Religion

[WeirdoTransvestite]

My religious standpoint:

 

I hate all religions equally. I don't hate them so that I hate anyone who believes them, but I hate the idea of them. I just can't be bothered with them, and the way they can consume some people's lives. I hate the way there's scientific hard evidence to disprove religious beliefs such as Christianity's 'creation' story, yet religions still stubbornly believe.

 

Also, many (if not most) of the world's major conflicts have been brought about by religion - usually either "My religion is better then yours", or "Our religion says this is our land, not yours!". Why?

 

One exception would seem to be Buddhism, which seems fairly harmless and doesn't appear to dominate people's lives - it's more a set of rules without all the bumf, looking at what I've seen of it. Then again, I may be way off there.

 

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NOTE: I'm not trying to anger anyone. I'm not saying "if you believe in religion you're a retard". I'm just saying that in my own personal opinion, religion is pointless and dangerous.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I can't believe I'm saying this, but HaVoC, you are one of the smartest people the world has ever seen. You realize how unimportant religion is. Religion is the single worst thing created by man. It is more powerful than a thousand hydrogen bombs. I don't know of many things that created a 1000 year period of almost NO technological development, do you? Without religion we would not be on this world anymore, humanity would have long been colonizing the galaxy by now, if not for religion. As long as there is religion, humanity will be forever doomed to prejudice, distrust, and conflict.

[FeeFyeFoeFum]

Religion is not for me. Some people like it, some people swear by (or at) it, some people need it. I have always beleived that generally religion is used by most people as a sort of emotional crutch to help them cope with disasters (both small and large), explain why bad things happen to good people and hope for something after we shed our mortal coils.

 

Major problem with religion is basic human nature. People are, at a basic level, corrupt. Might be little bit, might be a lot, but its true nonetheless. The idea of religion having codes of behaviour, doing the right thing to others, living as good life, etc is a fantastic concept. But it falls down for the same reason communism falls over when you put it into practise, human nature wont abide by these rules. Simple as that.

 

Plus religion has been, without doubt, the single largest cause of blood shed in the history of the human race. Religion causes some human beings to do incredibly fething stupid things. 'I know' says one religious follower to a fellow follower of the same beliefs,'those infidels over there worship someone with a different name than we do, lets go hit them in the head with rocks till they see our point of view and change their minds!' 'But' says the other follower' what about those guys?' Points towards a group of non-religious people, 'They dont worship anyone.' 'Dont worry' says the first one in reply , 'we'll deal with them once we're finished with the first guys...'

 

And so on. In short - religion? You can keep it.

 

[rizzo]

I can't believe I'm saying this, but HaVoC, you are one of the smartest people the world has ever seen. You realize how unimportant religion is. Religion is the single worst thing created by man. It is more powerful than a thousand hydrogen bombs. I don't know of many things that created a 1000 year period of almost NO technological development, do you? Without religion we would not be on this world anymore, humanity would have long been colonizing the galaxy by now, if not for religion. As long as there is religion, humanity will be forever doomed to prejudice, distrust, and conflict.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I completely disagree.

 

It is more powerful than a thousand hydrogen bombs. I don't know of many things that created a 1000 year period of almost NO technological development, do you?

 

Yeah, i do. The fall of the Roman Empire for one...

 

Are you saying religion somehow makes humanity retarded? Religion is simply a means to an end. People are ALWAYS going to hate other people. Humans will ALWAYS covert their neighbours goods. Even economics realises that humans have infinite wants and economics is the most down to earth science of them all.

 

I see how you formed your viewpoint however. Because people have grouped into religions, we harbour petty hates and prejudices against one another and this stops people working together.

 

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this isn't religions fault. It's humanities. By what you're saying, all types of community should be destroyed, in case people begin to form prejudices towards other groups lest they should hinder the progress of humanity.

 

The sad fact is, in my eyes, that humanity cannot and never will pull together into one large happy family. There are always going to be protestors and rebels. The best possible outcome i can see for the future is a world where everyone is mutually respectful of each other, and its IN PEOPLES BEST INTERESTS to get along.

 

Hell, religion is the best humanity can muster towards a global community...

[Xaccers]

If I hold a gun to your head infront of two cupcakes, one pink, one yellow, and tell you that you can choose which ever one you like, but if you choose the pink one, I will kill you, do you really have free choice?

 

Am I being benevolent by alowing you to have that choice?

[FeeFyeFoeFum]

If I hold a gun to your head infront of two cupcakes, one pink, one yellow, and tell you that you can choose which ever one you like, but if you choose the pink one, I will kill you, do you really have free choice?

 

Am I being benevolent by alowing you to have that choice?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not really, just sounds like you work for the Mr.Kippling assassination squad

[ColdZer0]

If I hold a gun to your head infront of two cupcakes, one pink, one yellow, and tell you that you can choose which ever one you like, but if you choose the pink one, I will kill you, do you really have free choice?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

I've been laying low on the more recent debate, but I think you have reached the heart of a very hottly contested philisophical point.

