YE MP5

[Sale]

Is that a real picture of you?  I always got a kick out of that one...I feel sorry anyone who ran up against you in the field.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep that's me, although the pic is about 4 years old. Some people have said I look older in that picture than now in real life. I grew some hair to look less menacing, and I have gotten bigger (about 14 kg since that picture).

 

Too bad this thread has grown out of proportion that I find it hard to choose what I should comment - if at all.

 

Personally I don't see how the platform affects the BB _after_ it has left the barrel, because that's when the fps is measured. If the BB is travelling 320 fps, it has the exact same amount of energy no matter what gun shot it and what the barrel length was. Seeing as AEGs can easily create "overhop", there's no question about the effectiveness of their hop up system. Technically the maximum range should be the same for a 320 fps Escort MP5 and a 320 fps AEG. Accuracy may vary depending on which has a better hop up system and other factors, but the BB shouldn't fly any further. I say shouldn't because I might have overlooked something and I haven't witnessed this kind of comparison in person.

 

-Sale

[Hustie]

Bah! Thanks for ruining my fun!

[dynamic_e]

Yep that's me, although the pic is about 4 years old. Some people have said I look older in that picture than now in real life. I grew some hair to look less menacing, and I have gotten bigger (about 14 kg since that picture).

 

Too bad this thread has grown out of proportion that I find it hard to choose what I should comment - if at all.

 

Personally I don't see how the platform affects the BB _after_ it has left the barrel, because that's when the fps is measured. If the BB is travelling 320 fps, it has the exact same amount of energy no matter what gun shot it and what the barrel length was. Seeing as AEGs can easily create "overhop", there's no question about the effectiveness of their hop up system. Technically the maximum range should be the same for a 320 fps Escort MP5 and a 320 fps AEG. Accuracy may vary depending on which has a better hop up system and other factors, but the BB shouldn't fly any further. I say shouldn't because I might have overlooked something and I haven't witnessed this kind of comparison in person.

 

-Sale

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

There is a bit more to bb trajectory besides muzzle velocity. From what i've experienced, and I could be wrong, effective range is based more on the hopup and accuracy is dependant more on the barrel itself. Good examples are LRB based guns shooting 400 with sub par accuracy, but incredible distance or a promethius equipped M14 at stock velocity drastically outshooting a promethius equipped M16 at stock velocity.

 

And don't get me started on the Tanio Koba barrels....

[Dusk]

Thank you sniperx, THAT was the post that sold me. I could not have expected a better response.

 

To tell you the truth, i am all about range. From what i understood is that the hopup on this mp5 was crude. I am used to floating bbs. My most recent gun was a beast, at 375 fps, i was shooting well over 300 feet. How? I had set it up to do so.I guess i just jumped to the conclusion that this was gonna have a hopup like the tm famas which practicaly lobs bbs 100 feet.

 

Why did i ask about 1000 round bursts? Because i know my AEGs can do it.

Your question of asking "why would i fire a real mp5 for 1000 round bursts?" I wouldnt on a real gun but airsoft guns dont shoot nearly as good. Therefore, it is most easy to make up the lack of range and accuracy with pure firepower.

 

And no, i didnt come in hear just to "bash" this gun. If im gonna drop 500 bucks on one gun, i BETTER be SURE its gonna be the best $500 i will spend.

 

Hopup bucking every 50,000 rounds? Are you kidding? And doesnt the gun im LOOKING to buy have a hopup bucking as well? So that means this gun isnt so invincible after all?

[thegunrunner]

So what's the deal about the material the gun is made of? I'm not taking sides, just want an MP5 made of steel.

[lsniperxl]

Dusk: You have a strange way of presenting things...50/50 nic and rude...

 

The hopup chamber is not like that of a Sun Projects, it was developed for the MP5 and is adjustable.

 

The question of volume equals accuracy is a falacy created by misunderstanding real world counter parts. While an AEG does lack range, so does your enemies AEG, you have merely created a 1/5 scale battlefield. Range means nothing when your world is equal. I watched a study on real world accuracy, F/A cannot hit the same man sized target at 50 meters in 30 rounds. How many rounds can you put on target with an AEG in F/A? 65? 100? 300? Thats pretty accurate to me. CUtting through bush. The same study showed various rifles at 10 feet firing through a 4 inch wall of bush with a maxiumum diameter of 1 inch or smaller. ALL rounds were deflected, modified, and keyhold...INCLUDING a 50 cal BMG. Most peoples percieved shortcommings of airsoft are due to their own misconceptions of real world ballistics.

