sc0rp10n Posted September 29, 2007 Report Share Posted September 29, 2007 I have been trying for the past month to no avail to stop my VSR from hooking shots to the right with HOP turned on. I've tried many things so I'll list them to keep it simple. First the base parts used - Custom K2 SS cylinder set - 193m/s (630ft/s) TM Pro sniper outer barrel KA 290mm Suppressor TM hop chamber Prometheus(Laylax) Soft type packing Prometheus(Laylax) 555mm 6.03mm H-hop black spacer KSC .30g Straight .43g BEFORE ANYONE POSTS "IT'S THE SUPPRESSOR" - THE SHOTS HOOK WITH OR WITHOUT THE SUPPRESSOR ATTACHED. Now for what's been done - The rocker arm in hop chamber had to be modified to hold a spacer as it originally had two fingers pushing down on the packing. This simply did not give enough pressure to overcome the FPS the rifle puts out. I have tried using normal rubber spacers(Guarder, TM, Prometheus), but these don't provide enough pressure either. I have cleaned the barrel and also run a level on it to check for any bends. None were found nor was it dirty at all. I've tried washed and unwashed BBs of the two type listed above and both do exactly the same thing. I've tried making my custom "ink tube" spacer as I recommended in an earlier thread on these forums and that spacer does exactly the same a the H-hop. I am seeking any advice as to why my shots hook right sharply at 230-250ft every time. Again if I take hop off I can fire dead zero out to 150ft, but that defeats the purpose of this rifle. Any and all ideas are welcome I have many tools on hand and can construct most anything I need short of CNC work. Please if anyone has any ideas I am starving for some new hope! Link to post Share on other sites
w733commando Posted September 29, 2007 Report Share Posted September 29, 2007 Is there a difference depending on what weight of BB you use? I would expect very heavy ones to fly straighter. Link to post Share on other sites
TDS Posted September 29, 2007 Report Share Posted September 29, 2007 your hopup, outer/inner barrel, or nozzle are misaligned, mostly likely its your hopup spacer Link to post Share on other sites
Stealthbomber Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 If the BBs are flying straight with no hop and curving with hop I guess it's a no-brainer that the hop-up is causing the problem. About the only thing not (directly) hop-up related might be if the barrel is slightly twisted inside the hop-up chamber, thus stopping the hop applying evenly. Link to post Share on other sites
ertgunner Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 i think it is 1) hop up unit is in outer barrel there slightly off center 2) inner barrel is slightly off center in hop unit 3) H nub set in there incorrectly 4) bulking damaged Link to post Share on other sites
Tsuru Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 I think your problem is right here: Prometheus(Laylax) Soft type packing Given your power output level (600+ FPS) you need to be using a harder bucking. Your soft bucking is probably being warped with the amount of power your rifle is producing and therefore is throwing your shots off. Link to post Share on other sites
sc0rp10n Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Thanks for all the ideas! I've been able to check the following - Inner barrel is NOT bent or twisted Inner barrel is seated PROPERLY in the hop unit Packing is the ONLY type laylax makes for the barrel I have and other people use it at 600fps WITHOUT PROBLEMS Packing is NOT damaged H-hop spacer was swapped out for normal spacer and also a custom solid resin cast spacer neither EFFECTED the right hook Again thanks for the help. I'm going to keep making adjustments, but I think there is something I must be missing. Link to post Share on other sites
scithe Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 wow, not much else it could be then really.... have you tried simply stripping down the entire gun to the last screw and then cleaning and lubing everything? i did that to mine when it had the same problem as yours and the problem just seamed to disappear. Link to post Share on other sites
sirrith Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Whats to stop you from using other hop packings? You're using the barrel in the original TM hop chamber, which means it is exactly like other aftermarket (and original) vsr barrels, is it not? I would say its probably your hopup rubber. Try using the original TM hopup arm with a firefly HARD v-bucking, and see if that makes it any better. Link to post Share on other sites
sc0rp10n Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 I'll try that next, thanks for the help. And scithe, what's the creature you have in your Avatar? Link to post Share on other sites
scithe Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 o, lol. that is my sugar glider, geto. they are strange little marsupials Link to post Share on other sites
sirrith Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 You're very welcome. I'm going to be watching this topic Haven't heard of a problem like yours before, haha, might be something new to learn from it. Good luck with the fix. edit: oh, and im no expert, but it looks sort of like a pygmy possum re-edit: looks like i was right about not being an expert Link to post Share on other sites
TDS Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 It must be jesus then, he wills your bb's to hook Link to post Share on other sites
TheBauer Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Ay, Get the firefly HARD hop rubber (V version) Use the tm hop adjustment no spacer bollacks. wrap in some PFTE tape (this allows you to get more hop adjustment, without distorting the hop rubber) Link to post Share on other sites
