (who would go relatively unnoticed) filming, and a simple voiceover. Link to post Share on other sites
meppie Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 It is Sweeney. In that case be prepared for some over the top conclusions and remarks. BBC or not but this man is just going for sensation. He is a bit sensation one-sided. Two other things: - why choose the 1st SS Division? Why not pick a different Wehrmacht division? - The "souvenirs" are a bit too much too my opinion. I can imagine that that part is over the top for some visitors. Why the #### are they selling that? And then I do not mean the gear, I mean the mugs etc. Link to post Share on other sites
HaVoC Posted January 22, 2009 Report Share Posted January 22, 2009 This is just another case of the media making something out of nothing, so they can bookend advertisements. The BBC are funded by the government and have no advertisements. Link to post Share on other sites
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