 

Thats fine, I prefer people ask questions. Just come in with an open mind willing to learn.

 

No gun is indestructable. We have some guns at Bandai right on a demonstartion, a Zaku machine gun to be exact. Every month they get roughly 1 million cycles each. They usually come in for work every other month or so. More specifically, I don't see where 50,000 rounds and hopup applied to the Escort MP5. I went through the latest posts and found no reference, I think it was a misunderstanding with an AEG discussion. The hopup rubber is of a a stronger material material than the soft and thin AEG silicone hopups. I do not know the amount of cycles on a hopup, I do know our million count gun had the same hopup in it until it was rebuilt at 900,000.

 

TDS: It is true I did not answer your stupid question regarding an alloy. I searched this thread regarding that information and I did not find it. I cannot address that which I do not have background information on. Without background, I will do my best to explain. I am not a metalurgist, it is entirely possible I made a mistake with this information as I was reserching stainless steel quite recently and talking to the president of Escort about different alloys of brass and their properties. Again, I am not a metalurgist by trade, I am an airsmith.

 

TDS, I'm sorry but your just not smart enough to pull this off. I've gone up against far more brilliant people than you and won. Where are YOUR answers to my questions? Or the replies to the continual perforations in your lies? Just because I'm tired of mucking up a decent thread addressing your slanderous comments doesn't mean I concede to you...it means...I am more interested in getting the public motivated about hyper-realistic blowback guns than addressing some kid who thinks he knows this world better than me.

[lsniperxl]

Gunrunner: The body is made of pressed aluminum (not poured potmetal), the internals are made from CNC'd high grade brass billet. Steel is not necessary in the MP5 due to recommended operating pressures and accompanying FPS. Steel parts CAN be made if you absolutely want them. Brass is used because it has the weight of steel, the maleability (cutting/softness) of alumnium, and a strength between aluminum and steel. Steel is considerabliy more expensive and difficult to machine thus brass is used. Aluminum is avoided for styrength and recoil feel purposes.

[TDS]

TDS:  It is true I did not answer your stupid question regarding an alloy.  I searched this thread regarding that information and I did not find it.  I cannot address that which I do not have background information on.  Without background, I will do my best to explain.  I am not a metalurgist, it is entirely possible I made a mistake with this information as I was reserching stainless steel quite recently and talking to the president of Escort about different alloys of brass and their properties.  Again, I am not a metalurgist by trade, I am an airsmith.

 

here you go, post #76

 

It is made from high-strength brass with a high steel content. It is designed with much thinking toward an LMG.

[Dusk]

Well 50% of the post was ment for you, 50% of the post was ment for austin

 

Ranges are never equal, where i live, we have gun shooting much farther than stock guns, one being TDS kar98 which has roughly 350 feet of range..

 

If i were to run the hopup into the ground... Where would one get a replacement and for how much?

 

How many do you have left.. How much?

[Death By Cadbury]

for the escort MP5 you can order new hopups from AS4L.

 

When you purchase a new mp5 it comes with a few replacements.

[lsniperxl]

TDS...you need to read much more carefully. I said...where in THIS thread did I mention a steel alloy. On top of you you bring in a completely unrelated gun, the M60 project, into the debate. You're really not very bright are you? I already admitted not being a student of the ancient art of metallurgy. The brass used is high grade brass. End of story.

 

 

Dusk: Thanks for keeping with topic here.

 

Thats absolutely correct. It wouldn't be right for an 8mm Mauser round (real) to fire the same distance as a 9mm Para would in real life. Thus he's carrying a sniper rifle and you have an SMG...each has its advantages and disadvantages. Whether you knew it or not, you've been playing on a scale replica of a real war. Where you get discrepencies are when one person has a stock M16 and another has it at 400fps...then you're breaking the balistic rules and everything goes out the window anyway...grab a box mag.