greg Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 The fire fly hop is definitely worth a try. Tbh, it's worth having any way. When you say 'hooks to the right', is it more of a 'clockwise corkscrew'? I know you are sure that it's not the barrel, but, do you experience the exact same problem with another barrel?? I ask because I had the problem I describe with a 555. At first I thought it was a right hand hook, but further observation revealed that it was a fairly predictable clockwise corkscrew. I checked everything to no avail. Switched to a 430 & the problem went. This caused me to try another lalax 555. Guess what? Different 555,,,,,,,,,same problem! So for a while I stayed with the 430. I couldn't return the 555 & didn't want to sell it on ('cos it was no good). So, eventually, I thought I'd try out my theory about optimum length & cut it back to 480mm. Do a search for details because this not only solved the corkscrew problem, but also gave better accuracy & fps than the 430!! Greg. Link to post Share on other sites
sc0rp10n Posted October 1, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 I've ordered the firefly packing and two new H-hops kits, so I'll see if that helps. greg - Your theory is very intereting, so intersting in fact that i got the camera and tripod out and taped my shots. Guess what, you're totally correct, it's a clockwise "twist" on the round that terminates exactly as you described. I've no idea why I didn't think of that in the first place. I'm going to install the new H-hop and the firefly packing this weekend. If that isn't the solution I'm getting the chop saw out Thanks again for all the help everyone! Of all the forums I've posted on this one always has the most ideas. Link to post Share on other sites
thewallhitme Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 are you sure that when you are firing the rifle it is perfectly vertical? by that i mean the rifle isnt leaning over to one side. this has happened to my friend with his pistol, his shots kept curving away because he was leaning the gun over a tiny bit. Link to post Share on other sites
he's in the bushes!!! Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 i'm having a similar problem with my g-spec its been upgraded to 5xxfps or there abouts when you fire you can watch it through the scope it enters at the bottom left then curves round to the right before exiting towards the top right hand corner it doesnt seem to matter if the hopup is on or off i might give zero one a bell tomoro seen as i bought it off them Link to post Share on other sites
greg Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 Softers are REALLY subject to wind. Especialy beyond 30m where the bb starts to slow & rely on the back spin from the hop to keep it going. Even the slightest left to right breeze would cause what you are describing. A few inches of windage with your evo could be feet or even yards with your vsr. Obviously check by firing from your target back to your original firing position. If the wind is kind enough to remain constant you will observe the opposite (or not) & confirm if it's the gun. If you've done this trick already, then I'd try swapping out the barrel & hop. Check exactly what Z1 did for you. If they did barrel/hop perhaps they would be good enough to 'straighten it out'. Greg. Link to post Share on other sites
he's in the bushes!!! Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 it was a still day when i fired it i know a bb gun will never be as accurate as me eve (that thing puts pellet on top of pellet at 50 yards) but this think looks like a david beckham free kick everytime i fire i've seen people get A4 size groups at 50 yards but this thing is curling that bad my shot grouping is roughly 4 meters at 25 yards i have a second barrel its longer than the g-spec one infact i'm probably gonna have to trim it to get in to not stick out the silencer too but i was meaning to put a longer barrel in anyway Link to post Share on other sites
Dodge Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 Might sound like I'm asking stupid questions but is your rifle scoped? Usually for any hooks or bends that take place is as a result of a scope not being mounted level (for right hand bend it usually means that the left side is too low). Post if it is scoped and I can offer a potential remedy.... apologies a bit short on time at the moment. Link to post Share on other sites
sc0rp10n Posted October 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 To the guys who've posted recently, I am an avid firearms owner as well as an airsofter so I know how to fire a weapon level. I also have a bench to lock my rifles onto. And I also know how to mount and zero a scope. And more importantly this hasn't been happening since day one, for about a week after I installed the barrel and packing it was shooting perfectly level and straight. I had a 4in grouping at 250ft every time. Thanks for the ideas, but let's stick to Airsoft concerns for now, I'll post again when I have the new parts installed and before I cut down the barrel(if that's actually needed). Link to post Share on other sites
sirrith Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 If it was shooting straight before, then deteriorated after a while, don't bother cutting the barrel, its to do with your hopup, most likely the bucking, as yours is a soft one. Link to post Share on other sites
he's in the bushes!!! Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 yup i'm using a scope an ags swat 3-12x44 to be precise the scope appears to be level and straight according to my scope spirits and the base's are firmly clamped in place i've put the longer barrel on and fron what i can tell so far this has improved it i'm still getting a rather inaccurate gruoping though (about 6 inch) at 10 yards the rifle is new (less than a week old) it has been upgraded to 5xxfps and at the mo i've only got the .25 ammunition i should have some .3's on order soon though but surely this should be that inaccurate also when i cock the gun if the hopup isnt on the bb's roll out the end of the barrel Link to post Share on other sites
thewallhitme Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 the thing about the bb rolling out happens to me occasionally. i dont think its a "problem" as such, more of a design flaw-ish... Link to post Share on other sites
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