[Chimpy]

First off my background, born and raised Catholic but don't really believe in anything but can't say its all ######. There are parts of most major religions I like and parts that I don't. Now my thoughts on religion.

 

Religion on a long term is one of the best things humans have ever come up with. It brings together social, moral and philisophical thinking in some interesting ways. It provides guidance and a sense of purpose to billions of people worldwide and I think on the whole helps to maintain a steady and balanced society.

 

In the short term it can be seen to cause lots of strife which is a reoccuring theme in history. Another reason why I think it is so important, otherwise we wouldn't use it as a basis for killing one another. However these times of strife often are good for us as a race in general, heralding new ages in science, the arts and even in religious thinking. It's just not that nice if you happen to loose someone to it.

[Ghost_Rider]

If I hold a gun to your head infront of two cupcakes, one pink, one yellow, and tell you that you can choose which ever one you like, but if you choose the pink one, I will kill you, do you really have free choice?

 

Am I being benevolent by alowing you to have that choice?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

If you have a child, would you let him/her airsoft?

 

Would you provide him with instruction, suitable eye protection and clothing?

 

Would you impress upon them the vital importance of obeying the rules, not removing your eye protection, and using your replica in a safe manner?

 

If your child then chooses to ignore you and is injured, have you not done the best you can? You could prevent him from playing altogether, but instead you have provided him/her with the lessons and tools to remain safe but given him the free will to make their choices.

 

That is how I interpret the God and Godess affect humans; They give us the lesson, inform us of the consequences, and then give us the free will to follow or not.

 

That is the action of a benevolent god...

[Xaccers]

 

I've been laying low on the more recent debate, but I think you have reached the heart of a very hottly contested philisophical point.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yup, its one of the biggest problems I have with the bible.

It seems that god is benevolent as long as you do what he says.

[Dougie]

Wouldn't you think that without religion this whole world be even worse will no rules and people living their own ways which would cause even more problems.

 

But as religon has provided so many different rules that will cause definite arguments and continuous problems anyway. With religions which are so alike still argue and disagree with each others religon.

 

I am a christian myself, and i find it so confusing and to be honest with or without religion there are always goin to be problems.

 

In my opinion justice has come from religion

[Joss]

First off my background, born and raised Catholic but don't really believe in anything but can't say its all ######. There are parts of most major religions I like and parts that I don't. Now my thoughts on religion.

 

Religion on a long term is one of the best things humans have ever come up with. It brings together social, moral and philisophical thinking in some interesting ways. It provides guidance and a sense of purpose to billions of people worldwide and I think on the whole helps to maintain a steady and balanced society.

 

In the short term it can be seen to cause lots of strife which is a reoccuring theme in history. Another reason why I think it is so important, otherwise we wouldn't use it as a basis for killing one another. However these times of strife often are good for us as a race in general, heralding new ages in science, the arts and even in religious thinking. It's just not that nice if you happen to loose someone to it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Good point, religion for most people is merely a set of guidelines to live by. Guidelines such as 'be nice to people' or 'dont steal'. Simple things

[Xaccers]

Did you know that the Neandethals were religious?

[Holmes]

d) Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

 

What's your offer? I do everything except for windows and diapers.

 

 

Ok, but really, I just cannot understand why there is all of this hate between other religions. Religion is a beautiful thing, but not when you are murdering children in the name of or, bashing someone else's beliefs because they "aren't correct." Think of it this way, it's exactly like saying The Red Sox are better than the Yankees (which is true ), but it doesn't necessairly mean you are right. I think you should just believe in what you think is right and learn to respect the man, women, or Sledge, that's sitting next to you.

[Hardcore_Mitsuko]

Did you know that the Neandethals were religious?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

True, archaeology has shown that the most common signs of human habitation are settlements, hunting grounds and religious foci.

 

It annoys me when people take the phrase "I'm religious" to mean "I'm a Christian". If I said that to someone who didn't know me, particularly in high school, people would assume I meant I was a die hard Christian rather than someone who believes in Wicca.

[Desolation mkII]

I do think that its fair enough for someone to be against gay marriage, though I dont understand why christians should be when afterall the new testament had a bit on how u can be gay, it was just cut out by martin luther

 

Erm i have heard this come up several times and IIRC martin luther edited the protestant bible so it should still be in the catholic bible if jesus did alow gay marriage.

 

Think of it this way, it's exactly like saying The Red Sox are better than the Yankees (which is true biggrin.gif )

 

That is perhaps the not the best example as statisticaly they may have been proved to be better (i know nothing about baseball). A better example may be saying that guns n roses were better thatn led zeppelin, because that would come down to personal opinion with no real way of proving the best one.

[jay bee]

Valid Argument, its in the Bible. The Bible is the Word of God. I'd call that valid. And it doesn't hurt anyone. Except God. Going against his word probably isn't going to please Him.