 

There are some provided with each set for your use. Extras are avilable from Escort or AS4L (Although often AS4L has to order them from us and you've defeated the purpose of buying locally). They are cheap and plentiful so theres no need to worry about that. It takes a lot to destroy one of these hopups with even abusive use.

 

We make them on an as needed basis right now as we have several projects coming quickly upon us. They are 636.00usd shipped anywhere in the US (shipping is same from Hawaii to Maine...even though they are more than a continents width apart...go figure). 11usd more to Europe. All precautions are taken when shipping to the US including orange tips and trade coverage (both simply removable with the proper and simple knowledge).

[AustinWolv]

Sale, faster backspin at the same muzzle velocity as the BB leaves the barrel results in flatter, longer flight.

 

  one being TDS kar98 which has roughly 350 feet of range.. 

Would love to see this gun and what was done to it. I had a Kar98, and no way did it do 350feet. Nice little shooter though. Wish my AICS was shooting as well as it did. Off-topic though.

[snorkelman]

picked used one up from panzer (chris) This one has a few niggles on it

 

1 fire select is giving me safe on appropriate setting but auto on everything else (including the semi setting)

 

I've looked briefly at trigger group but nothing seems obviously amiss, just wonderig if theres something Im missing when looking at it, or wether it should be set in a particular setting at reassembly of upper and lower (again doesnt look likely)?

 

2 sometimes missfires and then (lightly) vents gas on each trigger pull afterwards until manually recocked Cycles fine without a mag in though so Im just wondering if its a misfeed/bb jam thats gettign cleared by recocking it manually?

 

Mag i was using to give it a whirl was a stock TM locap which doesnt feel all that positve in terms of locating (star lowcap supplied with it is a lot more solid - far less play with it both side to side and forwards backwards)

 

3 cocking lever has around 10 to 15mm of free travel at front before it begins to bite? not a major issue in itsself (I only mention in case its symptomatic of something else internally being misaligned?)

[AustinWolv]

fire select is giving me safe on appropriate setting but auto on everything else (including the semi setting)

What pressure are you running at? That is one of the symptoms of running at too low of a pressure.

 

so Im just wondering if its a misfeed/bb jam thats gettign cleared by recocking it manually?

Yep.

[Crispin1025]

Sale, faster backspin at the same muzzle velocity as the BB leaves the barrel results in flatter, longer flight.

 

  Would love to see this gun and what was done to it.  I had a Kar98, and no way did it do 350feet.  Nice little shooter though.  Wish my AICS was shooting as well as it did.  Off-topic though.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I have not seen it, but have talked to TDS about it. He replaced/hand upgraded almost every part.

 

Cheers,

Daniel

[Crispin1025]

The question of volume equals accuracy is a falacy created by misunderstanding real world counter parts.  While an AEG does lack range, so does your enemies AEG, you have merely created a 1/5 scale battlefield.  Range means nothing when your world is equal.  I watched a study on real world accuracy, F/A cannot hit the same man sized target at 50 meters in 30 rounds.  How many rounds can you put on target with an AEG in F/A?  65?  100?  300?  Thats pretty accurate to me.  CUtting through bush.  The same study showed various rifles at 10 feet firing through a 4 inch wall of bush with a maxiumum diameter of 1 inch or smaller.  ALL rounds were deflected, modified, and keyhold...INCLUDING a 50 cal BMG.  Most peoples percieved shortcommings of airsoft are due to their own misconceptions of real world ballistics.

 

Thats fine, I prefer people ask questions.  Just come in with an open mind willing to learn.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Could you send me the information on the study?

 

Are you sniperx from CA.net? (Is that you Paul?)

 

Cheers,

Daniel

[snorkelman]

What pressure are you running at?  That is one of the symptoms of running at too low of a pressure.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

have had reg set from 100 to 120 psi but symptom persists

 

is it a caseof pressure too low bolt not cycling fully and and thus doesnt trip the trigger dislocator in semi? (just trying to visualise why the tigger isnt disconnecting as the trigger group does seem to function when lower is off the gun)

[AustinWolv]

I have not seen it, but have talked to TDS about it.  He  replaced/hand upgraded almost every part.

 

Cheers,

Daniel

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Call me a skeptic.