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Ah haaa yes, but it is in the old testament, NOT the new testament

[Desolation mkII]

Yes but the new testement is just modifying the old rules, as long as jesus didn't say it was all right then the old testement still aplies.

[Holmes]

Ok, the Yankees Sox rivalry is one of the biggest in the country, and saying that they are better is like saying, your beliefs are wrong.

[Desolation mkII]

oh right ok then.

[Holmes]

Still it isn't the best comparison, I am not an intellectual, but I am smart. Erm, see my point?

[jay bee]

Yes but the new testement is just modifying the old rules, as long as jesus didn't say it was all right then the old testement still aplies.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yes but the issue of homosexuality is a big issue, jesus would surely have addressed it? Or does he not address it because that part of the bible was cut out? Believe it or not Luther actually cut a part out of the bible that said under the covenant of jesus you are allowed to be gay.

[Xaccers]

What's your offer? I do everything except for windows and diapers.

Ok, but really, I just cannot understand why there is all of this hate between other religions. Religion is a beautiful thing, but not when you are murdering children in the name of or, bashing someone else's beliefs because they "aren't correct." Think of it this way, it's exactly like saying The Red Sox are better than the Yankees (which is true  ), but it doesn't necessairly mean you are right. I think you should just believe in what you think is right and learn to respect the man, women, or Sledge, that's sitting next to you.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Because for a lot of people, someone following another religion to yours is the same as them saying you are wrong, but you can't be can you, because it's your religion, and if you were wrong then it would be meaningless, and life would be meaningless, and how would you continue?

You get my drift?

 

Look at how some christians react when you point out that Jesus was Jewish.

He certainly didn't practice many of the things that a lot of christians do, just as a lot of christians don't practice many of the things jesus did.

 

The real problem with people who practice organised religion (mainly in the west) is a lack of real interest in what they are supposed to follow.

Many people who consider themselves christians, or jews, or muslims have never really read their religious books, or of those who have, many have not bothered to look into them deeply. Most people just like to think if they're good, call themselve a christian/jew/muslim/etc then when they die they'll be looked after.

 

When I was in my late teens, I was friends with some Jehovah's Witnesses, and being interested in theology, I asked them what their beliefs were, and ended up having several discussions with one of my friends father.

Some of the things they had been taught by the elders was quite shocking in it's factual inaccuracies.

For instance, they told me that before the flood, there was no rain on earth, plants were watered by sea mists.

Above the earth was a canopy of water, which god made fall for the flood (where are the evil ducks?)

When I asked what kept this canopy up, he confidently proclaimed that the thermosphere (which they said is 3000F, when from what I've found is actually 25C so something got added in the conversion!) kept it up, as heat makes things rise right? That's how hot air baloons work.

And it struck me, that to a lay person who doesn't think about this, that does sound right, hot air balloons go up because of the heat.

But it's not totally true. Hot air in a balloon causes the air particles to become excited and increase their volume, thus making the balloon less dense than the air around it, so it floats above that layer of air until it reaches a level of equally dense air.

So for the thermosphere to keep a canopy of water sufficient enough to flood the world, it would have to keep that water at a density lower than the air below it (which lets face it, that high up is pretty thin).

Then there's the problem of what stops this canopy of highly exited water molecules from evaporating off into space.

He couldn't answer that.

 

Anyway, just noticed gay marriage has been brought up.

Personally I feel that if two homosexuals want to have their relationship recognised by law, then it should be allowed, to give them all the rights that a hetrosexual couple with a legally recognised relationship should have.

I also feel that for it to be recognised religiously, then it should be up to the conrollers of that religion to decide.

 

With regards to the bible (of which the content was specifically chosen at the treaty of nicea so it's not the full story) it states that homosexuality is against gods law.

It also states that murder is too.

Both "crimes" have the punishment of death.

Think of the outcry if the church decreed that murder was no longer a crime in the eyes of thier religion.

So I can understand how christians can be against homosexual acts, yet not be against people who are homosexual (hate the sin, not the sinner)

Just remembered the Today program bit on this issue (couple of years ago on Radio 4) where they got a gay rights activist and a Tory MP (obviously hoping for some sparks) and were rather dissapointed and lost for words when the gay rights activist said all they wanted was the option to have a legal recognition of their relationship so they had the same rights as hetrosexual couples, but not have it called marriage, and the Tory MP totally backed him up

[Pablo]

In my experience, Zen Buddhism has been very helpful.

[ColdZer0]

In my experience, Zen Buddhism has been very helpful.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Zazen meditation was amazingly similar to Catholic Mass, I was really surprised.

 

Stand up, sit down, stand up, sit down, chant in unison.

 

I dug the incense and the pillows though.

[Holmes]

I just still don't understand religion that much because it really isn't a part of my life. I just care about getting home ok everyday and hoping that everyone else is allright. For me, there is no place for religion in my life. If something bad happens, I don't blame god, because I know that he does not interfere with our lives. I don't pray to him because of that. I live for myself and for those who I love and who love me, nothing more, nothing less.