 

have had reg set from 100 to 120 psi but symptom persists

 

is it a caseof pressure too low bolt not cycling fully and and thus doesnt trip the trigger dislocator in semi? (just trying to visualise why the tigger isnt disconnecting as the trigger group does seem to function when lower is off the gun)

Yep. That pressure should be good to go though. sniperx can speak to the fix, as I'm away from home with nothing to reference.

[snorkelman]

Yep.  That pressure should be good to go though.  sniperx can speak to the fix, as I'm away from home with nothing to reference.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

cheers I've dropped it back down to mid ground of 105 -110 and i'll keep my grubby mits off of it in the mean time

 

stevie

[snorkelman]

if i take the front of the two receiver pins out (the one just behind the magwell) and push the lower receiver up a mm higher at the front (to point where you can see the top of the brass insert the receiver pin goes thru) then the gun fires in semi when set to semi every time

 

If i tilt the lower receiver back down a mm or so at front to where it should be so the pin can fit back thru the hole its back to full auto every shot..

 

PSI is just around 105 and gun is chronoing 288 with .25 bbs and is even getting best part of 100+ rounds from a basic teeny 12g CO2 caplet I hooked up to the palmers reg (and with a decent amount of kick)

 

skimmed the brass spacer in the mag catch and its gripping marui mags a lot tighter now No more misfeeds or ventng over a couple of mags worth of bbs. so by looks of it (unless Im missing something) the only thing left in need of a permanent fix on this one is the semi auto cut off

 

Im tempted just to skip round it and cut a new semi dislocator with a slightly higher profile than the original as path of least resistance (well, provided the issue isnt symptomatic of something deeper i should get looked at)

[lsniperxl]

Let me talk to the boss and see if this problem is one of the past. Worst comes to worst, I'll send you a new semi-autolatch.

[snorkelman]

cheers muchly

[Sale]

Sale, faster backspin at the same muzzle velocity as the BB leaves the barrel results in flatter, longer flight.

Yes, and too much backspin will make it curve up. Any AEG can achieve this. How come some guns (LRB-equipped classics, or this new Escort MP5) shoot further, if they do?

 

I have a theory about this: Depending how the sight is set for elevation, you can alter the point of impact of the BB (well, duh). If you adjust the BBs shoot low, you can use more hop up because the BB will initially go down, and then up. If you adjust the rear sight for a long distance, you can use less hop up. LRBs shoot the BB down because it's at an angle, so the BB can have quite some backspin without flying too much over the line of sight.

 

This is the only thing I could come up with. I'm quite certain that the BB doesn't "know" what gun shot it, so if the muzzle velocity is the same and hop up is adjusted so the trajectory is flat, it doesn't matter range-wise if the gun is an MP5K or PSG-1. Accuracy is a different thing, but I'm only talking about the length of the flight path.

 

-Sale

[lsniperxl]

Sale: from the tests we've done, there are no abberations in the initial flight path.

 

My theory is:

 

The spin on an AEG fired BB runs out sooner than fired by an LRB based gun. My findings are that a LRB often has a curve UP at the end of its trajectory due to the loss of forward momentum and the continued rotation of the BB. This also explains the AEGs dropping and the LRBs floating effects at long range. Think about it. An LRB hops up the BB right to the very end of the barrel, spinning faster and faster as it goes. The AEG BB is spun once and is contstantly decelaretd by its own nature and friction/bouncing in the barrel. While these two difference may be minute, when compounded by the velocity and time in air, the differences are measured in miliseconds...which can be translated into individual feet.

 

This is only a theory, and until I can get 100% info from Sheriff that where it will remain. As to IF they actually get the range stated....BBmagnets sterling is a prime example...300 feet every time. This is not a marketing ploy or inflation of facts...it has dropped many a "safe" player to their knees at that range.

[lsniperxl]

Snorkel: Just talked with the boss, there could be a couple minor things going on. We could go back and forth on it all day...this could range from shipping problems, to manufacturing problem, to first user error. To make things easier all around, we're sending you a new grip, selectore, and fire control assembly. Thats the entire unit outside to inside. Theres no need to send yours back immediately or even ever (although it would be nice to have to diagnose a possible future issue a customer might have). There is no charge for this...shipping or payment. At most it would be appreciated if the problematic one was returned for diagnostics. This will be out a couple days after I recieve your address by email.